RE: Evora S Sports Racer: Intro

[Nohedes]

RoverP6B said:

Electric windows are, I understand, actually a wee bit lighter than manual ones...

Correct, plus the point made about them dropping when the door is opened.

The pull straps are a bit naff though, you have to pull the door with one hand and push with the other which isn't great.

[Nohedes]

blueg33 said:

That cup holder is sort of ok ish at a push. Reminds me a bit of this




Actually, come to think of it, what exactly is the point of weight saving by removing a few grams worth of plastic handles and leaving electric windows in?

Well the idea is to make the car even lighter. Maybe Lotus could try and find 42kgs worth of door handles etc to remove from the Evora, to get down to a standard 911 weight!?

[kambites]

I've always been a bit baffled as to how Lotus managed to make the Evora quite so heavy.

[Sway]

Nohedes said:

Witness the famous Elise 'jock strap' cup holder solution...

I realise I'm probably in a minority of one, but that's my favourite cupholder in any car.

Not that these things are particularly interesting, but that's lovely.

My car is about as practical as an Elise, and is just fine doing 80 miles a day commuting and weekends away. NVH is significantly better in mine though, benefit of a composite tub...

[blueg33]

Nohedes said:

Well the idea is to make the car even lighter. Maybe Lotus could try and find 42kgs worth of door handles etc to remove from the Evora, to get down to a standard 911 weight!?

Evora 1398kg
Evora S 1437kg
991 1415kg
997 1394kg

They look pretty close to me in terms of weight, the Evora S is heavy compared with a 991

[Nohedes]

blueg33 said:

Nohedes said:

Well the idea is to make the car even lighter. Maybe Lotus could try and find 42kgs worth of door handles etc to remove from the Evora, to get down to a standard 911 weight!?

Evora 1398kg
Evora S 1437kg
991 1415kg
997 1394kg

They look pretty close to me in terms of weight, the Evora S is heavy compared with a 991

You've quoted a 991 C2S PDK weight there. The 991 C2S manual is 1,395kg, so 42kg lighter than the Evora S manual.

Edited to add: despite metal bodywork, more space, bigger engine etc.

Edited by Nohedes on Saturday 26th April 18:20

[kambites]

Bit of s shame, given the weight and engine capacity advantage, that Porsche couldn't get the 911 to drive anywhere near as well.

[Nohedes]

kambites said:

Bit of s shame, given the weight and engine capacity advantage, that Porsche couldn't get the 911 to drive anywhere near as well.

I thought we established earlier in this thread that you haven't driven either of them?!

[kambites]

Nohedes said:

kambites said:

Bit of s shame, given the weight and engine capacity advantage, that Porsche couldn't get the 911 to drive anywhere near as well.

I thought we established earlier in this thread that you haven't driven either of them?!

I haven't, hence the smiley.

I really ought to contrive an excuse to have a go in a 991. I really liked the way the 996 drives, especially for such a big heavy car, but felt thoroughly underwhelmed by the 997. I've got a nasty feeling that the 991 is going to be more like the 997 than the 996, but it'd be interesting to try it.

Edited by kambites on Saturday 26th April 19:02

[900T-R]

Sway said:

I realise I'm probably in a minority of one, but that's my favourite cupholder in any car.

Not that these things are particularly interesting, but that's lovely.

Indeed, very cool and bespoke looking - unlike those dreadful plastic things that spring out the dash and look as cheap as the McCoke that one tends to put in it...

[blueg33]

Nohedes said:

You've quoted a 991 C2S PDK weight there. The 991 C2S manual is 1,395kg, so 42kg lighter than the Evora S manual.

Edited to add: despite metal bodywork, more space, bigger engine etc.

Edited by Nohedes on Saturday 26th April 18:20

But n/a of both is v close

[Nohedes]

blueg33 said:

But n/a of both is v close

Yeah but who wants those right - not enough power!!

[Nohedes]

kambites said:

I haven't, hence the smiley.

I really ought to contrive an excuse to have a go in a 991. I really liked the way the 996 drives, especially for such a big heavy car, but felt thoroughly underwhelmed by the 997. I've got a nasty feeling that the 991 is going to be more like the 997 than the 996, but it'd be interesting to try it.

Edited by kambites on Saturday 26th April 19:02

Edited by Nohedes on Saturday 26th April 19:14

[blueg33]

Nohedes said:

blueg33 said:

But n/a of both is v close

Yeah but who wants those right - not enough power!!

Pretty similar performance to a Carrera and a Cayman S especially the 997 which was the competition when it was launched. Already discussed early in this thread

[peter450]

kambites said:

highway said:

As I said earlier my 1998 Elise was as quick as a Boxster whilst being £10k cheaper. That's forgotten years down the line. Don't look to compete with Caymans on price, undercut them and thus sell more.

Unlike the current Elise which is... as quick as a Boxster (S) and about 10k cheaper?

Trouble with the current car is it's worse than the prev one.....

[highway]

peter450 said:

Trouble with the current car is it's worse than the prev one.....

That's interesting. Why do you say that? On reflection my favourite Elise was the first 1998 car I owned. The MMC discs were awesome and the geo was aggressive- no under steer, masses of quick lift off oversteer waiting to try and kill you if you got things a bit wrong. Preferred that first car to all the others that followed.

Never driven a supercharged Elise though I did try an Evora S.

[peter450]

New styling is worse, ok subjective but in my opinion it is

What's not subjective is they have replaced the high rev 1.8 which was designed from the outset for performance cars (Toyotas answer to the Honda V-Tec) with a standard off the shelf 1.8 of no particular distinction, they might both make the same hp with a supercharger but it's hardly a forward step. There's not even a modest power hike on the new car to sweeten things up.

The rest of the car, interior etc is more or less the same.

[kambites]

peter450 said:

Trouble with the current car is it's worse than the prev one.....

I'd tend to agree, but I think the Toyota Elises sold pretty well so a large chunk of the market obviously doesn't. My favourite is the car I bought (which is obviously why I bought it) but I can see arguments for preferring just about any of the models.

Of course many journalists have said the same about the 991 vs the 997, too.

Edited by kambites on Sunday 27th April 09:47

[blueg33]

Nohedes said:

blueg33 said:

Nohedes said:

Well the idea is to make the car even lighter. Maybe Lotus could try and find 42kgs worth of door handles etc to remove from the Evora, to get down to a standard 911 weight!?

Evora 1398kg
Evora S 1437kg
991 1415kg
997 1394kg

They look pretty close to me in terms of weight, the Evora S is heavy compared with a 991

You've quoted a 991 C2S PDK weight there. The 991 C2S manual is 1,395kg, so 42kg lighter than the Evora S manual.

Edited to add: despite mespace, bigger engine etc.tal bodywork, more

Edited by Nohedes on Saturday 26th April 18:20

Mind you a new Cayman S manual is 1395kg so only 3 kg lighter than an n/a Evora. So at a similar price point Lotus have managed a 2 plus 2 that handles better than a Cayman and is a similar weight. That sounds like a result rather than something to be criticised.

Yes a 991 is lighter but its much more expensive.

Edited to add

Just specced up a Cayman S to match (as closely as possible) the Evora n/a sports racer package

The Evora Costs £58,375
Tha Cayman S Costs ££ 61,908.00

So £3.5k difference isn't really much, so they are very closely comparable in terms of price and performance.

Evora has the benefit of rear seats, and edge on handling and ride and exclusivity
Cayman has Porsche badge, better ineterior quality (subjective) longer service intervals and an umbrella holder

Both are superb cars, Evora residuals look slightly better over 4 years or so although the curent Cayman is too new for us to be sure.

Edited by blueg33 on Sunday 27th April 10:06

Edited by blueg33 on Sunday 27th April 10:26

[otolith]

I think he's saying he prefers the previous supercharged Toyota to the current one, not that he prefers the Rover engined cars.