RE: Alfa Romeo Giulia - official!
Discussion
Tony33 said:
eh, heard it all before, massive sales volume increases, decent residual estimates, the start of a new range of refreshed, vibrant new models. None of which happened.
I love Alfas too (but not really the current ones) and owned four between 2000 and 2007 but I think they need to build up customer confidence (and bring back a local dealer they closed down) before any mighty revival can take place. It just feels like bigwigs are taking turns to turn Alfa around into a financially successful manufacturer with big claims but little momentum.
The "problem" with an all new Alfa with new engines and drivetrain is it opens up the whole unreliability perception which is mighty hard to break. When I bought a new 156 in 2003 my boss asked me if they still rusted, I said it wasn't the seventies! Yet the perception of poor reliability and rusting lives on and the lack of continuity of models in this sector to evolve and grow confidence will hurt them IMHO as it lacks a solid base.
Yes, agreed. Alfa have the "brand" but no product. It needs to be the other way round. They need a decent product first - and that includes dealers, backup, warranty, spares supply, not just the cars. See Lexus, Skoda, Kia - they have created a brand from nowhere by having good products, rather than relying on some sepia prints of Nuvolari or a GTAm three wheeling round some long forgotten circuit.I love Alfas too (but not really the current ones) and owned four between 2000 and 2007 but I think they need to build up customer confidence (and bring back a local dealer they closed down) before any mighty revival can take place. It just feels like bigwigs are taking turns to turn Alfa around into a financially successful manufacturer with big claims but little momentum.
The "problem" with an all new Alfa with new engines and drivetrain is it opens up the whole unreliability perception which is mighty hard to break. When I bought a new 156 in 2003 my boss asked me if they still rusted, I said it wasn't the seventies! Yet the perception of poor reliability and rusting lives on and the lack of continuity of models in this sector to evolve and grow confidence will hurt them IMHO as it lacks a solid base.
craig_m67 said:
Kolbenkopp said:
Ironically, back again to the marketing stuff (sorry 
). Going to be interesting to see what labels they will stick on the thing. Bit surprised they've used "QV" for the monster they just launched. QV used to be a fancy trim level in recent times, and stats wise no doubt we are looking what would previously have been called a GTA. In that respect they are doing it differently than BMW (who are turning their "M" stuff into a trim level).
I think QV makes sense. They're taking Alfa back to its roots, at the very least 30 years to the last RWD 75. Back in the old days QV meant the go fast version. The A in GTA stands for Alleggrita or lightened (appreciate you may know this), something that the last GTA's (156/147) were quite simply not. Lovely quick cars but not correctly named given they're heavier than the everyday version (flamesuiton).). Going to be interesting to see what labels they will stick on the thing. Bit surprised they've used "QV" for the monster they just launched. QV used to be a fancy trim level in recent times, and stats wise no doubt we are looking what would previously have been called a GTA. In that respect they are doing it differently than BMW (who are turning their "M" stuff into a trim level).This new Giula is "estimated" to be 1500kg, I think Wester has said (topgear?) the everyday cooking versions will be 1400kg, so again, it's not significantly lighter (if at all), just faster and full of trick QV bits.
Edited by craig_m67 on Monday 29th June 01:21
They should save the GTA badge for the rare limited run CSL variants.Alfa's website states that the Giulia QV will have less thank 3kg/hp, so that's less than 1,530kg. Now whether that's dry or wet is a different story.
Do we have any more clarity which car's platform and engine the Giulia uses?
Is it the Ghibli S', or the Alfieri's?
Both are/will be available with an AWD turbo V6, so can we expect AWD on the Giulia too?
Pretty sure the V6 diesel will be same as the Ghibli's.
Do we have any more clarity which car's platform and engine the Giulia uses?
Is it the Ghibli S', or the Alfieri's?
Both are/will be available with an AWD turbo V6, so can we expect AWD on the Giulia too?
Pretty sure the V6 diesel will be same as the Ghibli's.
matrignano said:
Do we have any more clarity which car's platform and engine the Giulia uses?
Is it the Ghibli S', or the Alfieri's?
Both are/will be available with an AWD turbo V6, so can we expect AWD on the Giulia too?
Pretty sure the V6 diesel will be same as the Ghibli's.
To the best of my knowledge:Is it the Ghibli S', or the Alfieri's?
Both are/will be available with an AWD turbo V6, so can we expect AWD on the Giulia too?
Pretty sure the V6 diesel will be same as the Ghibli's.
It's a new engine, albeit probably borrowed from the 488GTB V8 if the other posters are correct.
It's a new platform, although since the mule was Ghibli based, it must be similar. Alfieri doesn't have a platform choice announced yet AFAIK.
Yes to AWD.
I don't know about the diesel.
trashbat said:
o the best of my knowledge:
It's a new engine, albeit probably borrowed from the 488GTB V8 if the other posters are correct.
It's a new platform. Alfieri doesn't have a platform choice announced yet AFAIK.
Yes to AWD.
I don't know about the diesel.
I'd be very very surprised if, despite what they say, they won't exploit some commonalities with other parts of the FCA group.It's a new engine, albeit probably borrowed from the 488GTB V8 if the other posters are correct.
It's a new platform. Alfieri doesn't have a platform choice announced yet AFAIK.
Yes to AWD.
I don't know about the diesel.
I reckon it will be a 4-door Alfieri in pretty red disguise.
matrignano said:
I'd be very very surprised if, despite what they say, they won't exploit some commonalities with other parts of the FCA group.
Of course they will, it's the only sensible choice, but that doesn't mean this isn't the first use of it.Wester said before launch:
Wester said:
It is said that we will be using a Chrysler-platform for our new model, but that’s complete rubbish. We have an entirely new structure ready. In this one model we will bring an entirely new chassis, a new design language and brand new engines and transmissions
What that really means is anyone's guess.trashbat said:
matrignano said:
I'd be very very surprised if, despite what they say, they won't exploit some commonalities with other parts of the FCA group.
Of course they will, it's the only sensible choice, but that doesn't mean this isn't the first use of it.Wester said before launch:
Wester said:
It is said that we will be using a Chrysler-platform for our new model, but that’s complete rubbish. We have an entirely new structure ready. In this one model we will bring an entirely new chassis, a new design language and brand new engines and transmissions
What that really means is anyone's guess.
kambites said:
Oh it's clearly not going to be terrible, just seems an odd decision to design a new V6 when they already have one; especially when they one they've got is, at least in some ways, technically superior.
I remember that in some interviews a couple of years back Marchionne promised (in a somewhat un-PC manner) that the Giulia would have a 'proper wop' engine - after having received such a barrage of criticism over the shortcomings of the GM based V6 used in the Brera/159.Seeing as the 60º V6 in the Ghibli uses the Chrysler Pentastar block, maybe he decided he had to make good on that promise
underphil said:
Much less of a bodge than what Jaguar have done with the F-type & XE...
Yes, I've been vocally critical of the Jag V6 for that reason. The word is that it was done on the cheap because a straight six is on the way but not quite ready.I like the tweets from the brand's rivals. What brand other than AR has that power? The perennial underdog that everyone wants to see succeed?
RuntyMuz said:
that you can't fit a number plate to.
It's all very well being able to outrun an M3 on a twisty B-road, but if you can't get through the ANPR barrier for prebooked parking at Southampton Airport so are forced to press the little button and talk to the man, then really, what was it all for?trashbat said:
t's all very well being able to outrun an M3 on a twisty B-road, but if you can't get through the ANPR barrier for prebooked parking at Southampton Airport so are forced to press the little button and talk to the man, then really, what was it all for?
Funny story this, I have been parking in an underground car park, and for my 159 the barrier always went up automatically when I drove out (did have to take a ticket going in, have never paid).
Imagine my surprise when I arrived there in my new car having to actually validate & pay the ticket on exit.
Apparently it was a lazy gatekeeper/receptionist that let me out every time in the Alfa based on the security camera
.RuntyMuz said:
Ghibli in a cheap suit, that you can't fit a number plate to.
Clearly not read anything about it just prejudging from a preconceived idea in your head!.The fact it has a different chassis and a different engine obviously means it's just a Ghibli.
I like the fact Alfa refuse to compromise their designs just to allow for the UK's oversized number plates, especially when you consider we are far from being their priority market.
craig_m67 said:
I think QV makes sense. They're taking Alfa back to its roots, at the very least 30 years to the last RWD 75. Back in the old days QV meant the go fast version. The A in GTA stands for Alleggrita or lightened (appreciate you may know this), something that the last GTA's (156/147) were quite simply not. Lovely quick cars but not correctly named given they're heavier than the everyday version (flamesuiton).
This new Giula is "estimated" to be 1500kg, I think Wester has said (topgear?) the everyday cooking versions will be 1400kg, so again, it's not significantly lighter (if at all), just faster and full of trick QV bits.
Lighter than the 159 though that was a bit lardy especially after the 156. I think my 159v6 comes in around 1700kg.This new Giula is "estimated" to be 1500kg, I think Wester has said (topgear?) the everyday cooking versions will be 1400kg, so again, it's not significantly lighter (if at all), just faster and full of trick QV bits.
Edited by craig_m67 on Monday 29th June 01:21
Video of it driving on the street... looks terrible to me, mostly because of the wheels I think?
https://youtu.be/Ib_fXfaafBo
https://youtu.be/Ib_fXfaafBo
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