Should winter tyres be made compulsory in the UK?
Poll: Should winter tyres be made compulsory in the UK?
Total Members Polled: 486
Discussion
sb-1 said:
GTIR said:
No
I've quite enjoyed driving around lots of drivers, a couple of RR sports also, and don't think it would be fair if everyone had them. I have to have some enjoyment!
Just a point to note. If you have winter tyres you will nit be using your summer tyres so no extra expense, apart from new rims unless you take them off and replace them.
I have run winter tyres for three years. Michelin Aplin's.
Are you saying you run winter tyres all year then?I've quite enjoyed driving around lots of drivers, a couple of RR sports also, and don't think it would be fair if everyone had them. I have to have some enjoyment!
Just a point to note. If you have winter tyres you will nit be using your summer tyres so no extra expense, apart from new rims unless you take them off and replace them.
I have run winter tyres for three years. Michelin Aplin's.
JR said:
sb-1 said:
GTIR said:
No
I've quite enjoyed driving around lots of drivers, a couple of RR sports also, and don't think it would be fair if everyone had them. I have to have some enjoyment!
Just a point to note. If you have winter tyres you will nit be using your summer tyres so no extra expense, apart from new rims unless you take them off and replace them.
I have run winter tyres for three years. Michelin Aplin's.
Are you saying you run winter tyres all year then?I've quite enjoyed driving around lots of drivers, a couple of RR sports also, and don't think it would be fair if everyone had them. I have to have some enjoyment!
Just a point to note. If you have winter tyres you will nit be using your summer tyres so no extra expense, apart from new rims unless you take them off and replace them.
I have run winter tyres for three years. Michelin Aplin's.
TedMaul said:
F i F said:
To which I'll reply someone who drives like a c
k will still drive like a ck regardless.
This is true. Was going up v steep hill, 1 in 2, covered in snow/sleet with traffic lights at top. Was going slowly waiting for lights to change so I didn't have to bring car to standstill. Could see car actually at lights slipping and struggling. Car behind me, sat on bumper all the way up hill... common sense ain't so common.k will still drive like a ck regardless.
More sensibly, unlike many other countries, larger land masses and even Islands, here in the UK generally there are no clearly defined seasons ~ they can all occur in a 24 hour period here at any time on any day. Even during the exceptionally long and hot summers in the mid 170s ( 75-76 IIRC ) we had a light snow covering on the Cotswold hills nearby in early June, none of which hills exceed 1000 feet ( 300 metres ) in elevation at their highest points. Corresponding with enthusiasts in other countries, some talk about when the snows come and can almost predict the date ~ that includes even in japan ~ a similar Island group just off a large land mass. Another friend over from the States hired a Morgan two seater and toured the local countryside in our winter with the hood ( not bonnet ... soft top ) down driving in just a T-shirt. It was bluddy cold and when I suggested he ought to wear some heavier clothes against the cold, he laughed and said back home in Vermont, there was two metres of snow and over here, winter felt like spring.
It's all relative...
As a boy in the 1950s, the distinctive sounds of snow chains on passing vehicles was almost a daily event some winters ~ cannot remember last time that happened here. Fifty years ago I guess.
Modern cars and their gizmos have improved enormously in the meantime.... outsripping driving standards which I feel is partly responsible for what we have all been observing over the past few weeks. Some real numbnuts out there. Also partly due to the fact that cars are far too easy to drive nowadays and thus completely isolate many drivers with less motoring 'nouse' from reality ... literally. That isolation is the danger ~ black ice ~ unaware ~ yeah right ~ that's OK then, you're excused...
Lost in the mists of time, the OP's original question was something along the lines of seeking opinion on the merits of compulsion in using winter tyres.
Compulsion feels like it's a way off - after all (the reasonably-learned contributions of all but the mouth-breathers on this thread aside), there's a huge comprehension gap to be resolved first in terms of why modern(-ish) cars don't seem to work in poor conditions.
Just last week, I had to help some poor taxi driver (04-plate Avensis) stuck on a, frankly, level part of our business's car park, simply because his summer tyres on the front wheels couldn't get enough traction to overcome the inertia of the dead-weight of the stationary car. I even had a go at driving it myself, including turning it off, sticking it in 1st gear and trying to get it moving by cranking the starter. In the end, we pushed him as our shoes/boots had greater traction than his tyres. Tried to explain to him what was wrong, but, well, you know how it is......
We have a (proper) Rangie in the family which came new with Pirelli Scorpion Zero tyres. Yes, okay, traction is better than 2wd, but it's horrific in slush/snow on the mway and braking on the level is, er, rubbish. Winter tyres going on that as well next week.
As for the rest of a cold-ish winter but minus the snow? Well, just being able to pull out at T-junctions in typical Nov-Mar slippy conditions; winter tyres have transformed the RWD cars in the family.
But, of course, I'm such a poor driver so I need these tools.
Compulsion feels like it's a way off - after all (the reasonably-learned contributions of all but the mouth-breathers on this thread aside), there's a huge comprehension gap to be resolved first in terms of why modern(-ish) cars don't seem to work in poor conditions.
Just last week, I had to help some poor taxi driver (04-plate Avensis) stuck on a, frankly, level part of our business's car park, simply because his summer tyres on the front wheels couldn't get enough traction to overcome the inertia of the dead-weight of the stationary car. I even had a go at driving it myself, including turning it off, sticking it in 1st gear and trying to get it moving by cranking the starter. In the end, we pushed him as our shoes/boots had greater traction than his tyres. Tried to explain to him what was wrong, but, well, you know how it is......
We have a (proper) Rangie in the family which came new with Pirelli Scorpion Zero tyres. Yes, okay, traction is better than 2wd, but it's horrific in slush/snow on the mway and braking on the level is, er, rubbish. Winter tyres going on that as well next week.
As for the rest of a cold-ish winter but minus the snow? Well, just being able to pull out at T-junctions in typical Nov-Mar slippy conditions; winter tyres have transformed the RWD cars in the family.
But, of course, I'm such a poor driver so I need these tools.
sparks_E39 said:
No they shouldn't, I can't afford a new set of tyres for 2 or 3 weeks of bad weather, it would be £400 plus on my car for anything decent.
http://www.tyresafe.org/news-and-events/detail/saf...Edited by AndyG-ZTT on Tuesday 12th January 00:13
Hat tip to Quentin Willson on BBC Breakfast time this morning.
nd of a discussion alongside police re leaving vehicles unattended whilst keys in and engine ticking over on warm up. Which led on to some quite reasonable advice from Count Quentula on driving techniques.
Final question from dopy bint presenter, "So should we be buying chains"
QW said it wasn't a good idea and woffled something at which point the silly tart cut him off and was about to go to next item when QW butted in with
nd of a discussion alongside police re leaving vehicles unattended whilst keys in and engine ticking over on warm up. Which led on to some quite reasonable advice from Count Quentula on driving techniques.
Final question from dopy bint presenter, "So should we be buying chains"
QW said it wasn't a good idea and woffled something at which point the silly tart cut him off and was about to go to next item when QW butted in with
Count Quentula said:
You can buy snow tyres, they are about £50 each and really are very good
I think that comment, such as it is, is the only mention I've seen or heard on MSM. Much more news mileage in it's all the fault of two flakes of snow not the equipment people have and the way they are trying to use it.GTIR said:
Herbs said:
[
what about when you change your car every year?
Then you're either very wealthy and money is no worrys or you're in debt. what about when you change your car every year?
Either way you're an idiot and I would like to drive round you with my winter tyres on.
Edited by Herbs on Tuesday 12th January 19:48
Herbs said:
GTIR said:
Herbs said:
[
what about when you change your car every year?
Then you're either very wealthy and money is no worrys or you're in debt. what about when you change your car every year?
Either way you're an idiot and I would like to drive round you with my winter tyres on.
Edited by Herbs on Tuesday 12th January 19:48
Apologies if this has been posted previously, but just saw this and thought of this thread:
http://www.autocar.co.uk/VideosWallpapers/Videos.a...
(Autocar's highly scientific winter tyre test)
http://www.autocar.co.uk/VideosWallpapers/Videos.a...
(Autocar's highly scientific winter tyre test)
Chris71 said:
Apologies if this has been posted previously, but just saw this and thought of this thread:
http://www.autocar.co.uk/VideosWallpapers/Videos.a...
(Autocar's highly scientific winter tyre test)
Another couple:http://www.autocar.co.uk/VideosWallpapers/Videos.a...
(Autocar's highly scientific winter tyre test)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GlYEMH10Z4s&fea...
http://www.tyresafe.org/news-and-events/detail/saf...
This test at Insideline at least addresses the wet and dry grip of winter tyres. It unfortunately does not make it clear what temperature the wet and dry tests were carried out at, I would assume Phoenix, Arizona in May is well above 7C and Fontana, California looks to be well above freezing most of the time.
What would be good is a wet/dry comparison of tyre at a range of temperatures from say just above freezing to 20C, each model of tyre is going to be different, however this would give us a better idea of when winter tyres start to become a liability.
ETA
Found this on the tyres-online site
It would be better to see what happens at 1-2, 10 and 15 degrees also, however it looks like winter tyres only offer an advantage in the wet at low temperatures and not in the the dry at all.
What would be good is a wet/dry comparison of tyre at a range of temperatures from say just above freezing to 20C, each model of tyre is going to be different, however this would give us a better idea of when winter tyres start to become a liability.
ETA
Found this on the tyres-online site
It would be better to see what happens at 1-2, 10 and 15 degrees also, however it looks like winter tyres only offer an advantage in the wet at low temperatures and not in the the dry at all.
Edited by Toltec on Monday 18th January 17:19
Toltec said:
What would be good is a wet/dry comparison of tyre at a range of temperatures from say just above freezing to 20C, each model of tyre is going to be different, however this would give us a better idea of when winter tyres start to become a liability.
If you can provide the road surface that we can change from freezing to 20c I will happily provide the tyres, data logging, test vehicles and mechanism to tell the world 
It's a fair comment though that such tests should note some specifics such as air and ground temperatures, but even these basics are often missed.
Never mind the silly stuff like comparing two completely different vehicles.
Problem is this sort of testing isn't cheap if done properly, yet the words of some half competent journalist, who might be a reasonable wordsmith / wheel twirler but not that competent in organising an objective scientific evaluation, is taken over the findings of the tyre manufacturers.
Never mind the silly stuff like comparing two completely different vehicles.
Problem is this sort of testing isn't cheap if done properly, yet the words of some half competent journalist, who might be a reasonable wordsmith / wheel twirler but not that competent in organising an objective scientific evaluation, is taken over the findings of the tyre manufacturers.
jon- said:
Toltec said:
What would be good is a wet/dry comparison of tyre at a range of temperatures from say just above freezing to 20C, each model of tyre is going to be different, however this would give us a better idea of when winter tyres start to become a liability.
If you can provide the road surface that we can change from freezing to 20c I will happily provide the tyres, data logging, test vehicles and mechanism to tell the world I still see your point, even if it was feasible to test as and when the weather provided the temperatures are we talking about air, ground or tyre temps...
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