RE: Nissan Hits Back At GT-R Cheat Claims

[Tony*T3]

OJ said:

FishFace said:

JamesK said:

The fact Porsche even made ANY statement about the GT-R is to their permanent shame and humiliation. Such arrogance deserves to be punished and in the eye's of petrolheads everywhere, other than the Porsche fanboys and owners club it has been.

Exactly.

Still love the GT2.

To be honest I'm actually surprised Nissan were rattled enough to issue a response. I personally would have let it run until a few magazines take up the challenge and do a few back to backs around the Ring.

Personally I don't care, I'd still have the Porsche if I had the money to buy either

OJ (Porsche 928 and soon to be Evo 9 owner)

Honour is everything to the Japanese.

[Chris71]

If I was Porsche I'd accept.

[J16GY]

Tahiti said:

If you're going to waste time saying mine's bigger than yours, why don't you just prove it!

I've always been of the impression it's not the size that matters, its what you do with it that counts...? Not that I have an issue with size of course that is!!

[sootyrumble]

Davey S2 said:

sootyrumble said:

Davey S2 said:

VladD said:

The interesting thing about this for me is that Nissan are now seen as a competitor to Porsche. I don't think this has happened before has it? I know the Skylines are very fast, but were they ever considered to be an alternative to a 911?

I dont think they are. Yes you might get a few people who will buy a GTR instead of a 911 but I havent heard of any.

Performance is only one aspect of a cars appeal. The GTR is a massive car compared to a 911 and a lot of people wont like that. Likewise some people wont want a flappy paddle gearbox.

Also a lot of people buy Porsches as its a well known brand with a motorsport herritage second to none.

And yes I'm sure a lot of people would rather put down a set of Porsche car keys on the pub table than ones with a Nissan badge on the fob. That might be vain but it happens with all cars. How many people would rather buy a VW than a cheaper Skoda which is just as good in every respect?

I assume you are/wish you were a porsche driver, thats the sort of snobbery that gets porsche drivers a bad name, I drive an Audi S3 and would be very happy to have a Skoda Octavia VRS i still believe they are one of the best cars around. I only bought the S3 over the Skoda due to it haveing a KKK04 as standard and now running 300BHP where the skoda is limited to around 250 on a standard turbo, people who dangle their keys on the bar need to get a bigger pair of nuts and learn to drive, if you buy a car for its name only you aren't going to drive anywhere near its potential due to worry of scratching it + you may not get the car you would enjoy driving the most. People who truly know cars will allways buy the Porsche for its visceral appeal, posers will buy them because they are idiots but mere mortals like myself would take the GTR every time as its practical and easier to drive at the limit.

Yes I am a Porsche owner as you could see from my profile.

Its not snobbery, its fact. People do buy things for the make / lable / image irrespective of the merits of the product itself.

Remember the Top Gear episode with the Vauxhaull VX220 Turbo where Clarkson got 2 identical jackets, one with an Armani lable and the other with a Millets lable? As I said shallow perhaps but true.

I didnt buy my car for the badge but for what it offered as a whole.

And as for buying a GTR because its easier at the limit thats your choice but I would prefer a car with fewer electronic aids which you have to learn to drive to get the best out of.

This isnt a knock at the GTR by the way. Its an awesome car and the performance bargain of the decade but it just doesnt do it for me on any level. Thats probably why my last car was Lotus Exige rather than a Scooby / Evo.

Sorry still don't follow i looked at your profile and the car is a Cayman the best chassis Porsche has ever produced and then deliberately hamstrung as it is a marketing niche tool only to fill a price gap between Boxer and 911 as to electronic aids i think Porsche rams there cars full of them ie GT2's. You will never get the best out of your Porsche because its not allowed to be the best as it would prove Porsche were wrong in the design of their flagship car and so it is a fancy watch or Armani jacket and nothing more, where as the Nissan is no marketing tool, its been honed across generations like Porsche 911's (911 first produced 1963 Skyline 1969) it is an engineering masterpiece like concorde it defies all the built up expectations and ruling classes, and when it enters the GT class races it will have a similar impact to the Lancia Delta.

[hairykrishna]

Now we just need a "it's on now bh" press release from Porsche and a head to head race around the 'ring. I know it's not going to happen but it'd be great.

[silly chap]

coxyboy83 said:

With all due respect to Nissan the Japs would learn a thing or two from Porsche's factory drivers, although saying that Nissan could probably teach a thing or two to Porsche about trick diff's and various other electronic devices which interfere with a cars natural balance. At the end of the day the two cars are completely different and as someone said earlier, it's not like it's the first time there's been a cheaper car that's been faster, that's not what it's all about. Nissan should stop being so cocky before someone else comes in and pisses on there bonfire, and Porsche should just get over it - it's quicker, big deal??

nothing wrong with nissan's drivers compared to porshce.

the thing that will irritate some is that the (according to sources in japan) new Honda NSX is likely to equal the performance capability of the upcoming GTR V Spec from its first version.

Sounds like Porsche is going to have to open a second front when that rather nice car is released.

[MinusG40]

Why all GTR fan boy don't speak about the R33 story ???? this is a bit strange to forget this very nice story ...
This show how Nissan have made a nurburgring lap score (with Best motoring or as i call they Best Lie Motoring)and give to cars magazine some modified version (and they sell them too in the beginning).
After a certain time Top Gear made an attemp with a car from dealer and couldn't reach any time/performances figures.

And would like too remember you the fact that a american magazine a found that two GTR have a less performance (0.3s to 0.5s on 0 to 60mph). Futhermore just have a look on what said Autocar during there test in Islo of man or the last evo with the Nurburgring time attack (And please remember in this world there is some physic rules that every car/human follow ... and the electronics cant overpass them).

A French (it's explain some mistake i have surely made) Lotus Driver

[silly chap]

forgot to mention that sadly the NSX will be considerably more expensive than the GTR.

[coxyboy83]

I'd say the GTR is more of a marketing tool myself, bearing in mind that in comparison Porsche has nothing to prove. If Nissan had not made the GTR quicker than the 997, no one would've batted an eyelid - "Nissan = Micra, Almera, Note", but because they've made a genuinely rapid car that seems to be quicker than a Porsche everyone sees Nissan in a different light. Marketing money well spent i'd say, if you see where i'm coming from?

[coxyboy83]

silly chap said:

coxyboy83 said:

With all due respect to Nissan the Japs would learn a thing or two from Porsche's factory drivers, although saying that Nissan could probably teach a thing or two to Porsche about trick diff's and various other electronic devices which interfere with a cars natural balance. At the end of the day the two cars are completely different and as someone said earlier, it's not like it's the first time there's been a cheaper car that's been faster, that's not what it's all about. Nissan should stop being so cocky before someone else comes in and pisses on there bonfire, and Porsche should just get over it - it's quicker, big deal??

nothing wrong with nissan's drivers compared to porshce.

the thing that will irritate some is that the (according to sources in japan) new Honda NSX is likely to equal the performance capability of the upcoming GTR V Spec from its first version.

Sounds like Porsche is going to have to open a second front when that rather nice car is released.

Don't get me wrong i'm not slating Nissan's drivers i'm just saying they won't be as good as Porsche's

[Davey S2]

sootyrumble said:

Sorry still don't follow i looked at your profile and the car is a Cayman the best chassis Porsche has ever produced and then deliberately hamstrung as it is a marketing niche tool only to fill a price gap between Boxer and 911 as to electronic aids i think Porsche rams there cars full of them ie GT2's. You will never get the best out of your Porsche because its not allowed to be the best as it would prove Porsche were wrong in the design of their flagship car and so it is a fancy watch or Armani jacket and nothing more, where as the Nissan is no marketing tool, its been honed across generations like Porsche 911's (911 first produced 1963 Skyline 1969) it is an engineering masterpiece like concorde it defies all the built up expectations and ruling classes, and when it enters the GT class races it will have a similar impact to the Lancia Delta.

I would love my Cayman to have 400 bhp but in reality the 300 it has is more than enough for what I need in a road car. I've never been in a situation in it when I have thought I wish it had more power. 160 on the clock in Germany and still pulling is enough really.

I would never get to experience 100% of whats its capable of anyway as I'm not blessed with the same driving skills as Walter Rohl.

Many people prefer the standard 2.7 litre Cayman over the S because more of the performance is available more of the time. No point owning a massively powerful car if you only get to use 50% of the performance for 99% of the time. But thats a different matter.

I've no doubt that the GTR will trounce most cars in whatever it chooses to do but its still not my cup of tea.

Re the electronic aids yes you can get them in Porsches, most notably in the Turbo but they still fall short of a GTR. My car had traction control and abs but thats it (and you can turn the traction control off)

I'm sure that compared with a 997 GT3 (my ultimate 'real world' car) I could jump in a GTR and go a lot quicker straight away than in the Porsche but I'm also sure that the Porsche would ultimately be the more rewarding car for me and one that would hold my interest for a lot longer.

Oh and as for the GTR not being a marketing tool, you are joking arent you?

[bobbylondonuk]

marketing money well spent? i would say product development money well spent.

they have essentially sold all the cars so far without any marketing. word of mouth, rumourmills, press reviews etc have essentially sold all their cars for them.

i may be wrong here...but i havent seen any adverts for the GT-R anywhere in the press or media.

[coxyboy83]

bobbylondonuk said:

marketing money well spent? i would say product development money well spent.

they have essentially sold all the cars so far without any marketing. word of mouth, rumourmills, press reviews etc have essentially sold all their cars for them.

i may be wrong here...but i havent seen any adverts for the GT-R anywhere in the press or media.

I think you've just proven the point

[Joecooool]

Porsche still has the GT-R, they should issue a challenge to Nissan to fly their driver out to Germany and run the ring in the car they have. If they can duplicate the time, Porsche admits it and apologizes.

Bet Nissan would find an excuse not to...

[DSE]

cvegas said:

Nissan 1 - 0 Porsche

Result!

You are believing one car manufacturer over the other .... I am not sure we can call this a victory for either side can we ?

[MarkM3Evoplus]

MinusG40 said:

Why all GTR fan boy don't speak about the R33 story ???? this is a bit strange to forget this very nice story ...
This show how Nissan have made a nurburgring lap score (with Best motoring or as i call they Best Lie Motoring)and give to cars magazine some modified version (and they sell them too in the beginning).
After a certain time Top Gear made an attemp with a car from dealer and couldn't reach any time/performances figures.

And would like too remember you the fact that a american magazine a found that two GTR have a less performance (0.3s to 0.5s on 0 to 60mph). Futhermore just have a look on what said Autocar during there test in Islo of man or the last evo with the Nurburgring time attack (And please remember in this world there is some physic rules that every car/human follow ... and the electronics cant overpass them).

A French (it's explain some mistake i have surely made) Lotus Driver

The GTR33 story has been mentioned elsewhere on Pistonheads - Jap driver Gan San was just over 8 mins in a R33 whilst Top Gear and Autocar were slower (not matching times set by Sport Auto or Auto Motor und Sport in the other cars)....still Autocar on the same day destroyed 996 time with R33, plus Gan San is exceptionally fast round the ring as he was Bridgestones tyre tester and did a lot of testing there (managed an 8.08 in a Porsche Turbo 2 (3.3) despite having to slow down for an accident!!

Note the GTR35 has been quicker round tracks by many different mags & TV progs than many lighter and seemingly more powerful cars - can only put it down to quick changing gearbox, very clever chassis electronics and having more power than quoted.

Cheers,

[phillipg]

I have a GTR on order and recently drove several Japan and USA spec cars at Silverstone at the Nissan driver academy. In comparison to my current 996 turbo the comparison was interesting in the huge difference between the two cars. Apart from pure acceleration statistics which in my opinion are not the issue, the GTR felt much less of a sports car. Getting back in to the Porsche it felt small and alive and particulary the steering gives much more feel. The main impression of the GTR was the gearbox which is on a higher level to anything else I have ever used. It is also very easy to drive and really takes care of you on track - even with the electronic aids off it was very user friendly - especially around Woodcote with a wheel on the grass. It feels like a really usable everyday car and I shall definitely take it to the 'Ring.

[sledge68]

i've sacked people like you for using the internet during work time,

missing the VR6 said:

tinman0 said:

missing the VR6 said:

BORING BORING BORING PLEASE NO MORE!!!!!!!!!!!!!

why don't you just not read the thread.

Quite honestly I'm bored out my mind at work and have nothing else to do.

[wtdoom]

sootyrumble said:

Davey S2 said:

sootyrumble said:

Davey S2 said:

VladD said:

The interesting thing about this for me is that Nissan are now seen as a competitor to Porsche. I don't think this has happened before has it? I know the Skylines are very fast, but were they ever considered to be an alternative to a 911?

I dont think they are. Yes you might get a few people who will buy a GTR instead of a 911 but I havent heard of any.

Performance is only one aspect of a cars appeal. The GTR is a massive car compared to a 911 and a lot of people wont like that. Likewise some people wont want a flappy paddle gearbox.

Also a lot of people buy Porsches as its a well known brand with a motorsport herritage second to none.

And yes I'm sure a lot of people would rather put down a set of Porsche car keys on the pub table than ones with a Nissan badge on the fob. That might be vain but it happens with all cars. How many people would rather buy a VW than a cheaper Skoda which is just as good in every respect?

I assume you are/wish you were a porsche driver, thats the sort of snobbery that gets porsche drivers a bad name, I drive an Audi S3 and would be very happy to have a Skoda Octavia VRS i still believe they are one of the best cars around. I only bought the S3 over the Skoda due to it haveing a KKK04 as standard and now running 300BHP where the skoda is limited to around 250 on a standard turbo, people who dangle their keys on the bar need to get a bigger pair of nuts and learn to drive, if you buy a car for its name only you aren't going to drive anywhere near its potential due to worry of scratching it + you may not get the car you would enjoy driving the most. People who truly know cars will allways buy the Porsche for its visceral appeal, posers will buy them because they are idiots but mere mortals like myself would take the GTR every time as its practical and easier to drive at the limit.

Yes I am a Porsche owner as you could see from my profile.

Its not snobbery, its fact. People do buy things for the make / lable / image irrespective of the merits of the product itself.

Remember the Top Gear episode with the Vauxhaull VX220 Turbo where Clarkson got 2 identical jackets, one with an Armani lable and the other with a Millets lable? As I said shallow perhaps but true.

I didnt buy my car for the badge but for what it offered as a whole.

And as for buying a GTR because its easier at the limit thats your choice but I would prefer a car with fewer electronic aids which you have to learn to drive to get the best out of.

This isnt a knock at the GTR by the way. Its an awesome car and the performance bargain of the decade but it just doesnt do it for me on any level. Thats probably why my last car was Lotus Exige rather than a Scooby / Evo.

Sorry still don't follow i looked at your profile and the car is a Cayman the best chassis Porsche has ever produced and then deliberately hamstrung as it is a marketing niche tool only to fill a price gap between Boxer and 911 as to electronic aids i think Porsche rams there cars full of them ie GT2's. You will never get the best out of your Porsche because its not allowed to be the best as it would prove Porsche were wrong in the design of their flagship car and so it is a fancy watch or Armani jacket and nothing more, where as the Nissan is no marketing tool, its been honed across generations like Porsche 911's (911 first produced 1963 Skyline 1969) it is an engineering masterpiece like concorde it defies all the built up expectations and ruling classes, and when it enters the GT class races it will have a similar impact to the Lancia Delta.

i couldnt care less about the ring I hope nissan is faster then the germans will get their fingers out .
but, what a load of bks about cayman hamstrung!!
im sick of hearing this crap. why dont you open your eyes and use your own brain to think rather than mindlessly quoting from whatever stupid car magazine you last read ? mate wake up and join the real world EVERY SINGLE CAR MANUFACTURER HAS A HIERARCHY THATS NORMAL . in case you didnt notice an M3 is faster than a 320 diesel !!!! It wouldnt really be an M3 if it wasnt would it ?
Does that make the 320 hamstrung of course not ! Thats due to pricing marketing etc !
thats so funny and naive , NEWS REPORT : HAMBURGER HAMSTRUNG DUE TO BIG MAC

[kinetic]

Who gives a st anyway.
I've got £30k worth of lotus elise that would murder the pair of 'em but so what!!
Its all marketing bks anyway and is pretty irrelevant to someone purchasing what are ultimately just 'lard arsed' road cars.