RE: BMW M2: Review
Discussion
Ares said:
NDNDNDND said:
hufggfg said:
Sorry, I should have been more clear, what I mean is "the ultimate driver's car within the sector". It of course doesn't compare with real stripped out sports cars, but for what it is (4 seat, comfortable, daily useable) then they are very much targeting the "driver's" end of the market.
Or rather it's aimed at people who *think* they're at the "drivers'" end of the market, but actually prefer fake engine noise and don't know how to change gear.What do *real* *drivers* *buy*?
Probably trying to doggedly keep a geriatric E36 alive, while muttering things about cable throttles and clutch delay valves under their breath.
HighwayStar said:
NDNDNDND said:
hufggfg said:
Sorry, I should have been more clear, what I mean is "the ultimate driver's car within the sector". It of course doesn't compare with real stripped out sports cars, but for what it is (4 seat, comfortable, daily useable) then they are very much targeting the "driver's" end of the market.
Or rather it's aimed at people who *think* they're at the "drivers'" end of the market, but actually prefer fake engine noise and don't know how to change gear.NDNDNDND said:
HighwayStar said:
NDNDNDND said:
hufggfg said:
Sorry, I should have been more clear, what I mean is "the ultimate driver's car within the sector". It of course doesn't compare with real stripped out sports cars, but for what it is (4 seat, comfortable, daily useable) then they are very much targeting the "driver's" end of the market.
Or rather it's aimed at people who *think* they're at the "drivers'" end of the market, but actually prefer fake engine noise and don't know how to change gear.NDNDNDND said:
HighwayStar said:
NDNDNDND said:
hufggfg said:
Sorry, I should have been more clear, what I mean is "the ultimate driver's car within the sector". It of course doesn't compare with real stripped out sports cars, but for what it is (4 seat, comfortable, daily useable) then they are very much targeting the "driver's" end of the market.
Or rather it's aimed at people who *think* they're at the "drivers'" end of the market, but actually prefer fake engine noise and don't know how to change gear.
Lots of cars are pumping noise into the cab through the speakers, not just BMW. I have no idea what it sounds like in reality but plenty of owners have said they can't tell. It's not obvious. Me, I'd try it out first and then decide. Rev matching is on the down changes only. Turned off in Sport+ which also turns off the stability control. Did you read that too? Sounds like something that should be right up the street of the hero you obviously are. You can do it all, heel and toe while valiantly keeping it out the hedges and ditches as you go. Vanity... Hmmm. I seen people in all kinds of cars every day and you know what... I never wonder why they bought them, I couldn't care less.
PHMatt said:
AOK said:
No programmable M button(s) on the steering wheel, as featured on M3, M4, M5, M6, X5M, X6M etc. Even the 1M had this.
That's great. Get in car. Drive car. WIN.
NDNDNDND said:
HighwayStar said:
NDNDNDND said:
hufggfg said:
Sorry, I should have been more clear, what I mean is "the ultimate driver's car within the sector". It of course doesn't compare with real stripped out sports cars, but for what it is (4 seat, comfortable, daily useable) then they are very much targeting the "driver's" end of the market.
Or rather it's aimed at people who *think* they're at the "drivers'" end of the market, but actually prefer fake engine noise and don't know how to change gear.
But then if all you can whinge about is the (allegedly) fake noise and the rev matching (neither of which make the car more/less fun to drive), it must be a f*ckng great car.
Ares said:
Yes, because all the reviews have said the M2 isn't in any way fun.
But then if all you can whinge about is the (allegedly) fake noise and the rev matching (neither of which make the car more/less fun to drive), it must be a f*ckng great car.
If the rev-matching and fake noise don't impinge on your idea of 'fun' then it must be perfect for you, but both of these make me feel faintly nauseous.But then if all you can whinge about is the (allegedly) fake noise and the rev matching (neither of which make the car more/less fun to drive), it must be a f*ckng great car.
I did say before it sounds like a great car, and theoretically something I'd love, but the formula appears to have been soured by a couple of really crappy ideas: fake engine noise and enforced rev-matching on both up and down shifts (unless you forgo the stability control, which is supposedly so well implemented that turning it off on the roads is a folly).
kambites said:
cerb4.5lee said:
I appreciate that I am stuck in the past but looking at the weight of all these cars just makes me pretty sad and crash protection and mod cons certainly have a lot to answer for in diluting the driving experience.
You must be stuck a very long way into the past - this is very similar in terms of dimensions and weight to the E36 M3. With the exception of the E30 M-cars have never been particularly light. NDNDNDND said:
Ares said:
Yes, because all the reviews have said the M2 isn't in any way fun.
But then if all you can whinge about is the (allegedly) fake noise and the rev matching (neither of which make the car more/less fun to drive), it must be a f*ckng great car.
If the rev-matching and fake noise don't impinge on your idea of 'fun' then it must be perfect for you, but both of these make me feel faintly nauseous.But then if all you can whinge about is the (allegedly) fake noise and the rev matching (neither of which make the car more/less fun to drive), it must be a f*ckng great car.
I did say before it sounds like a great car, and theoretically something I'd love, but the formula appears to have been soured by a couple of really crappy ideas: fake engine noise and enforced rev-matching on both up and down shifts (unless you forgo the stability control, which is supposedly so well implemented that turning it off on the roads is a folly).
HighwayStar said:
NDNDNDND said:
Ares said:
Yes, because all the reviews have said the M2 isn't in any way fun.
But then if all you can whinge about is the (allegedly) fake noise and the rev matching (neither of which make the car more/less fun to drive), it must be a f*ckng great car.
If the rev-matching and fake noise don't impinge on your idea of 'fun' then it must be perfect for you, but both of these make me feel faintly nauseous.But then if all you can whinge about is the (allegedly) fake noise and the rev matching (neither of which make the car more/less fun to drive), it must be a f*ckng great car.
I did say before it sounds like a great car, and theoretically something I'd love, but the formula appears to have been soured by a couple of really crappy ideas: fake engine noise and enforced rev-matching on both up and down shifts (unless you forgo the stability control, which is supposedly so well implemented that turning it off on the roads is a folly).
NDNDNDND said:
Ares said:
Yes, because all the reviews have said the M2 isn't in any way fun.
But then if all you can whinge about is the (allegedly) fake noise and the rev matching (neither of which make the car more/less fun to drive), it must be a f*ckng great car.
If the rev-matching and fake noise don't impinge on your idea of 'fun' then it must be perfect for you, but both of these make me feel faintly nauseous.But then if all you can whinge about is the (allegedly) fake noise and the rev matching (neither of which make the car more/less fun to drive), it must be a f*ckng great car.
I did say before it sounds like a great car, and theoretically something I'd love, but the formula appears to have been soured by a couple of really crappy ideas: fake engine noise and enforced rev-matching on both up and down shifts (unless you forgo the stability control, which is supposedly so well implemented that turning it off on the roads is a folly).
If your notion of rev matching (which hell/toe was intended for, and Ferraris have had for a generation or 2) is a crappy idea and would put you off, then I suggest you are looking for reasons. As I say, thats all that puts you off, you are cutting your nose off to spite your face.
Piped in noise is wholly undetectable. Mine has it, with it deactivated there is no difference. Ditto the M4. It's an issue people love you whinge about yet most have probably never sampled it and realised what a case of Emperors New Clothes it is.
NDNDNDND said:
HighwayStar said:
NDNDNDND said:
Ares said:
Yes, because all the reviews have said the M2 isn't in any way fun.
But then if all you can whinge about is the (allegedly) fake noise and the rev matching (neither of which make the car more/less fun to drive), it must be a f*ckng great car.
If the rev-matching and fake noise don't impinge on your idea of 'fun' then it must be perfect for you, but both of these make me feel faintly nauseous.But then if all you can whinge about is the (allegedly) fake noise and the rev matching (neither of which make the car more/less fun to drive), it must be a f*ckng great car.
I did say before it sounds like a great car, and theoretically something I'd love, but the formula appears to have been soured by a couple of really crappy ideas: fake engine noise and enforced rev-matching on both up and down shifts (unless you forgo the stability control, which is supposedly so well implemented that turning it off on the roads is a folly).
Your a presumptuous fellow aren't you. I'll answer your question. No, how I look in a car is not important to me. Facebook, I have an account but I'm one of those people who doesn't use it. I haven't posted anything on it in yearssss. Never posted a pic of any car, past or present, on it. Can you say the same?
Also if you'd read my earlier comments you know what car I'm looking at next, and it's not the M2!
I honestly don't know what most people here are smoking. It has been reviewed by most of the worlds top motoring press on track in M DCT spec and on local roads around Laguna Sec in Manual spec. Everyone has loved the car, giving it either 4, 4.5 or 5 out of 5! That's pretty incredible. The weight has been mentioned in a number of reviews, but no one has said that it spoils the drive. The rev matching has also been mentioned, but again no one has said that it spoils the drive. No one that reviewed it has commented negatively about the synthesised sound (which many cars use).
Why the hate?!
Why the hate?!
Ares said:
Piped in noise is wholly undetectable. Mine has it, with it deactivated there is no difference. Ditto the M4. It's an issue people love you whinge about yet most have probably never sampled it and realised what a case of Emperors New Clothes it is.
Sorry not wanting to add fuel to the fire but I've sampled the piped in noise on an M4 and it's horrid to the point that after 15 mins in it, that's all I could hear. It's one of thos once heard, you can't un-hear it type scenarios.. There was even a whole PH article on it so lots of people obviously feel the same way. What makes it even more weird is that when people finally worked out a relatively easy way turn it off, the car sounds much better so not really sure why BMW feel the need to do it tbh.NDNDNDND said:
Nothing you'd approve of. None of them are remotely valuable, two of them have no power-steering and none have bluetooth.
They sound like fun, what are they? I'm not a car snob, I like loads of things that are worth practically nothing.I get what you're saying, would I prefer a car without the pumped in sound? absolutely. Would I rather the rev-matching was completely switchable? of course. There are lots of other things I'd rather as well, such as a NA engine, and hydraulic steering, but I get that manufacturers don't make a car for just me, they make one for a huge number of people with different wants/needs (and in difficult regulatory framework), but within that spectrum, the M2 seems to be much more closely targeted to those of us who actually like to drive!
Don't get me wrong, there are lots of other cars that are better, but for me the M2 would be the daily, not the weekend toy. So having some luxuries are useful and I don't begrudge others for wanting them.
I'm probably unusual in this on PH but I quite like the principle of piped in sound if they can do it properly.
Cars should be as near to silent as possible on the outside IMO, I don't want to be woken up by other people's engines or to worry about waking up my neighbours when I leave for work. However, if the manufacturers can make them sound good inside I don't really see a downside as long as it's switchable. It adds no weight (assuming the car already has a stereo) so it's harmless from a driving point of view. Of course there's a significant "if" in all of that - the systems I've experienced have been pretty dire.
Cars should be as near to silent as possible on the outside IMO, I don't want to be woken up by other people's engines or to worry about waking up my neighbours when I leave for work. However, if the manufacturers can make them sound good inside I don't really see a downside as long as it's switchable. It adds no weight (assuming the car already has a stereo) so it's harmless from a driving point of view. Of course there's a significant "if" in all of that - the systems I've experienced have been pretty dire.
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