Winter Tyres

[jagnet]

olly22n said:

You don't have 17's then.

£130 for the premium lines...

Can you fit smaller rims for the winter?

As for Wanli - I'd rather keep the summer tyres on http://www.tyrereviews.co.uk/Article/2013-Winter-T...

58.7m v 42.7m stopping distance for the winning Pirelli when braking from 80kph in the wet.

[ATM]

jagnet said:

olly22n said:

You don't have 17's then.

£130 for the premium lines...

Can you fit smaller rims for the winter?

As for Wanli - I'd rather keep the summer tyres on http://www.tyrereviews.co.uk/Article/2013-Winter-T...

58.7m v 42.7m stopping distance for the winning Pirelli when braking from 80kph in the wet.

The Nankang managed 50.1 and they're seriously cheap. I've ran them for 2 years in 225 50 17 size and I'm considering some more this year in 18 inch unless I can find some 17 inch wheels which will squeeze over my massively impressive brakes.

[Ennoch]

I'm certainly pretty inclined to agree with the recently voiced dissatisfaction over the performance of Avon IceTouring's. Having used Bridgestone Blizzak's and a succession of Continental WinterContact's I ended up at the end of last winter with a set of these as my Conti's were really getting close to being useless. As it happened, we didn't get any more snow, I sold the old car and lent the Cooper WeatherMaster Snow's to a friend (same tyre, different name). He put a few thousand miles on them as he literally couldn't get his car off the drive if there was too much frost, let alone snow.

Roll forward to this winter and they're on the Scoob, and I'm blown away by just how terrible they are in the conditions so far. Granted, I think in the deeper snow they'll probably perform very well, but on the c5deg greasy roads at the moment they're like driving on banana skins. Understeer, oversteer, sudden snap out & instability under braking. You name the fault, they have it. Compared to decent tyres such as the Blizzak's & WinterContact's they just don't perform well enough to be considered a credible tyre as the bias seems to be focused too much on snow and not icy/greasy conditions, and the online reviews from Canada would seem to support this as their conditions do not really compare with ours.

As Avon have basically rebadged a US winter/snow tyre rather than developed a true 'Euro Winter' they've cheaped out. I can only imagine that a lot of the online UK-centric reviews written for these are from people who either don't drive particularly briskly, or who have never driven a winter tyre before so are obviously going to be blown away by the summer vs winter difference. Winter tyres can be awesome, and contrary to popular belief it's also possible for them to not fall off a performance cliff if it's above seven degrees. Sadly, the Avon/Cooper's don't succeed here and instead turn what was a perfectly tractable road into a drifty mess. I'm so sorely disappointed by the performance that a pair of TS850's were ordered this morning to replace them asap.

[V8A*ndy]

Fox- said:

olly22n said:

Chaps;

Wanli Snow tyres.

Avoid like the plague or underrated tyres?

To go on a Mini cooper

Decent winters for a Mini Cooper are very cheap, so I don't see the point in messing around in the budget aisle.

I fitted 4 Goodyear Ultragrip 8's, they were 50 quid each.

Where and what size? That's very cheap.

[wilbo83]

ATM said:

The Nankang managed 50.1 and they're seriously cheap. I've ran them for 2 years in 225 50 17 size and I'm considering some more this year in 18 inch unless I can find some 17 inch wheels which will squeeze over my massively impressive brakes.

Is that the SV2?

[RicksAlfas]

Is it possible that the make up of the Avon tyres has changed since the Indian take over? Jon might know.

Admittedly I've only had them on "normal" cars - Alfa 147 and VW Golf, but at no point have I ever felt they were dangerous or a problem in anyway. BUT mine are at least three years old. It's only really been recently that they've come in for a lot of criticism. Just a thought...

[andyps]

JagXJR said:

Ran the car with budget Winters on the front for a month, now fitted budget Winter rears to match. In all that time no fuss or drama except once coming round a corner with negative camber onto a straight and gave it full beans, could feel a bit of a squirm but traction control light absent. Is 4WD though so would not expect any wheel spin TBH.


Actually think it has more grip than the partly knackered (fully in the front's case) budget summers that came with the car.

Am running it on same (32) psi recommended for the Summers, not sure whether to put a bit more in or not?

Amazing you didn't crash in a nasty way every time you were in the car running with just two winter tyres

I have always run mine at the standard pressures but I think some people do vary them.

[JagXJR]

You didn't see the tyres that came off, cracked inside so bad the fitter could almost flex them back on themselves

Guess I don't drive as hard as some these days

[Liquid Tuna]

RicksAlfas said:

Is it possible that the make up of the Avon tyres has changed since the Indian take over? Jon might know.

Admittedly I've only had them on "normal" cars - Alfa 147 and VW Golf, but at no point have I ever felt they were dangerous or a problem in anyway. BUT mine are at least three years old. It's only really been recently that they've come in for a lot of criticism. Just a thought...

That's a good point. Mine are 3 years old now as well and I had to re-read what some people had said about them saying they're so bad. I honestly thought mine were really good, but that may be me not driving fast enough

[Kell]

HustleRussell said:

carl_w said:

eems a bit odd though -- even if they haven't changed the compound or construction of the tyres, how can they be safe enough to test in 2012 but not safe enough in 2013? Is 2013's snow different from 2012's?

It looks to me as though they've decided the tyre was 'too dangerous' in wet conditions and therefore haven't tested it in the snow. Seems flawed to me as the snow may be where that particular tyre excels so the results aren't representative.

Sorry, I can't work back through the thread to see the test you're on about, but if it's a UK test, I'd say that's a perfectly reasonable decision to make.

90% of the time you'd be driving on wet raods rather than snow, so for a UK tyre, if it's bad on wet roads, it's almost irrelavent how good it is on snow.

I made the mistake of buying a set of wheels and tyres last year by not reading the eBay ad properly.

They were remoulded into a Michelin tread pattern rather than Michelin tyres.

When they turned up, I spotted that they weren't Michelins and immediately went online. Turns out they were great on snow, but dangerous on wet roads.

They went back. It also helped that the wheels were clearly not hte wheels in the picture and that the fifth wheel had a non winter tyre on and a puncture.

Not a great expereince.

[Kell]

V8A*ndy said:

Fox- said:

olly22n said:

Chaps;

Wanli Snow tyres.

Avoid like the plague or underrated tyres?

To go on a Mini cooper

Decent winters for a Mini Cooper are very cheap, so I don't see the point in messing around in the budget aisle.

I fitted 4 Goodyear Ultragrip 8's, they were 50 quid each.

Where and what size? That's very cheap.

I had to replace one of mine this year due to a puncture and got Pirelli Snow Control series 3 for £63, plus a tenner to fit.

[radiodanno]

Hooorah!!

Finally got 4 Winter's ordered for my Avensis 'Daily'.

Bit of drama - the friendly garage I use were really struggling to get anything at all from suppliers. We even tried dropping a tiny bit off the profile size (65 - 60) to see if that made a difference. (The car can run on either)

After about an hour he got me some Continental WinterContacts sorted. Absolute bonus is 1) He won't take any money for fitting and 2) It's on my account. I can pay end of January!!

I'm now bracing myself for the mildest winter since records began.

[Fox-]

V8A*ndy said:

Where and what size? That's very cheap.

Standard Mini size, 175/65/15.

http://www.camskill.co.uk/m95b0s1486p109419/Goodye...

[sly fox]

JagXJR said:

Ran the car with budget Winters on the front for a month, now fitted budget Winter rears to match. In all that time no fuss or drama except once coming round a corner with negative camber onto a straight and gave it full beans, could feel a bit of a squirm but traction control light absent. Is 4WD though so would not expect any wheel spin TBH.


Actually think it has more grip than the partly knackered (fully in the front's case) budget summers that came with the car.

Am running it on same (32) psi recommended for the Summers, not sure whether to put a bit more in or not?

When i asked Nokian directly, they recommended adding 2-3psi to the normal summer pressures when using winter/cold weather tyres.
I've always done this, and not seen excessive wear, so that is what i stick to now.

[ATM]

wilbo83 said:

ATM said:

The Nankang managed 50.1 and they're seriously cheap. I've ran them for 2 years in 225 50 17 size and I'm considering some more this year in 18 inch unless I can find some 17 inch wheels which will squeeze over my massively impressive brakes.

Is that the SV2?

Yes

[SkepticSteve]

Ennoch said:

voiced dissatisfaction over the performance of Avon IceTouring's.

Well all I can say is that I have Avon Ice T ST on my Boxster S and I don't hang about!

The Boxster S is my daily drive to work and back car and I fitted these tyres last year new and recently put them back on again.

You do have to run them at higher pressures in our current >0 temps.

A couple of weeks back on returning from the NEC via the M40, they behaved perfectly at well over 1 Lepton speeds for the majority of that run.

Some tyres probably just don't suite certain cars, which is why Porsche only recommend certain N rated tyres. Ice T are not N rated, but are very good on mine. All IMHO of course!

[JagXJR]

sly fox said:

When i asked Nokian directly, they recommended adding 2-3psi to the normal summer pressures when using winter/cold weather tyres.
I've always done this, and not seen excessive wear, so that is what i stick to now.

Thanks, will stick some more air in tomorrow and see if it makes a difference. Cheers!

[page3]

Paul_M3 said:

I took it that the implication was winter tyres still work perfectly well at temperatures of around 8 degrees. (As some people have implied they don't)

That was my point, perhaps poorly made.

The tyres are a revelation, even at warmer temperatures.

[Kell]

I would love to know how people are driving that's causing traction control lights to keep flashing.

I left my winters on the Mini all year this year - couldn't be arsed to swap them and not only have I not seen excessive wear, I've not once seen the flickering light.

The tyres didn't explode when it got to 7.1 degrees either.

I can only assume as someone mentioned earlier that your cars are detecting 'slip' as while the tread blocks are not moving on the road, because they do move on the tyre, the wheels are moving more quickly than the blocks. Not sure how many mm of slip is needed to activate most systems, but it would be a good explanation.

[Ennoch]

Kell said:

I would love to know how people are driving that's causing traction control lights to keep flashing.

I left my winters on the Mini all year this year - couldn't be arsed to swap them and not only have I not seen excessive wear, I've not once seen the flickering light.

It depends very much on the tyres. I've run old Conti TS810's all year round before and been able to hoon quite happily in all conditions. In contrast the Coopers I have on just now will have the car on an accelarative skew with minimal effort. A 250whp 4WD car with a set of Quaife LSD's should not be doing that! Good winter's are great, and work over a wide variety of conditions. As you go down the price scale this range of capability seems to diminish.