Why so many gears?

[peterbredde]

Hello all. Let me first point out that this is not a rant or complaint. Just wondering. Why does my car have so many gears?

It is a new Mustang GT (manual) with 6 gears. I guess it's to make use of the power under rapid acceleration. But for everyday driving I find the box doesn't really make sense. Just too many gears. It feels as though I am changing all the time when I don't really see much difference. So I tend to find myself skipping gears, maybe from first to third to fifth, or from second to fourth to fifth or sixth.

Shirley for everyday use the car would be better suited to a five speed? Is there any real benefit to the six gears? Am I doing and damage in skipping gears?

Cheers

[okie592]

6th is normally just a cruising gear on the motorway.

you could say the same for the zf 8 speed box, but it works well just cruising on the mway at 80 at basiclly tickover

[xRIEx]

More gears allow you to be as close as possible to the ideal rpm for any given situation, whether that is greatest fuel economy or greatest acceleration.

As I understand it (which is probably not very well) engines with a large spread of power could get away with fewer gears, smaller or 'peakier' engines needed a large number of gears to allow you to make use of the small powerband. Now large engines need all the help they can get with economy targets, taxation by CO2 etc.

[Codswallop]

Nothing wrong with block shifting. In fact, it's encouraged as "green" driving in the driving test at present. I also block shift in my Monaro. It has enough torque to not care much about what gear it's in when pootling, but it's nice to have the full range of ratios when hooning.

[xRIEx]

Codswallop said:

Nothing wrong with block shifting. In fact, it's encouraged as "green" driving in the driving test at present. I also block shift in my Monaro. It has enough torque to not care much about what gear it's in when pootling, but it's nice to have the full range of ratios when hooning.

Good point, gearboxes on recent Corvettes have forced block changes of 1st to 4th unless accelerating hard (gets around some US (maybe Californian) gas guzzler tax).

[Tickle]

Its a performance car, shirley you should expect some compromises for day to day driving

[A900ss]

okie592 said:

6th is normally just a cruising gear on the motorway.

you could say the same for the zf 8 speed box, but it works well just cruising on the mway at 80 at basiclly tickover

My ZF 8 speeder doesn't cruise 80mph at basically tick over.

It cruises at just over 2k rpm which is about the same as the 6 speed manual 520d.

The gaps between gears 1 to 7 are very small so it changes gear when needed very easily for best acceleration and economy and it never feels like there are too many gears as it really is a seemless change.

(I accept that the OP is referring to a manual box though).

Edited by A900ss on Saturday 1st February 20:09

[TLandCruiser]

Codswallop said:

it's encouraged as "green" driving in the driving test at present.

Out of curiosity how is it taught and what method? how is it incorporated into the driving test?

[rallycross]

Good question.

I've had a few cars recently with 4 speed autos which drove absolutely fine - but you'd question is 4 gears really enough ?
Have to say they seemed fine to me for average family cars.

Hyundai coupe 2.0
Suzuki swift 1.5
Zafira 1.8
Renault Megane 1.6

Seems like the 4 speed auto is fairly normal so do we really nead 8 speed gearboxes?

[SmithyAG]

TLandCruiser said:

Out of curiosity how is it taught and what method? how is it incorporated into the driving test?

When I was learning and took my test 2 years ago, it wasn't taught but it was encouraged. According to my instructor, if the learner was competent enough with gear changes then she encouraged them to change from 2nd to 4th. I did it quite often, and in the test they tick a box that you have demonstrated "eco aware driving" or similar, which although I don't think it counts anything towards pass or fail, shows that you know how to use the box appropriately.

[M4cruiser]

Personally I think 5 forward gears are just right for a normal road car.

And 3 for an auto.

Anything else just doesn't feel "right".

Six in a manual also gives a problem for the location of reverse.

Prepare for a tirade against me, but I can take it. It's just my opinion from an ergonomic point of view. I'm quite strong on ergonomics.

I guess the 6 or 8 speeds are done for economics or dynamics, but ergonomics are (/is) far more important on a road car for an average person.

[E65Ross]

M4cruiser said:

Personally I think 5 forward gears are just right for a normal road car.

And 3 for an auto.

Anything else just doesn't feel "right".

Six in a manual also gives a problem for the location of reverse.

Prepare for a tirade against me, but I can take it. It's just my opinion from an ergonomic point of view. I'm quite strong on ergonomics.

I guess the 6 or 8 speeds are done for economics or dynamics, but ergonomics are (/is) far more important on a road car for an average person.

6 speed manuals are fine, ergonically as well. 3 speed autos are hideous. the 8 speed auto is EPIC - have you been in a car or driven a car with it? changes are impercetible so it doesn't bloody matter how many gears it has. it gives better economy and performance, what's the problem with that?

[Mr2Mike]

rallycross said:

Good question.

I've had a few cars recently with 4 speed autos which drove absolutely fine - but you'd question is 4 gears really enough ?
Have to say they seemed fine to me for average family cars.

Hyundai coupe 2.0
Suzuki swift 1.5
Zafira 1.8
Renault Megane 1.6

Seems like the 4 speed auto is fairly normal so do we really nead 8 speed gearboxes?

A conventional auto has a torque converter which gives a wide spread of ratios, so it's not equivalent to a manual gearbox with the same number of gears.

[E65Ross]

rallycross said:

Seems like the 4 speed auto is fairly normal so do we really nead 8 speed gearboxes?

50bhp is more than enough to get us around in a small car, so do we really need more?

If it's an auto, what on earth is wrong with an 8 speed? it does it all for you and you don't feel the changes, so what's the problem?

[rallycross]

E65Ross said:

50bhp is more than enough to get us around in a small car, so do we really need more?

If it's an auto, what on earth is wrong with an 8 speed? it does it all for you and you don't feel the changes, so what's the problem?

Cost new
Cost to fix when old
Weight

[Slidingpillar]

My vintage car has two gears. Jokingly, one speed to go up hills, the other to go down them. No reverse either!

[Who me ?]

I'm leaning toward six or more. My daily car has five. It's a small engine VAG 3 pot derv, so it's got lots of torque low down. Which means I can use a higher gear in town at low speeds. Get on a DC at 50 - all is still well, but head up to 70 and the revs build up . But the problem with six would mean a DMF and a different gearbox. All very well till clutch problems. One solution,that might be worth investigating would be the solution BL/BMC came up with up with on bigger cars and the MGB- overdrive unit. To take my 3000 RPM at 70 down to 2000 RPM ,and reduce consumption .But to my mind one major maker fits cars with 6 speed boxes that on the motorway in 6th, require you to drop a few cogs if you need speed in a hurry, whilst it's opposition provides turbo if you need the speed. In the first one, the turbo is always working, whilst in the other ,the engine only asks for turbo when speed is needed.

[morgrp]

TLandCruiser said:

Codswallop said:

it's encouraged as "green" driving in the driving test at present.

Out of curiosity how is it taught and what method? how is it incorporated into the driving test?

ROSPA actively encourage it on their advanced driver training - Great course incidentally - wish more of my clutch lunching customers would go on it to learn how to drive a car properly - To many people watch vin diesel on the telly and think slamming between gears and dumping the clutch is "good" driving.

[crossy67]

The 6 speed on the Renault Scenic was introduced to get it through emissions tests but failed apparently.

I used to drive quite a few EVO's, I never really liked them, mainly because I never seemed to stop changing gear! 6 speed is just a bit too much imo.

[eldar]

rallycross said:

Cost new
Cost to fix when old
Weight

Economy, performance and of course CO2. A modern 7,8 or 9 speed auto does all 3 better than an old auto or manual.