"Full Service History"
Discussion
hora said:
ChasW said:
St John Smythe said:
Full service history is stamped book AND receipts/invoices. Just a stamped book by itself doesn't count.
AgreeI went to view a car at an indie once. He showed me the service book which had six identical stamps with mileage written in and all signed in identical handwriting but using different biros, dates we almost one year apart. No other documents. Very fishy.
After looking for cars for both the better half and my Mum, I couldn't believe the number of franchised dealers advertising cars with full service history only to find out they were well over their time intervals or missing stamps ccompletely. One which even advertised with the title "full main dealer service history" actually turned out to be missing a few but the dealer in question was adamant MOTs still qualified. Not impressed!
Just leads you to think if they're that unscrupulous then there's no stopping them in stamping the book up themselves anyway which defeats the whole purpose. So now I'm thinking it's better to have a whole book of receipts now rather than dealer stamps, but as has been mentioned already in this thread, finding such an example is a mission in itself.
Just leads you to think if they're that unscrupulous then there's no stopping them in stamping the book up themselves anyway which defeats the whole purpose. So now I'm thinking it's better to have a whole book of receipts now rather than dealer stamps, but as has been mentioned already in this thread, finding such an example is a mission in itself.
As a famous car maker once said, history is......
It really depends on what part of the market you are talking about - a relatively new car, history is important, but bear in mind up to about 80-100k and 5 years a full main dealer history will basically consist of a few oil changes and a not a lot more as that is pretty much all that is specified. Only on some more "exotic" stuff is there much extra and then it becomes even more important.
Once a car gets to a certain age the critical thing is recent history and how the car is at the moment. A 20k 3 year gap at 30000 miles on a 120k 10 year old car really means nothing and you can have 17 folders with 1535 stamps in but if the suspension is knackered, the gearbox slips when warm and it has a mystery electrical fault it doesn't mean a lot.
It really depends on what part of the market you are talking about - a relatively new car, history is important, but bear in mind up to about 80-100k and 5 years a full main dealer history will basically consist of a few oil changes and a not a lot more as that is pretty much all that is specified. Only on some more "exotic" stuff is there much extra and then it becomes even more important.
Once a car gets to a certain age the critical thing is recent history and how the car is at the moment. A 20k 3 year gap at 30000 miles on a 120k 10 year old car really means nothing and you can have 17 folders with 1535 stamps in but if the suspension is knackered, the gearbox slips when warm and it has a mystery electrical fault it doesn't mean a lot.
When looking for my new (new to me) everyday family car earlier this year the number that were advertised as FSH & when you looked into it was actually part SH was shocking especially from the main dealers.
I wasn't 100% bothered about full service history but more does the car look like its been looked after and has it had the smallest jobs it needed done. A far better indication on the car condition than a book full of stamps.
My last car that I have just sold had full service history till I got it. Being serviced by myself & for larger more specialised jobs needing a ramp etc by one of my mates in the trade. I kept every receipt and a spreadsheet of repairs carried out and servicing done. I kept the car for 10 years.
The first person who came to look at the car asked about the service history and I showed him the folder of receipts and spreadsheet printout.
He was more than happy with the evidence the car was looked after and bought the car for full asking price.
The car I ended up buying had a fully stamped up book with the later 2 stamps being the small village garage that did the yearly MOT.
Clearly some of the servicing that should have been done like gearbox oil/dual pump oil change hadn't been done but there were receipts for the oil/filter etc.
I was more than happy with that as it was only the last 7000miles it had covered in the last 2 years that was dealt with by the village garage and I was planning to change the gearbox oil etc myself as soon as I got the car just to be sure anyway.
It gave me a nice few points to negotiate a lower purchase price which more than covered the full service parts cost, new brake pads all round and a little extra.
I wasn't 100% bothered about full service history but more does the car look like its been looked after and has it had the smallest jobs it needed done. A far better indication on the car condition than a book full of stamps.
My last car that I have just sold had full service history till I got it. Being serviced by myself & for larger more specialised jobs needing a ramp etc by one of my mates in the trade. I kept every receipt and a spreadsheet of repairs carried out and servicing done. I kept the car for 10 years.
The first person who came to look at the car asked about the service history and I showed him the folder of receipts and spreadsheet printout.
He was more than happy with the evidence the car was looked after and bought the car for full asking price.
The car I ended up buying had a fully stamped up book with the later 2 stamps being the small village garage that did the yearly MOT.
Clearly some of the servicing that should have been done like gearbox oil/dual pump oil change hadn't been done but there were receipts for the oil/filter etc.
I was more than happy with that as it was only the last 7000miles it had covered in the last 2 years that was dealt with by the village garage and I was planning to change the gearbox oil etc myself as soon as I got the car just to be sure anyway.
It gave me a nice few points to negotiate a lower purchase price which more than covered the full service parts cost, new brake pads all round and a little extra.
A full service history, should be just that. A record of all services done, showing which if any has been missed. A perfect service history would have none missed.
I'm afraid that a service by the dealer however may not worth the paper it is stamped on.
My daughter recently had her general motors product serviced by the dealer. One of the items in this it's third service was to check adjust wheel bearings, & rotate the wheels. As it was the right front wheel bearing had leaked a little grease, which she forgot to ask them to check under her warranty.
A couple of days later I noticed the right front wheel still had a little grease on it, & was the only one that had. They obviously had not checked the wheel bearings or rotated the wheels. I wonder what else they had ticked but not done.
My son took his Ford Ranger to the Ford dealer for a 40,000 service. This service include cleaning & repacking the front wheel bearings. He mentioned that there was a bit of noise from one wheel bearing. They were still noisy when he picked the thing up. He went back & complained, to be told, "they all do that sir".
Now he is a rather suspicious & pedantic marine engineer. On the weekend he pulled the things himself. Not only was there no sign of any regreasing, the front bearings were not only light on grease, but RUSTY. No one who saw them, would have put them back in, regreased or not.
He sent photos & a copy of the receipt to Ford. A few days later the dealer was offering to replace the bearings at their expense, which they did, promising to do better next time. As if there will be a next time.
The fact that a dealer has ticked the boxes, then stamped & signed the service schedule means very little, except that the owner has probably paid for the service. I'd rather trust an enthusiastic amateur than any dealer.
I'm afraid that a service by the dealer however may not worth the paper it is stamped on.
My daughter recently had her general motors product serviced by the dealer. One of the items in this it's third service was to check adjust wheel bearings, & rotate the wheels. As it was the right front wheel bearing had leaked a little grease, which she forgot to ask them to check under her warranty.
A couple of days later I noticed the right front wheel still had a little grease on it, & was the only one that had. They obviously had not checked the wheel bearings or rotated the wheels. I wonder what else they had ticked but not done.
My son took his Ford Ranger to the Ford dealer for a 40,000 service. This service include cleaning & repacking the front wheel bearings. He mentioned that there was a bit of noise from one wheel bearing. They were still noisy when he picked the thing up. He went back & complained, to be told, "they all do that sir".
Now he is a rather suspicious & pedantic marine engineer. On the weekend he pulled the things himself. Not only was there no sign of any regreasing, the front bearings were not only light on grease, but RUSTY. No one who saw them, would have put them back in, regreased or not.
He sent photos & a copy of the receipt to Ford. A few days later the dealer was offering to replace the bearings at their expense, which they did, promising to do better next time. As if there will be a next time.
The fact that a dealer has ticked the boxes, then stamped & signed the service schedule means very little, except that the owner has probably paid for the service. I'd rather trust an enthusiastic amateur than any dealer.
Really though all cars or most cars have full service history.
It my have been under or over serviced according to the manufacturer but that car has a full history of its services.
Its an impossibility to police as it comes down to the individuals view the meaning of that three words either full as per manufacturer guidelines or full in the sense that this is all its had done to it.
Easy answer is to find out before travelling to view the car if its such a deciding factor for you.
It my have been under or over serviced according to the manufacturer but that car has a full history of its services.
Its an impossibility to police as it comes down to the individuals view the meaning of that three words either full as per manufacturer guidelines or full in the sense that this is all its had done to it.
Easy answer is to find out before travelling to view the car if its such a deciding factor for you.
texaxile said:
I've seen a few examples of "service history" which didn't add up. A friend went to purchase an M3 privately, we checked the book and the stamps for the previous 3 services were from the same non BMW garage. The vendor told us there was no point calling because they had gone bust, when we asked for the receipts he had lost them. I think that's downright fraud but it didn't matter to the vendor "cos it's an M3 innit bruv". We walked away.
However, Mazda these days (or since 2010 I think) don't have service books that are stamped, the whole service history is held at the Main Dealer, all you get as a customer is a sheet of printed A4 with the services done and the next scheduled one. not great if you decide to have it done privately.
Anyway, as mentioned numerous times, a wedge of paperwork for work done and evidence of a well looked after car in my eyes mitigates perhaps one or two missed services, especially if the mileage is lower than average anyway.
An independent garage can apply to Mazda to be able to update the digital service manual. My local garage did this and said it cost about £30. However, Mazda these days (or since 2010 I think) don't have service books that are stamped, the whole service history is held at the Main Dealer, all you get as a customer is a sheet of printed A4 with the services done and the next scheduled one. not great if you decide to have it done privately.
Anyway, as mentioned numerous times, a wedge of paperwork for work done and evidence of a well looked after car in my eyes mitigates perhaps one or two missed services, especially if the mileage is lower than average anyway.
What many PHer's fail to take into account is a car to many people is a form of transport, nothing more...thus they are not going to file every tax disc (as was) into a leather bound A4 binder so the next owner can pull themselves off over it.
I had a beautiful Ferrari 328 for sale that a moron didnt buy becuase the car missed a service 10 yers previously when in storage and not been used...the car he ended up buying wasnt anything like as nice as mine, but at least it had an extra stamp in the book...
POORCARDEALER said:
What many PHer's fail to take into account is a car to many people is a form of transport, nothing more...thus they are not going to file every tax disc (as was) into a leather bound A4 binder so the next owner can pull themselves off over it.
Does that mean cars that don't have a full service history should be advertised as having a full service history, then, because most punters don't care about keeping the documentation for their second most expensive purchase?masermartin said:
Does that mean cars that don't have a full service history should be advertised as having a full service history, then, because most punters don't care about keeping the documentation for their second most expensive purchase?
With all this froth about FSH I wonder what the PH thought police expect when they see a car advertised as being "in excellent condition"!masermartin said:
POORCARDEALER said:
What many PHer's fail to take into account is a car to many people is a form of transport, nothing more...thus they are not going to file every tax disc (as was) into a leather bound A4 binder so the next owner can pull themselves off over it.
Does that mean cars that don't have a full service history should be advertised as having a full service history, then, because most punters don't care about keeping the documentation for their second most expensive purchase?Full history to me is a book full of stamps, done at the age/mileage they are needed done.
Paperwork is nice but most people don't bother with it.
I have a folder full of paperwork for my own car, covering stuff from brakes, to wishbones to wipers.
It will stay with the car along with old tax discs and forms, plus all mot's.
I did that with my last car and it sold for full asking price to the first viewer.
They commented how it was more expensive than others but the detailed history was good to see.
Paperwork is nice but most people don't bother with it.
I have a folder full of paperwork for my own car, covering stuff from brakes, to wishbones to wipers.
It will stay with the car along with old tax discs and forms, plus all mot's.
I did that with my last car and it sold for full asking price to the first viewer.
They commented how it was more expensive than others but the detailed history was good to see.
was8v said:
Would you feel misled if I advertised my car as FSH and you got here and found I'd done the servicing myself (with receipts for everything)?
Providing the seller seems to know their stuff and is clearly enthusiastic about the car/motoring in general then that is probably one of the better eventualities in my eyes.Axionknight said:
Providing the seller seems to know their stuff and is clearly enthusiastic about the car/motoring in general then that is probably one of the better eventualities in my eyes.
Well said! This is the very reason I prefer to buy privately. The service book needs to be bang on if buying through a dealer because receipts don't tell you if the former owner knew what they were doing. And that's what a full service history from a dealer should mean!My car is serviced on miles or age, whichever first, it had an annual service just before I bought it in January, but it's technically due a mileage one now, but I'm not paying close to £500 for a service on a car which has done only a few thousand miles since it's last service and then again later in the year, so have done an oil filter and oil change myself and documented it, it will get a full service in December/January and get stamped in the book. If it effects resale, meh, not bothered.
hora said:
Hasbeen said:
A full service history, should be just that. A record of all services done, showing which if any has been missed. A perfect service history would have none missed.
I'm afraid that a service by the dealer however may not worth the paper it is stamped on.
My daughter recently had her general motors product serviced by the dealer. One of the items in this it's third service was to check adjust wheel bearings, & rotate the wheels. As it was the right front wheel bearing had leaked a little grease, which she forgot to ask them to check under her warranty.
A couple of days later I noticed the right front wheel still had a little grease on it, & was the only one that had. They obviously had not checked the wheel bearings or rotated the wheels. I wonder what else they had ticked but not done.
My son took his Ford Ranger to the Ford dealer for a 40,000 service. This service include cleaning & repacking the front wheel bearings. He mentioned that there was a bit of noise from one wheel bearing. They were still noisy when he picked the thing up. He went back & complained, to be told, "they all do that sir".
Now he is a rather suspicious & pedantic marine engineer. On the weekend he pulled the things himself. Not only was there no sign of any regreasing, the front bearings were not only light on grease, but RUSTY. No one who saw them, would have put them back in, regreased or not.
He sent photos & a copy of the receipt to Ford. A few days later the dealer was offering to replace the bearings at their expense, which they did, promising to do better next time. As if there will be a next time.
The fact that a dealer has ticked the boxes, then stamped & signed the service schedule means very little, except that the owner has probably paid for the service. I'd rather trust an enthusiastic amateur than any dealer.
I refer you back to my earlier post on Subaru v the likes of Ford etc.... not all main dealers are the sameI'm afraid that a service by the dealer however may not worth the paper it is stamped on.
My daughter recently had her general motors product serviced by the dealer. One of the items in this it's third service was to check adjust wheel bearings, & rotate the wheels. As it was the right front wheel bearing had leaked a little grease, which she forgot to ask them to check under her warranty.
A couple of days later I noticed the right front wheel still had a little grease on it, & was the only one that had. They obviously had not checked the wheel bearings or rotated the wheels. I wonder what else they had ticked but not done.
My son took his Ford Ranger to the Ford dealer for a 40,000 service. This service include cleaning & repacking the front wheel bearings. He mentioned that there was a bit of noise from one wheel bearing. They were still noisy when he picked the thing up. He went back & complained, to be told, "they all do that sir".
Now he is a rather suspicious & pedantic marine engineer. On the weekend he pulled the things himself. Not only was there no sign of any regreasing, the front bearings were not only light on grease, but RUSTY. No one who saw them, would have put them back in, regreased or not.
He sent photos & a copy of the receipt to Ford. A few days later the dealer was offering to replace the bearings at their expense, which they did, promising to do better next time. As if there will be a next time.
The fact that a dealer has ticked the boxes, then stamped & signed the service schedule means very little, except that the owner has probably paid for the service. I'd rather trust an enthusiastic amateur than any dealer.
On Subaru main dealers, my sons father in law was quoted thousands to fix his Impreza, after he left it with the dealer for a day to find a strange noise.
Fortunately my son took a look at it, & the noise disappeared after he tightened the loose spark plug.
On the other hand, our local Mazda/Toyota dealer has gone well beyond necessary with servicing a couple of our cars over the last 8 years.
KingNothing said:
My car is serviced on miles or age, whichever first, it had an annual service just before I bought it in January, but it's technically due a mileage one now, but I'm not paying close to £500 for a service on a car which has done only a few thousand miles since it's last service and then again later in the year, so have done an oil filter and oil change myself and documented it, it will get a full service in December/January and get stamped in the book. If it effects resale, meh, not bothered.
How can it be due a mileage one now if it's only done a few thousand since the last service?Ozzie Osmond said:
masermartin said:
Does that mean cars that don't have a full service history should be advertised as having a full service history, then, because most punters don't care about keeping the documentation for their second most expensive purchase?
With all this froth about FSH I wonder what the PH thought police expect when they see a car advertised as being "in excellent condition"!Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff