RE: Tell Me I'm Wrong: BMW Z4 M Coupe
Discussion
I have a Z4 Coupe and chose the 3.0Si over the M as the running costs and fuel consumption didn't justify the extra money on purchase, and neither are that exciting to drive (applicable to Z4s in general). Neither are particularly a driver's car, and dare I say it, they're somewhat dull.
Hi Chris,
I'm not sure I can tell you that you are wrong, I've had to modify mine to make it suitable for my liking, ride and handling has always irked me and as you said in the MX5 article that kind of defeats the purpose as you refer only to the standard car.
As a new buy, I agree it made little sense against an M3, it didn't offer anything really extra unless simply you just wanted to buy something different, or something with a different image. With the Roadster at least you were able to take the roof off.
My Coupe was a used purchase at what I considered to be a bargain price back in 2008. I didn't go for an equivalent used M3 because I just found it a little mundane, perhaps less interesting in comparison to the Zed, I also fell for the looks over the M3.
Straight away I remember the feeling that certain changes were required but I saw an opportunity. The handling and feel, at lower speeds at least, were below the standard of the Rx8 it replaced and i've summarised what 'I feel' to be the main problems with the standard car, some of the credit here should come from some of the owners on the main forum:
- The rear suspension is way too stiff, this gives the feeling of instability, less traction on bumpy surfaces and of course the ride which is made worse by the fact you sit right at the rear!
- The front suspension is too soft, this can make the car squat under acceleration and lessens feel as the steering goes light over crests.
- The standard front and rear suspension geometry seems to be at odds with each other, the car has significant camber and toe in at the rear compared to the front which I believe is one of the reasons for the handling traits described by Chris, it stops the back from going when a actually you want it to, and the build up of pressure means that when it does go, it goes and it can then be difficult to catch. This is easily adjusted by applying a different set up, which is possible on the standard suspension.
- The Continental M3s supplied with the car as new weren't a good match for the car. A nice set of PS2s or PSS will make a world of difference.
- Gearchange, isn't very nice when driving in the urban environment, main problem is the CDV fitted by BMW and also the biting point of the travel from floor to the biting point is quite long making it easy to kangaroo the car especially 1st to 2nd gear, this is something you get used to but on a road test it's an issue.
I probably sound quite negative, but 4 years on and I just can't bring myself to sell the thing despite comparing to plethora of alternatives, I have a friend which is good for that! I agree that I think these cars were a missed opportunity for BMW to create something special but that doesn't mean they have to stay that way, BMW provided a good base, and importantly the used price point gives any owner the opportunity to make improvements to the topping. Yes, you could argue the same for the Me but in my opinion they do look significantly better and are arguably offer more of an occasion to drive than the M3, I think they have aged quite well, they are largely reliable and since 2008 prices have remained stable and they haven't fallen into the wrong hands.
The changes I made to mine in light of the above weren't outrageously priced and parts for these cars don't seem to depreciate. The way I have mine now I think it punches well above it's weight and I'm struggling to replace it with anything.
The Z3M Coupe that you and others rave about wasn't really any better in the handling department, a bit of a soppy dog in comparison. To get the best from them you also need to apply some choice modifications.
I guess to sum up, I'm trying to say that these make a great used buy.
Chris, can I ask, what has brought on the need to criticse so many of PH's so called favoured cars, is this a ratings thing? I would like to see a video like you did with the MX5? I hope you take the time to reply.
I'm not sure I can tell you that you are wrong, I've had to modify mine to make it suitable for my liking, ride and handling has always irked me and as you said in the MX5 article that kind of defeats the purpose as you refer only to the standard car.
As a new buy, I agree it made little sense against an M3, it didn't offer anything really extra unless simply you just wanted to buy something different, or something with a different image. With the Roadster at least you were able to take the roof off.
My Coupe was a used purchase at what I considered to be a bargain price back in 2008. I didn't go for an equivalent used M3 because I just found it a little mundane, perhaps less interesting in comparison to the Zed, I also fell for the looks over the M3.
Straight away I remember the feeling that certain changes were required but I saw an opportunity. The handling and feel, at lower speeds at least, were below the standard of the Rx8 it replaced and i've summarised what 'I feel' to be the main problems with the standard car, some of the credit here should come from some of the owners on the main forum:
- The rear suspension is way too stiff, this gives the feeling of instability, less traction on bumpy surfaces and of course the ride which is made worse by the fact you sit right at the rear!
- The front suspension is too soft, this can make the car squat under acceleration and lessens feel as the steering goes light over crests.
- The standard front and rear suspension geometry seems to be at odds with each other, the car has significant camber and toe in at the rear compared to the front which I believe is one of the reasons for the handling traits described by Chris, it stops the back from going when a actually you want it to, and the build up of pressure means that when it does go, it goes and it can then be difficult to catch. This is easily adjusted by applying a different set up, which is possible on the standard suspension.
- The Continental M3s supplied with the car as new weren't a good match for the car. A nice set of PS2s or PSS will make a world of difference.
- Gearchange, isn't very nice when driving in the urban environment, main problem is the CDV fitted by BMW and also the biting point of the travel from floor to the biting point is quite long making it easy to kangaroo the car especially 1st to 2nd gear, this is something you get used to but on a road test it's an issue.
I probably sound quite negative, but 4 years on and I just can't bring myself to sell the thing despite comparing to plethora of alternatives, I have a friend which is good for that! I agree that I think these cars were a missed opportunity for BMW to create something special but that doesn't mean they have to stay that way, BMW provided a good base, and importantly the used price point gives any owner the opportunity to make improvements to the topping. Yes, you could argue the same for the Me but in my opinion they do look significantly better and are arguably offer more of an occasion to drive than the M3, I think they have aged quite well, they are largely reliable and since 2008 prices have remained stable and they haven't fallen into the wrong hands.
The changes I made to mine in light of the above weren't outrageously priced and parts for these cars don't seem to depreciate. The way I have mine now I think it punches well above it's weight and I'm struggling to replace it with anything.
The Z3M Coupe that you and others rave about wasn't really any better in the handling department, a bit of a soppy dog in comparison. To get the best from them you also need to apply some choice modifications.
I guess to sum up, I'm trying to say that these make a great used buy.
Chris, can I ask, what has brought on the need to criticse so many of PH's so called favoured cars, is this a ratings thing? I would like to see a video like you did with the MX5? I hope you take the time to reply.
Edited by daz4m on Thursday 6th September 18:08
p4cks said:
I have a Z4 Coupe and chose the 3.0Si over the M as the running costs and fuel consumption didn't justify the extra money on purchase, and neither are that exciting to drive (applicable to Z4s in general). Neither are particularly a driver's car, and dare I say it, they're somewhat dull.
I am sorry you find the Z4 dull, i thought after selling my TVR & getting a z4m roadster i would find that dull but i dont, maybe i am still in the honeymoon bit then?Its funny but when i get in the Z4 after our Audi TT-S i find the zed far more of a challenge to drive after the TT... jesus i seem to have an obsession with hairdressers cars now!! can i have my Cerb back please!
daz4m said:
Hi Chris,
I'm not sure I can tell you that you are wrong, I've had to modify mine to make it suitable for my liking, ride and handling has always irked me and as you said in the MX5 article that kind of defeats the purpose as you refer only to the standard car.
As a new buy, I agree it made little sense against an M3, it didn't offer anything really extra unless simply you just wanted to buy something different, or something with a different image. With the Roadster at least you were able to take the roof off.
My Coupe was a used purchase at what I considered to be a bargain price back in 2008. I didn't go for an equivalent used M3 because I just found it a little mundane, perhaps less interesting in comparison to the Zed, I also fell for the looks over the M3.
Straight away I remember the feeling that certain changes were required but I saw an opportunity. The handling and feel, at lower speeds at least, were below the standard of the Rx8 it replaced and i've summarised what 'I feel' to be the main problems with the standard car, some of the credit here should come from some of the owners on the main forum:
- The rear suspension is way too stiff, this gives the feeling of instability, less traction on bumpy surfaces and of course the ride which is made worse by the fact you sit right at the rear!
- The front suspension is too soft, this can make the car squat under acceleration and lessens feel as the steering goes light over crests.
- The standard front and rear suspension geometry seems to be at odds with each other, the car has significant camber and toe in at the rear compared to the front which I believe is one of the reasons for the handling traits described by Chris, it stops the back from going when you want it too but the build up of pressure means that when it does go, it goes and it can then be difficult to catch. This is easily adjusted.
- The Continental M3s supplied with the car as new weren't a good match for the car. A nice set of PS2s or PSS will make a world of difference.
- Gearchange, isn't very nice when driving in the urban environment, main problem is the CDV fitted by BMW and also the biting point of the travel from floor to the biting point is quite long making it easy to kangaroo the car especially 1st to 2nd gear, this is something you get used to but on a road test it's an issue.
I probably sound quite negative, but 4 years on and I just can't bring myself to sell the thing despite comparing to plethora of alternatives, I have a friend which is good for that! I agree that I think these cars were a missed opportunity for BMW to create something special but that doesn't mean they have to stay that way, BMW provided a good base, and importantly the used price point gives any owner the opportunity to make improvements to the topping. In my opinion they look better and are arguably offer more of an occasion to drive than the M3, I think they have aged quite well, they are largely reliable and since 2008 prices have remained stable and they haven't fallen into the wrong hands.
The changes I made to mine in light of the above weren't outrageously priced and parts for these cars don't seem to depreciate. The way I have mine now I think it punches well above it's weight and I'm struggling to replace it with anything.
The Z3M Coupe that you and others rave about wasn't really any better in the handling department, a bit of a soppy dog in comparison. To get the best from them you also need to apply some choice modifications.
I guess to sum up, I'm trying to say that these make a great used buy.
Chris, can I ask, what has brought on the need to criticse so many of PH's so called favoured cars, is this a ratings thing? I would like to see a video like you did with the MX5? I hope you take the time to reply.
Cracking, detailed response: thanks a lot.I'm not sure I can tell you that you are wrong, I've had to modify mine to make it suitable for my liking, ride and handling has always irked me and as you said in the MX5 article that kind of defeats the purpose as you refer only to the standard car.
As a new buy, I agree it made little sense against an M3, it didn't offer anything really extra unless simply you just wanted to buy something different, or something with a different image. With the Roadster at least you were able to take the roof off.
My Coupe was a used purchase at what I considered to be a bargain price back in 2008. I didn't go for an equivalent used M3 because I just found it a little mundane, perhaps less interesting in comparison to the Zed, I also fell for the looks over the M3.
Straight away I remember the feeling that certain changes were required but I saw an opportunity. The handling and feel, at lower speeds at least, were below the standard of the Rx8 it replaced and i've summarised what 'I feel' to be the main problems with the standard car, some of the credit here should come from some of the owners on the main forum:
- The rear suspension is way too stiff, this gives the feeling of instability, less traction on bumpy surfaces and of course the ride which is made worse by the fact you sit right at the rear!
- The front suspension is too soft, this can make the car squat under acceleration and lessens feel as the steering goes light over crests.
- The standard front and rear suspension geometry seems to be at odds with each other, the car has significant camber and toe in at the rear compared to the front which I believe is one of the reasons for the handling traits described by Chris, it stops the back from going when you want it too but the build up of pressure means that when it does go, it goes and it can then be difficult to catch. This is easily adjusted.
- The Continental M3s supplied with the car as new weren't a good match for the car. A nice set of PS2s or PSS will make a world of difference.
- Gearchange, isn't very nice when driving in the urban environment, main problem is the CDV fitted by BMW and also the biting point of the travel from floor to the biting point is quite long making it easy to kangaroo the car especially 1st to 2nd gear, this is something you get used to but on a road test it's an issue.
I probably sound quite negative, but 4 years on and I just can't bring myself to sell the thing despite comparing to plethora of alternatives, I have a friend which is good for that! I agree that I think these cars were a missed opportunity for BMW to create something special but that doesn't mean they have to stay that way, BMW provided a good base, and importantly the used price point gives any owner the opportunity to make improvements to the topping. In my opinion they look better and are arguably offer more of an occasion to drive than the M3, I think they have aged quite well, they are largely reliable and since 2008 prices have remained stable and they haven't fallen into the wrong hands.
The changes I made to mine in light of the above weren't outrageously priced and parts for these cars don't seem to depreciate. The way I have mine now I think it punches well above it's weight and I'm struggling to replace it with anything.
The Z3M Coupe that you and others rave about wasn't really any better in the handling department, a bit of a soppy dog in comparison. To get the best from them you also need to apply some choice modifications.
I guess to sum up, I'm trying to say that these make a great used buy.
Chris, can I ask, what has brought on the need to criticse so many of PH's so called favoured cars, is this a ratings thing? I would like to see a video like you did with the MX5? I hope you take the time to reply.
Edited by daz4m on Thursday 6th September 18:04
And this isn't trolling or rude criticism: it's hopefully a way of identifying cars that I, and other members of the PH team, have never quite understood, and which have a strong following - and then getting people like your good self to explain what we're missing.
It is no way an attempt to just wind-people-up. There are few things I enjoy more than intelligent, cogent explanations for types of car-love that I don't currently understand.
If this was trolling, I'd just do the X6 every week.
When you think about it, your extensive list of observations and subsequent alterations to the Z4M does vindicate the format.
Still find it strange that BMW M signed it off like that.
Great, thanks for the response! 
It surprises me too, part of me wonders if it was set up more as a US market car and due to the relatively low volume they never bothered changing it for Europe.
I spent a bit of time comparing the geometry to the M3 CSL and was surprised with what I found, have you ever driven one on smooth track, any feedback? Generally even with the standard set up it does seem to improve on the E46?
It surprises me too, part of me wonders if it was set up more as a US market car and due to the relatively low volume they never bothered changing it for Europe.
I spent a bit of time comparing the geometry to the M3 CSL and was surprised with what I found, have you ever driven one on smooth track, any feedback? Generally even with the standard set up it does seem to improve on the E46?
I love mine for its flawes. I like the rarity, I love the design, I love the fact that you have to learn to live with the car, rather than have it perfect out of the box; for me that makes it more special. It becomes your car.
Can't really explain its attraction to me other than that.
Can't really explain its attraction to me other than that.
daz4m said:
Great, thanks for the response!
It surprises me too, part of me wonders if it was set up more as a US market car and due to the relatively low volume they never bothered changing it for Europe.
I spent a bit of time comparing the geometry to the M3 CSL and was surprised with what I found, have you ever driven one on smooth track, any feedback? Generally even with the standard set up it does seem to improve on the E46?
Reading your post, the suspension thing sounds a bit like what Evo were saying about the M Coupe back in the early 2000s. Very hard rear end and a soft front = oversteer and biddable fun.It surprises me too, part of me wonders if it was set up more as a US market car and due to the relatively low volume they never bothered changing it for Europe.
I spent a bit of time comparing the geometry to the M3 CSL and was surprised with what I found, have you ever driven one on smooth track, any feedback? Generally even with the standard set up it does seem to improve on the E46?
Did BMW just go with the idea that the M3 would be the better car while the Coupe would just be a bit lairy and fun as that'd worked well on the previous generation?
When I see a z4mc I get a little excited.
When I see a cayman/boxster its a non event.
When I see a z4mc I know its likely the person who owns it bought it because they specifically wanted it.
When I see a cayman/boxster I know its likely the person who owns it bought it so that they could tell people they own a porsche.
The z4mc isnt available as an auto (afaik?), this is a big win.
I havent driven one myself but have had a brisk ride. Seemed pretty sweet to me
I'd have a pleasant warm feeling inside if I had one parked in my garage
When I see a cayman/boxster its a non event.
When I see a z4mc I know its likely the person who owns it bought it because they specifically wanted it.
When I see a cayman/boxster I know its likely the person who owns it bought it so that they could tell people they own a porsche.
The z4mc isnt available as an auto (afaik?), this is a big win.
I havent driven one myself but have had a brisk ride. Seemed pretty sweet to me
I'd have a pleasant warm feeling inside if I had one parked in my garage
CampDavid said:
Reading your post, the suspension thing sounds a bit like what Evo were saying about the M Coupe back in the early 2000s. Very hard rear end and a soft front = oversteer and biddable fun.
Did BMW just go with the idea that the M3 would be the better car while the Coupe would just be a bit lairy and fun as that'd worked well on the previous generation?
The Z4M is far stiffer than the Z3M, there was a comparison written by a member on the OC who owns both. I'll see if I can dig it out.Did BMW just go with the idea that the M3 would be the better car while the Coupe would just be a bit lairy and fun as that'd worked well on the previous generation?
The rear geo is too safe for it be as prperly lairy as I described, lots of rear camber and toe in.
It's definitely a car suited to smooth flowing roads.
It performed brilliantly at a Car Limits day, and was great fun at the ring. But, if I was going for hoon on British b-roads I'd prefer an mx5
Fortunately for me, it's not a daily car so I can live with the suspension's shortcomings. If I drove it more I'd probably do what daz4m's done. For a bit of weekend fun, or a blast down to France, you can't beat it.
I sat in one at Goodwood FOS 2006 and thought "nice, but not at £44k thankyou!". A few years later it starts making more sense...
I always thought that my Z3m was a bit of a handful, and more 'snap you've spun it' than the Z4 is. When Evo drove it in the "look which used BMW you can buy for 1-series money" they said it had "wonderfully accessible oversteer". Go figure.
It performed brilliantly at a Car Limits day, and was great fun at the ring. But, if I was going for hoon on British b-roads I'd prefer an mx5
Fortunately for me, it's not a daily car so I can live with the suspension's shortcomings. If I drove it more I'd probably do what daz4m's done. For a bit of weekend fun, or a blast down to France, you can't beat it.
I sat in one at Goodwood FOS 2006 and thought "nice, but not at £44k thankyou!". A few years later it starts making more sense...
I always thought that my Z3m was a bit of a handful, and more 'snap you've spun it' than the Z4 is. When Evo drove it in the "look which used BMW you can buy for 1-series money" they said it had "wonderfully accessible oversteer". Go figure.
daz4m said:
Hi Chris,
I'm not sure I can tell you that you are wrong, I've had to modify mine to make it suitable for my liking, ride and handling has always irked me and as you said in the MX5 article that kind of defeats the purpose as you refer only to the standard car.
As a new buy, I agree it made little sense against an M3, it didn't offer anything really extra unless simply you just wanted to buy something different, or something with a different image. With the Roadster at least you were able to take the roof off.
My Coupe was a used purchase at what I considered to be a bargain price back in 2008. I didn't go for an equivalent used M3 because I just found it a little mundane, perhaps less interesting in comparison to the Zed, I also fell for the looks over the M3.
Straight away I remember the feeling that certain changes were required but I saw an opportunity. The handling and feel, at lower speeds at least, were below the standard of the Rx8 it replaced and i've summarised what 'I feel' to be the main problems with the standard car, some of the credit here should come from some of the owners on the main forum:
- The rear suspension is way too stiff, this gives the feeling of instability, less traction on bumpy surfaces and of course the ride which is made worse by the fact you sit right at the rear!
- The front suspension is too soft, this can make the car squat under acceleration and lessens feel as the steering goes light over crests.
- The standard front and rear suspension geometry seems to be at odds with each other, the car has significant camber and toe in at the rear compared to the front which I believe is one of the reasons for the handling traits described by Chris, it stops the back from going when a actually you want it to, and the build up of pressure means that when it does go, it goes and it can then be difficult to catch. This is easily adjusted by applying a different set up, which is possible on the standard suspension.
- The Continental M3s supplied with the car as new weren't a good match for the car. A nice set of PS2s or PSS will make a world of difference.
- Gearchange, isn't very nice when driving in the urban environment, main problem is the CDV fitted by BMW and also the biting point of the travel from floor to the biting point is quite long making it easy to kangaroo the car especially 1st to 2nd gear, this is something you get used to but on a road test it's an issue.
I probably sound quite negative, but 4 years on and I just can't bring myself to sell the thing despite comparing to plethora of alternatives, I have a friend which is good for that! I agree that I think these cars were a missed opportunity for BMW to create something special but that doesn't mean they have to stay that way, BMW provided a good base, and importantly the used price point gives any owner the opportunity to make improvements to the topping. Yes, you could argue the same for the Me but in my opinion they do look significantly better and are arguably offer more of an occasion to drive than the M3, I think they have aged quite well, they are largely reliable and since 2008 prices have remained stable and they haven't fallen into the wrong hands.
The changes I made to mine in light of the above weren't outrageously priced and parts for these cars don't seem to depreciate. The way I have mine now I think it punches well above it's weight and I'm struggling to replace it with anything.
The Z3M Coupe that you and others rave about wasn't really any better in the handling department, a bit of a soppy dog in comparison. To get the best from them you also need to apply some choice modifications.
I guess to sum up, I'm trying to say that these make a great used buy.
Chris, can I ask, what has brought on the need to criticse so many of PH's so called favoured cars, is this a ratings thing? I would like to see a video like you did with the MX5? I hope you take the time to reply.
Daz, the M doesn't have a CDV....does it? I certainly can't feel one in mine.I'm not sure I can tell you that you are wrong, I've had to modify mine to make it suitable for my liking, ride and handling has always irked me and as you said in the MX5 article that kind of defeats the purpose as you refer only to the standard car.
As a new buy, I agree it made little sense against an M3, it didn't offer anything really extra unless simply you just wanted to buy something different, or something with a different image. With the Roadster at least you were able to take the roof off.
My Coupe was a used purchase at what I considered to be a bargain price back in 2008. I didn't go for an equivalent used M3 because I just found it a little mundane, perhaps less interesting in comparison to the Zed, I also fell for the looks over the M3.
Straight away I remember the feeling that certain changes were required but I saw an opportunity. The handling and feel, at lower speeds at least, were below the standard of the Rx8 it replaced and i've summarised what 'I feel' to be the main problems with the standard car, some of the credit here should come from some of the owners on the main forum:
- The rear suspension is way too stiff, this gives the feeling of instability, less traction on bumpy surfaces and of course the ride which is made worse by the fact you sit right at the rear!
- The front suspension is too soft, this can make the car squat under acceleration and lessens feel as the steering goes light over crests.
- The standard front and rear suspension geometry seems to be at odds with each other, the car has significant camber and toe in at the rear compared to the front which I believe is one of the reasons for the handling traits described by Chris, it stops the back from going when a actually you want it to, and the build up of pressure means that when it does go, it goes and it can then be difficult to catch. This is easily adjusted by applying a different set up, which is possible on the standard suspension.
- The Continental M3s supplied with the car as new weren't a good match for the car. A nice set of PS2s or PSS will make a world of difference.
- Gearchange, isn't very nice when driving in the urban environment, main problem is the CDV fitted by BMW and also the biting point of the travel from floor to the biting point is quite long making it easy to kangaroo the car especially 1st to 2nd gear, this is something you get used to but on a road test it's an issue.
I probably sound quite negative, but 4 years on and I just can't bring myself to sell the thing despite comparing to plethora of alternatives, I have a friend which is good for that! I agree that I think these cars were a missed opportunity for BMW to create something special but that doesn't mean they have to stay that way, BMW provided a good base, and importantly the used price point gives any owner the opportunity to make improvements to the topping. Yes, you could argue the same for the Me but in my opinion they do look significantly better and are arguably offer more of an occasion to drive than the M3, I think they have aged quite well, they are largely reliable and since 2008 prices have remained stable and they haven't fallen into the wrong hands.
The changes I made to mine in light of the above weren't outrageously priced and parts for these cars don't seem to depreciate. The way I have mine now I think it punches well above it's weight and I'm struggling to replace it with anything.
The Z3M Coupe that you and others rave about wasn't really any better in the handling department, a bit of a soppy dog in comparison. To get the best from them you also need to apply some choice modifications.
I guess to sum up, I'm trying to say that these make a great used buy.
Chris, can I ask, what has brought on the need to criticse so many of PH's so called favoured cars, is this a ratings thing? I would like to see a video like you did with the MX5? I hope you take the time to reply.
Edited by daz4m on Thursday 6th September 18:08
I'd agree with you on the rear camber - catch the car in the right/wrong light and it actually looks extreme.
Either way, it's a car full of character. It's not perfect and for that reason, I love it. It's not a precision tool but it's no blunt instrument either - if you know how to get the most out of it, it'll see off most things on a B road...and you'll have a smile on your face and a pumping heart.
Did I mention that engine too?
I think Harris is totally correct on this one. As a previous owner of a Breadvan I have to agree that the Z3 coupe just looked better...individual. The Z4 coupe is a poor replica.
I am glad I read this article in time. I went to see a Z4M coupe with yellow and black seats last weekend but was put off by the bad paint job and uneven panel gaps indicating previous damage.
For not much more cash you can get a 997.
After reading Harris's views and numerous similar reports over the years about the ability of the car to understeer I think that these overpriced, cramped and poorly packaged cars (with 23mph) just do not offer any advantage over a good M3 E46 or an early 997.
When they get to sub 10K then that is a different matter
I am glad I read this article in time. I went to see a Z4M coupe with yellow and black seats last weekend but was put off by the bad paint job and uneven panel gaps indicating previous damage.
For not much more cash you can get a 997.
After reading Harris's views and numerous similar reports over the years about the ability of the car to understeer I think that these overpriced, cramped and poorly packaged cars (with 23mph) just do not offer any advantage over a good M3 E46 or an early 997.
When they get to sub 10K then that is a different matter
Chris,
I only got my M coupe 10 days ago - previous w/end car was a Chim 450, and I had a Cayman S a few years back, plus some s/c Jags in between - so perhaps it's a little premature for me to be making any definitive judgements about it. By the way, how long did you drive the press car you had for? And how long ago was that - 6 years? That's some memory you have chap
Cheers
I only got my M coupe 10 days ago - previous w/end car was a Chim 450, and I had a Cayman S a few years back, plus some s/c Jags in between - so perhaps it's a little premature for me to be making any definitive judgements about it. By the way, how long did you drive the press car you had for? And how long ago was that - 6 years? That's some memory you have chap
Cheers
The problem with the Z4M, which puts it at an unfair advantage to most other ///M's or most other sportscars for that matter, is that it never got the chance to evolve. I'm not sure why, not enough demand, the E46 M3 leftover parts bin running low, end of the E86\86 cycle?? There were no facelifts or "Limited" editions which usually bring with it minor tweaks along the way, remediating the problems identified during its early life.
scz4 said:
The problem with the Z4M, which puts it at an unfair advantage to most other ///M's or most other sportscars for that matter, is that it never got the chance to evolve. I'm not sure why, not enough demand, the E46 M3 leftover parts bin running low, end of the E86\86 cycle?? There were no facelifts or "Limited" editions which usually bring with it minor tweaks along the way, remediating the problems identified during its early life.
It should n't need to evolve at that price. There is no real excuse for BMW developing a car with the same handling characteristics that the Z1 had 20 years earlierEdited by sennasurgeon on Thursday 6th September 20:20
It's funny this, I bought an edition of EVO from 2006 recently from a guy on ebay, it's the one where they tested the Z4M roadster against the Boxster S, the Alpina Z4 and the TVR Tuscan. The Z4M and the Boxster S tied as 5 star cars albeit very different in their execution. Ultimately the overall thrill of driving went to the Z4M.
I believe it was the same for Top Gear and 5th Gear at the time. I am also lead to believe that as a drivers car the Coupe is better again than the Roadster.
I had a choice back in December and was very close to buying a 987 boxster, a friend of mine owned one and I really was struggling to find a replacement for my S2000 that would excite me as much and be as reliable / useable, the boxster as nice as it is just couldn't do that for me.
The Z4M in my own words is a brute of a car, it is blessed with one of the greatest engines ever made IMO but with a chassis that for once people aren't saying could handle more power, but probably has touch too much at times.
It isn't perfect but does perfect really thrill? A boxster didn't thrill me.
Is Chris on the wind? MX5....Z4M Coupe....
I believe it was the same for Top Gear and 5th Gear at the time. I am also lead to believe that as a drivers car the Coupe is better again than the Roadster.
I had a choice back in December and was very close to buying a 987 boxster, a friend of mine owned one and I really was struggling to find a replacement for my S2000 that would excite me as much and be as reliable / useable, the boxster as nice as it is just couldn't do that for me.
The Z4M in my own words is a brute of a car, it is blessed with one of the greatest engines ever made IMO but with a chassis that for once people aren't saying could handle more power, but probably has touch too much at times.
It isn't perfect but does perfect really thrill? A boxster didn't thrill me.
Is Chris on the wind? MX5....Z4M Coupe....
Edited by Urban Sports on Thursday 6th September 19:47
dtrump said:
When I see a z4mc I get a little excited.
When I see a cayman/boxster its a non event.
When I see a z4mc I know its likely the person who owns it bought it because they specifically wanted it.
When I see a cayman/boxster I know its likely the person who owns it bought it so that they could tell people they own a porsche.
The z4mc isnt available as an auto (afaik?), this is a big win.
I havent driven one myself but have had a brisk ride. Seemed pretty sweet to me
I'd have a pleasant warm feeling inside if I had one parked in my garage
FWIW, I nearly didn't buy the Cayman precisely because it was a Porsche.... But then I made the mistake of driving it, and at the time and for the price, nothing else came close for every day driving..... 7,000 miles in 4 months..... I loved the Lotus' but for everyday use and that many miles, I thought it would grate. Evora wasn't an option in 2007.When I see a cayman/boxster its a non event.
When I see a z4mc I know its likely the person who owns it bought it because they specifically wanted it.
When I see a cayman/boxster I know its likely the person who owns it bought it so that they could tell people they own a porsche.
The z4mc isnt available as an auto (afaik?), this is a big win.
I havent driven one myself but have had a brisk ride. Seemed pretty sweet to me
I'd have a pleasant warm feeling inside if I had one parked in my garage
As surprising as it may seem, some people don't buy their cars because of what other people think, or how it looks (or they look in it), but because they like how the car is to drive....
dtrump said:
When I see a z4mc I get a little excited.
When I see a cayman/boxster its a non event.
When I see a z4mc I know its likely the person who owns it bought it because they specifically wanted it.
When I see a cayman/boxster I know its likely the person who owns it bought it so that they could tell people they own a porsch
This sWhen I see a cayman/boxster its a non event.
When I see a z4mc I know its likely the person who owns it bought it because they specifically wanted it.
When I see a cayman/boxster I know its likely the person who owns it bought it so that they could tell people they own a porsch
t still annoys me! I bought a cayman s over a 911 and the Z4M because it's a better car to drive by a long way. Edited by CJP80 on Thursday 6th September 20:12
i bought a z4m coupe less than 2 weeks ago, 44k, 56' plate, blue, black leather, few extras, from BMW, £16.5k... and i am totally loving it!
a few comments:
- yes it is spikey to drive - understeer/ oversteer / figgety, especially in the wet , if not managed will kangaroo when cold, gearbox better when warm - all which i enjoy because it is engaging and makes me become more focused on the car - it doesn't have idrive, all the sport button does is sharpen the throttle, mech diff, tc off and enjoy!
- it does tramline/ camber follow but also as commented feels more at ease slightly quicker
- love the engine noise/performance and low down driving position, got in my BMW e36 323 coupe and felt on top of the car rather than in it
- not sure it will depcreciate that fast at 6 years old, i bought the car a week after it had been reduced from £18990 so feel like it was an amazing car for the money of a newish sensible family commuter (couldn't bring myself to do it & don't have to cart ppl particularly so why not a proper coupe)
- i like the german tvr likening, i use the car daily so need it to be hassle free
- read many of the comments and as always with life each person has their own voice always welcome to hear yours!
a few comments:
- yes it is spikey to drive - understeer/ oversteer / figgety, especially in the wet , if not managed will kangaroo when cold, gearbox better when warm - all which i enjoy because it is engaging and makes me become more focused on the car - it doesn't have idrive, all the sport button does is sharpen the throttle, mech diff, tc off and enjoy!
- it does tramline/ camber follow but also as commented feels more at ease slightly quicker
- love the engine noise/performance and low down driving position, got in my BMW e36 323 coupe and felt on top of the car rather than in it
- not sure it will depcreciate that fast at 6 years old, i bought the car a week after it had been reduced from £18990 so feel like it was an amazing car for the money of a newish sensible family commuter (couldn't bring myself to do it & don't have to cart ppl particularly so why not a proper coupe)
- i like the german tvr likening, i use the car daily so need it to be hassle free
- read many of the comments and as always with life each person has their own voice
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