New 'Dutch-style' cycle roundabouts
Discussion
MC Bodge said:
Why do people hate other people riding bicycles?
Because PH is full of borderline neanderthals who've somehow acquired a driving license.It makes you cry when you realise what driving could be like if you had to pass an intelligence and attitude test first.
No money spent on bike lanes, for a start. Because no one would feel the need for them.
I'm sure some
king blah... Because this strategy that seems to be so working just so f
king well for us at the moment 
.Edited by paranoid airbag on Tuesday 30th April 20:53
s p a c e m a n said:
But a large proportion actively use the road rather than cycle lanes when they are provided.Whether there is a cycle lane or not, cyclists still have every right to use the main carriageway of the road.
Many Uk drivers struggle with the current roundabouts, let alone new ones. Can only see more collisions being caused by these new ones as many will be confused by what is going on. They shouldnt be, but they will 
Shame the goverment cant spend this £100 million on hospitals and police though isnt it?
Shame the goverment cant spend this £100 million on hospitals and police though isnt it?
scenario8 said:
clarkey540i said:
I agree, the zebra crossings certainly have to be there, but what I'm getting at is that pedestrians are quite slow, so the driver has plenty of time to see them. If they don't, a pedestrian has a stopping distance of practically nothing, which cannot be said for bicycles travelling at 4 times the speed.
Let's face it, most drivers are crap, so if they can barely spot a pedestrian, they aren't going to spot a cyclist going much, much faster.
Indeed.Let's face it, most drivers are crap, so if they can barely spot a pedestrian, they aren't going to spot a cyclist going much, much faster.
I'll be dumbstruck if attempts were made to impose this type of layout on that specific roundabout (without the addition of speed humps or something). Roundabouts at motorway junctions (or near enough in this case) where some drivers seem to want to better their 0-60 records or explore their maximum grip would appear daft places to implement this sort of thing. presumably they would be better suited to urban 30mph smallish junctions (with lightish traffic). I can't think of many in SW London with the space. Or any borough with the cash. Still, tfl seem to spunk money up the wall all over the place...
kambites said:
Cyclists tend to use cycle lanes where they're actually viable. A huge number of them aren't because they do stupid things like forcing cyclists to give way at every side road.
Whether there is a cycle lane or not, cyclists still have every right to use the main carriageway of the road.
So they take the quicker route even when there is a safe option available? Please refer to the bit of my post that you didn't quote Whether there is a cycle lane or not, cyclists still have every right to use the main carriageway of the road.
We both agree then, they're pointless as are cycle lanes.
s p a c e m a n said:
So they take the quicker route even when there is a safe option available? Please refer to the bit of my post that you didn't quote
We both agree then, they're pointless as are cycle lanes.
No, cycle lanes are not pointless at all; I see people using them all the time to great effect.We both agree then, they're pointless as are cycle lanes.
Badly designed cycle lanes are pointless (and also often more dangerous than cycling on the roads).
It's very difficult to tell whether these would be good or bad without trying them, so I'm willing to bow to the experience of those who've used the boards in the Netherlands where they're common, and most of them seem to be saying that they work. I would be very worried about the adjustment period while drivers get used to them, though, given how unobservant a lot of car drivers on the UK roads are.
kambites said:
No, cycle lanes are not pointless at all; I see people using them all the time to great effect.
Badly designed cycle lanes are pointless.
It's very difficult to tell whether these would be good or bad without trying them, so I'm willing to bow to the experience of those who've used the boards in the Netherlands where they're common, and most of them seem to be saying that they work.
Indeed, they work well in Netherlands. Lived there for few years and was very refreshing. Only 40mins from track tooBadly designed cycle lanes are pointless.
It's very difficult to tell whether these would be good or bad without trying them, so I'm willing to bow to the experience of those who've used the boards in the Netherlands where they're common, and most of them seem to be saying that they work.
clarkey540i said:
The people who thought Tolworth Greenway was a good idea clearly beg to differ on all your points. Granted, it's a different layout, but it cost 4 million and incorporates Toucan crossings on a motorway roundabout. I can't quite tell from the plans whether the crossings have red lights or just flashing yellows, but if it's the latter I would expect significant casualties, given that the cycle path will be at least partially obscured from the road. If it's the former, the A3 will cease to be a road and will turn into a car park.
The roundabout over the A3 there is traffic controlled at present. They've got to be keeping that haven't they? The broadway itself sounds like they're trying to mimic New Malden High Street. The road in general is bigger in every dimension, though, isn't it? Personally I try to avoid it down to the traffic as it is.
pboyd said:
Indeed, they work well in Netherlands. Lived there for few years and was very refreshing. Only 40mins from track too
Are the opponents of anything that may be pro-cycling suggesting that Dutch drivers are more intelligent than than UK ones?Do any British opponents of cycling ("I've seen some people breaking the law whilst riding bikes, but never people driving cars") ever consider riding a bike themselves or are they too worried about the danger from other motorists?
Edited by MC Bodge on Tuesday 30th April 21:08
MC Bodge said:
Are the opponents of anything that may be pro-cycling suggesting that Dutch drivers are more intelligent than than UK ones?
Do any opponents of cycling ("I've seen some people breaking the law whilst riding bikes, but never people driving cars") ever consider riding a bike themselves or are they too worried about the danger from other motorists?
Not sure. I did both as did mostDo any opponents of cycling ("I've seen some people breaking the law whilst riding bikes, but never people driving cars") ever consider riding a bike themselves or are they too worried about the danger from other motorists?
scenario8 said:
clarkey540i said:
The people who thought Tolworth Greenway was a good idea clearly beg to differ on all your points. Granted, it's a different layout, but it cost 4 million and incorporates Toucan crossings on a motorway roundabout. I can't quite tell from the plans whether the crossings have red lights or just flashing yellows, but if it's the latter I would expect significant casualties, given that the cycle path will be at least partially obscured from the road. If it's the former, the A3 will cease to be a road and will turn into a car park.
The roundabout over the A3 there is traffic controlled at present. They've got to be keeping that haven't they? The broadway itself sounds like they're trying to mimic New Malden High Street. The road in general is bigger in every dimension, though, isn't it? Personally I try to avoid it down to the traffic as it is.I try to avoid it too, but I'm moving down to Tadworth pretty soon and that will be my route into Kingston.
pboyd said:
Not sure. I did both as did most
Sorry, I meant British opponents of cycling.Mass participation in cycling is a great thing. Dutch (and many German, Danish, French, Austrian, Swiss etc. etc.) people cycle everywhere on practical, utility bikes.
..as do I, but I am in a very small minority.
pboyd said:
Can't comment. Usually cycling threads here get no where and are full of brainless comments by people who have never cycled
So I've realised.It seems that the argument goes:
"It couldn't possibly work in the UK, because motorists wouldn't want it to"
Edited by MC Bodge on Tuesday 30th April 21:20
I think that sums up PH's attitude to most things. 
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