"Full Service History"
Discussion
POORCARDEALER said:
masermartin said:
POORCARDEALER said:
What many PHer's fail to take into account is a car to many people is a form of transport, nothing more...thus they are not going to file every tax disc (as was) into a leather bound A4 binder so the next owner can pull themselves off over it.
Does that mean cars that don't have a full service history should be advertised as having a full service history, then, because most punters don't care about keeping the documentation for their second most expensive purchase?I prefer to buy private and avoid dealers as much as possible; enthusiast forums and places like PH, in my opinion, offer a better quality of car that has been looked after by someone who actually cares.
Any dealer can stamp a 'history' book, I would much rather see a folder of old invoices etc.
Actually a previous Mx5 I bought had no book, just a folder of receipts stretching back to its import and the Japanese History before that, which I couldn't read but it was nice to have!
Any dealer can stamp a 'history' book, I would much rather see a folder of old invoices etc.
Actually a previous Mx5 I bought had no book, just a folder of receipts stretching back to its import and the Japanese History before that, which I couldn't read but it was nice to have!
Condi said:
If you're that unhappy why not do it yourself??
My old mans always been the same - he buys a brand new car then runs it for (current one 20years) and self services it from day 1 - even though that means invalidating the warranty. He will never change simply wants to know the job is actually done and done properly - also I'm fairly sure he very much gets satisfaction out of doing it himself. Condi said:
anonymous said:
[redacted]
If you're that unhappy why not do it yourself??My wife's first Honda was spot-on all round. When it came time to change it she didn't even want to consider anything else. Honda then closed the dealer down.
I think if nothing else, a car has proof of oil changes, maybe a cam belt then the rest I am not bothered about.
I just sold our Galaxy, serviced by myself every year for the last six years, Ford for the first two, so it had eight oil changes in its life, the chap who bought it was well happy with that, the proof was receipts and the labels from the oil and filters with date and mileage written on.
I had one "buyer" say he will do me a favour and pay me 1000 less than it was advertised because it didnt have FSH "service Would b betta if ford" he said.
So, someone who was actually buying it saw the value but the other idiot was just a chancer trying to use it as leverage, I just informed him the car was sold for £100 less than the advertised price.
I just sold our Galaxy, serviced by myself every year for the last six years, Ford for the first two, so it had eight oil changes in its life, the chap who bought it was well happy with that, the proof was receipts and the labels from the oil and filters with date and mileage written on.
I had one "buyer" say he will do me a favour and pay me 1000 less than it was advertised because it didnt have FSH "service Would b betta if ford" he said.
So, someone who was actually buying it saw the value but the other idiot was just a chancer trying to use it as leverage, I just informed him the car was sold for £100 less than the advertised price.
VeeFource said:
KingNothing said:
My car is serviced on miles or age, whichever first, it had an annual service just before I bought it in January, but it's technically due a mileage one now, but I'm not paying close to £500 for a service on a car which has done only a few thousand miles since it's last service and then again later in the year, so have done an oil filter and oil change myself and documented it, it will get a full service in December/January and get stamped in the book. If it effects resale, meh, not bothered.
How can it be due a mileage one now if it's only done a few thousand since the last service?Sheepshanks said:
KingNothing said:
Because it's service schedule says annually OR mileage, whichever first. It was done in January which was it's annual service, but it's now onto one of it's mileage markers so I'm thinking theoretically it should be done.
You do one or the other, not both!Full Service History simply means that there is a record of each and every service that the car has had. The term FSH tell you nothing about the quality or frequency of the servicing, just that the servicing was documented.
The record could be anything from a handwritten note in the service book to a main dealer stamp backed up with receipts.
The number of services could be anything from "yeah we changed the oil once, 15 years ago" to servicing above and beyond the manufacturers recommended schedule.
If a car has had one service in twenty years and the service is documented, it has FSH. If a car has had twenty services in twenty years, but only has documentation for nineteen of those, then it does not have FSH.
Getting your knickers in a twist because sellers list FSH when they mean FSH as above and that doesn't match your ideal of a perfectly documented SH per the manufacturer's schedule really only affects your knickers and by direct consequence your blood pressure. The rest of us just take the claims with a pinch of salt, look at the car and if its OK, read the history.
The record could be anything from a handwritten note in the service book to a main dealer stamp backed up with receipts.
The number of services could be anything from "yeah we changed the oil once, 15 years ago" to servicing above and beyond the manufacturers recommended schedule.
If a car has had one service in twenty years and the service is documented, it has FSH. If a car has had twenty services in twenty years, but only has documentation for nineteen of those, then it does not have FSH.
Getting your knickers in a twist because sellers list FSH when they mean FSH as above and that doesn't match your ideal of a perfectly documented SH per the manufacturer's schedule really only affects your knickers and by direct consequence your blood pressure. The rest of us just take the claims with a pinch of salt, look at the car and if its OK, read the history.
Main dealer servicing is not always the best for older cars. I know people who will only let BMW service their 12 plus year old M5's. I see this as not being necessary, how many mechanics working in these dealerships will have actually worked on one? I'd rather trust an enthusiast or independent who has worked on the this type of car. Newer cars aren't so much of a concern, but many older cars I expect will be similar.
POORCARDEALER said:
What many PHer's fail to take into account is a car to many people is a form of transport, nothing more...thus they are not going to file every tax disc (as was) into a leather bound A4 binder so the next owner can pull themselves off over it.
I had a beautiful Ferrari 328 for sale that a moron didnt buy becuase the car missed a service 10 yers previously when in storage and not been used...the car he ended up buying wasnt anything like as nice as mine, but at least it had an extra stamp in the book...
Completely agree, however having all those tax disks and MOT certificates and every bill, receipt, and bit of paper somehow magically seems to make a car far more "valuable" regardless of condition...I had a beautiful Ferrari 328 for sale that a moron didnt buy becuase the car missed a service 10 yers previously when in storage and not been used...the car he ended up buying wasnt anything like as nice as mine, but at least it had an extra stamp in the book...
Never quite fathomed it myself, didn't someone say recently with a used Ferrari something link "you're paying for the (service) history, the car comes free"?
Conversely the 911 I got recently has a 24 month service interval (2003 chassis, it's never hit the mileage "limit") yet the previous owner had it done on 12 months like clockwork.
Can only be a good thing for paperwork fetishists!
It's an interesting one though isn't it.
It seems like "FSH" means many things to many people. I'm firmly of the view that it means the book is stamped, and the service is done (including everything that's necessary for that service) on time as per the manufacturers recommendations be that mileage or age related.
If there's a stack of paperwork with it too, all the better.
It seems like "FSH" means many things to many people. I'm firmly of the view that it means the book is stamped, and the service is done (including everything that's necessary for that service) on time as per the manufacturers recommendations be that mileage or age related.
If there's a stack of paperwork with it too, all the better.
As someone mentioned earlier, I use main dealers only for the scheduled stamps only. For anything outside that I prefer to use an independent that specialises in that make. They are often better and more experienced. On top of that, you can often actually speak to the person doing the work, not some front-man in a suit.
As for people who DIY, that's a tricky one. For every holy grail of the retired marine engineer who does everything by the book there must be thousands of people who really ought leave the tools in the box.
As for people who DIY, that's a tricky one. For every holy grail of the retired marine engineer who does everything by the book there must be thousands of people who really ought leave the tools in the box.
Craikeybaby said:
An independent garage can apply to Mazda to be able to update the digital service manual. My local garage did this and said it cost about £30.
The main dealer my 2007 CX-7 goes to (it's still in the family but not mine really now) will give you a print out. I bought a generic blank service book because I think it's a nice quick reference record. Using the print out they retrospectively stamped it up and stamp it for every current service.The car is approaching a decade old and with every receipt from me and my FIL it's got a nice fat history file. Doesn't necessarily make it worth more but it's just good to keep everything.
How do we feel about photos in the service history?
My 2001 MGF has what I would say is a good service history. It's never missed a major service but by its nature is a low miles summer car it has by the look of it been laid up and missed a service or two.
The owner before me was an engineer and as he said to me "curious" so when he had the HG changed he photographed the whole procedure. He gave me these pictures the bills and the old HG and bolts.
The service history tells you a lot.
By reading it I know the car was a daily driver for about four years. The owner moved and it continued to get serviced at the supplying dealer - after MG went bust - but was used less often. It skipped a service or two but did tiny miles between them in the low hundreds. It was then sold to the guy who I bought it off who took it to an Indy where it was serviced and repaired properly and routinely.
I was pretty happy with that as a service history.
Edited by wildcat45 on Tuesday 21st July 10:39
wildcat45 said:
How do we feel about photos in the service history?
That's what I've done for this oil change I've just done, didn't have the receipt for the oil filter or the oil itself as I bought them ages ago, so took a few photos of various stages of the job and the mileage at the end, have put it on a sheet of A4 and printed it off and stuck it in a plastic folder with the V5, MOT, insurance docs, etc.I bought a 2007 A3 at the weekend that was advertised with full main dealer service history.
Being ever the sceptic I asked to see the documentation and it was 100% true, every MOT and service has been carried out at the main dealer since it was new. Including a service 3 weeks ago.
Very impressed for a change, although now I feel obliged to keep taking it there to not break the chain.
Being ever the sceptic I asked to see the documentation and it was 100% true, every MOT and service has been carried out at the main dealer since it was new. Including a service 3 weeks ago.
Very impressed for a change, although now I feel obliged to keep taking it there to not break the chain.
Cyder said:
I bought a 2007 A3 at the weekend that was advertised with full main dealer service history.
Being ever the sceptic I asked to see the documentation and it was 100% true, every MOT and service has been carried out at the main dealer since it was new. Including a service 3 weeks ago.
Very impressed for a change, although now I feel obliged to keep taking it there to not break the chain.
haha, I was the same when I got my a8, had all the stamps from the main dealer... then I got the price for the oil and filter change... £680.... quickly changed my tune and it's been to a VAG specialist for the last 3 years and 90,000 miles with no issues! Being ever the sceptic I asked to see the documentation and it was 100% true, every MOT and service has been carried out at the main dealer since it was new. Including a service 3 weeks ago.
Very impressed for a change, although now I feel obliged to keep taking it there to not break the chain.
Who remembers back when the Filofax was the thing to have Volvo service books?
They were loose leafed in a ring binder Filofaxesque type thing . That wouldn't leave the car open to unscrupulous history creation would it?
Slightly off topic but in the late 1980s Volvo offered a "Lifetime Care Warranty" so long as you kept the main dealer FSH. I wonder how a dealer would react if you rocked-up in a 1990 740 or whatever with FSH and demanded a free or discounted fix?
I guess it must be true of Astons and the like, but I wonder how many f any ordinary cars from the 90s, 80s and beyond still have full dealer histories.
They were loose leafed in a ring binder Filofaxesque type thing . That wouldn't leave the car open to unscrupulous history creation would it?
Slightly off topic but in the late 1980s Volvo offered a "Lifetime Care Warranty" so long as you kept the main dealer FSH. I wonder how a dealer would react if you rocked-up in a 1990 740 or whatever with FSH and demanded a free or discounted fix?
I guess it must be true of Astons and the like, but I wonder how many f any ordinary cars from the 90s, 80s and beyond still have full dealer histories.
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