RE: PH Heroes: Honda NSX

RE: PH Heroes: Honda NSX

Author
Discussion

mvm

25 posts

206 months

Thursday 27th January 2011
quotequote all
Dagnut said:
It's kind of an intangible we are arguing, I could be completely wrong, but I just don't go on the word of a race car designer and journalists...if a Ferrari or Porsche engineer came out and said the NSX changed the way we designed cars that would be good enough for me...I just think there's a lot of romantic nostalgia wrapped up with this car because it's so rare and will never be repeated.
The NSX was a brilliant all rounder, but it didn't move the game on in any specific area enough to be a game changer, IMO.
I'll leave with that won't waste any more of your time.
Ok, let's leave it at this.
Just remember that at least the designer of the McLaren F1 has admitted publicly that he threw away all his previous benchmark Ferrari's and Lambo's when looking for a design goal and started using the NSX instead.
So, without the NSX, the McLaren F1 might not have been the spectacular car that it proved to be.

Dagnut

3,515 posts

195 months

Thursday 27th January 2011
quotequote all
mvm said:
the McLaren F1 might not have been the spectaular
That is up for debate as well..try reading some owner reviews..no down force, crap brakes questionable chassis.

"The chassis stinks, there’s no downforce and the brakes are terrible. But it’s got a great engine!"

http://www.evo.co.uk/carreviews/cargrouptests/2047...

stephen300o

15,464 posts

230 months

Thursday 27th January 2011
quotequote all
Dagnut said:
That is up for debate as well..try reading some owner reviews..no down force, crap brakes questionable chassis.

"The chassis stinks, there’s no downforce and the brakes are terrible. But it’s got a great engine!"

http://www.evo.co.uk/carreviews/cargrouptests/2047...
Maybe they should have just put the BMW engine into the back of the Honda then. biggrin

mvm

25 posts

206 months

Thursday 27th January 2011
quotequote all
Dagnut said:
That is up for debate as well..try reading some owner reviews..no down force, crap brakes questionable chassis.

"The chassis stinks, there’s no downforce and the brakes are terrible. But it’s got a great engine!"
http://www.evo.co.uk/carreviews/cargrouptests/2047...
Well, after reading the link you posted, it's obvious that the owner was being sarcastic, since that new-to-the-F1 driver managed to lap that particular track faster than an Enzo Ferrari.
BTW, the brakes on the F1 are not terrible, they are just NON-assisted which is what everyone nowadays is used to. Which means that you really have to push those pedals to get some decent decelleration.


Dagnut

3,515 posts

195 months

Thursday 27th January 2011
quotequote all
mvm said:
Well, after reading the link you posted, it's obvious that the owner was being sarcastic, since that new-to-the-F1 driver managed to lap that particular track faster than an Enzo Ferrari.
BTW, the brakes on the F1 are not terrible, they are just NON-assisted which is what everyone nowadays is used to. Which means that you really have to push those pedals to get some decent decelleration.
That was tongue in cheek I know the owner is a member on here.

havoc

30,279 posts

237 months

Thursday 27th January 2011
quotequote all
Dagnut said:
The NSX was a brilliant all rounder, but it didn't move the game on in any specific area enough to be a game changer, IMO.
Name a contemporary supercar that did, F1 excepted.

I would suggest the NSX 'moved the game on' not dynamically (although it was and is still very good there) or in on-paper stats (I think we'll all agree there), but in terms of materials, chassis stiffness, and ergonomics. And in the first and the last it's still among the best.

I would also add that all three of those can be felt tangibly when you drive one. There is a lack of inertia to the way the car moves and 'breathes' with the road, and a 'oneness' to the chassis that contemporary cars don't tend to have. That it could still cut-it (with minimal changes) against the 996 - a car a generation-and-a-half past the NSX - surely says as much?!?

stephen300o

15,464 posts

230 months

Friday 28th January 2011
quotequote all
havoc said:
Name a contemporary supercar that did, F1 excepted.

I would suggest the NSX 'moved the game on' not dynamically (although it was and is still very good there) or in on-paper stats (I think we'll all agree there), but in terms of materials, chassis stiffness, and ergonomics. And in the first and the last it's still among the best.

I would also add that all three of those can be felt tangibly when you drive one. There is a lack of inertia to the way the car moves and 'breathes' with the road, and a 'oneness' to the chassis that contemporary cars don't tend to have. That it could still cut-it (with minimal changes) against the 996 - a car a generation-and-a-half past the NSX - surely says as much?!?
First for Vtech wasn't it? no one really did variable valve timing back then, first for titanium conrods, first aluminium production car.. the aqueduct?

NoelWatson

11,710 posts

244 months

Friday 28th January 2011
quotequote all
MattOz said:
The NSX is simply the most accessible supercar that I've had the pleasure of driving. It's way more involving than any 911 I've driven and certainly more engaging than a 355, 360 or 550M, all of which I've spent time piloting.

True, the dashboard is terrible and at 6ft3 I'm a little too tall for the cabin. As a car to enjoy punting round "Evo Triangle" type roads I'd take it over its direct competition every day of the week.
I tend to lean the seat back slightly to improve headroom.

havoc

30,279 posts

237 months

Friday 28th January 2011
quotequote all
I just had a thought...this thread has confirmed that the NSX can pretty much do everything except solve world peace.

...so just imagine how good it would be on Winter tyres*!!! wink

Marf

22,907 posts

243 months

Friday 28th January 2011
quotequote all
havoc said:
I just had a thought...this thread has confirmed that the NSX can pretty much do everything except solve world peace.

...so just imagine how good it would be on Winter tyres*!!! wink
rofl

anything fast

983 posts

166 months

Friday 28th January 2011
quotequote all
Marf said:
rofl
it can solve world peace.. give every nasty dictator an NSX and they will be too busy having fun to do anything else wink

DanS

1,137 posts

286 months

Saturday 29th January 2011
quotequote all
yonex said:
DanS said:
RESSE said:
There is an article in Classic & Sportscar (February 2011) on buying/owning the NSX.

A very good read.
Theres a coincidence... smile
Are you saying that this site is sponsoring Haymarket?
No, they own it..

It just conjours up images of PH staffers lying about in leather jackets munching pies and drinking beer like the school bullies of haymarket, only raising from the sofa occasionally to cross the office to the diligent teams producing other Haymarket titles to steal some copy and a few pics from the weedy kids in the corner, probably nicking a kitkat and throwing in a Chinese burn for a laugh...

smile


ge0rge

3,053 posts

207 months

Saturday 29th January 2011
quotequote all
Best jap car ever, but typical jap styling frown

stephen300o

15,464 posts

230 months

Saturday 29th January 2011
quotequote all
ge0rge said:
Best jap car ever, but typical jap styling frown

wanacoop

1,249 posts

224 months

Saturday 29th January 2011
quotequote all
Harry Monk said:
This is an interesting watch.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OUCudgQ3Mus

Best Motoring: Tsukuba 1995
NSX
NSX-T
RX7
MR2 GTS
993
Supra TT
R33 GT-R

Prace your bets.
I wasn't expecting that!!

stephen300o

15,464 posts

230 months

Sunday 30th January 2011
quotequote all
Too much booze at the Vegas meet.


:snigger:

will-w

253 posts

203 months

Sunday 30th January 2011
quotequote all
stephen300o said:
First for Vtech wasn't it? no one really did variable valve timing back then, first for titanium conrods, first aluminium production car.. the aqueduct?
Vtech:


VTEC:

Harry Monk

5,187 posts

239 months

Monday 31st January 2011
quotequote all


Thought I'd dig this old photo out.

We drove these cars at Spa, Colmar-Berg and the Nurburgring and had Matt Becker from Lotus do th performance testing. The NSX was the slowest and the least accomplished handler according to Becker, who drew up a massive list of what was wrong with the tyres, the suspension, the weight distribution and so on. I realise there's an element of 'well, he would' given there's a Lotus and VX220T in the mix, but his findings were sound. This was 2004 and the NSX felt as if its sell-by date had passed.

That said, if you gave me the choice to take any of these cars for a blast up the road from Adenau to Hohe Acht, I'd unhesitatingly pick the Honda. And I can't put my finger on why.

NoelWatson

11,710 posts

244 months

Monday 31st January 2011
quotequote all
Harry Monk said:
This was 2004 and the NSX felt as if its sell-by date had passed.
It seems to have slipped badly since 2002 when Autocar placed it 5th in their handling day, ahead of the 996. Why is the NSX any different to an S1 Elise in terms of roll oversteer?

havoc

30,279 posts

237 months

Monday 31st January 2011
quotequote all
Harry Monk said:


Thought I'd dig this old photo out.

We drove these cars at Spa, Colmar-Berg and the Nurburgring and had Matt Becker from Lotus do th performance testing. The NSX was the slowest and the least accomplished handler according to Becker, who drew up a massive list of what was wrong with the tyres, the suspension, the weight distribution and so on. I realise there's an element of 'well, he would' given there's a Lotus and VX220T in the mix, but his findings were sound. This was 2004 and the NSX felt as if its sell-by date had passed.
Hang on...that's a 996 cabrio there (looks like a Turbo front-bumper, but still) and he was saying the NSX handling was WORSE??? Are we talking about 'for track work', or just in general? Evo's a bit of a wildcard too...I've a lot of respect for them but they're very much a case of 'electronics doing it all for you'. Won't argue with the Exige though, and the VX220 is nearly as telepathic.

As for the weight distribution, may I be the first to say "pot/kettle" at Mr Becker - the Elise chassis is very accomplished but to some degree this is despite the weight distribution...and the same with the 996. And suspension? I'd wager a tidy sum the NSX was the most supple of all 5 cars...


Harry Monk said:
That said, if you gave me the choice to take any of these cars for a blast up the road from Adenau to Hohe Acht, I'd unhesitatingly pick the Honda. And I can't put my finger on why.
If it was a lap of the 'ring itself I'd probably pick the Exige, but for anything else round there I'd agree with you.