Forced to subsidise illegal drivers
Discussion
Car insurance could rise by 10 per cent as a million uninsured drivers send costs soaring, motorists were warned yesterday. Premiums could go up as much as a tenth or more this year to cover illegal drivers - who are nine times more likely to be involved in an accident, and ten times more likely to have a drink-driving conviction.
Most offenders calculate the fine if they are convicted will be far cheaper than buying insurance.
But is it fair on the rest of us? Should we be forced to subsidise illegal drivers? Are uninsured drivers punished heavily enough?
Most offenders calculate the fine if they are convicted will be far cheaper than buying insurance.
But is it fair on the rest of us? Should we be forced to subsidise illegal drivers? Are uninsured drivers punished heavily enough?
Sad to say that this situation has been grinding away for years, except it was generally kept fairly quite.
The obvious answer is the one that all honest motorists have been banging on about. That is that this Goverment starts to take serious action against the real motoring crim's - some hope.
The obvious answer is the one that all honest motorists have been banging on about. That is that this Goverment starts to take serious action against the real motoring crim's - some hope.
No, ban the b
s from driving for life if caught without insurance, no exceptions. Place their details onto some sort of database where a dealer can check to ensure that the person buying the car isn't banned. Then implement a law that anyone who sells a car to anyone banned for life will also be prosecuted and fined. This may of course not prevent them gaining second hand cars, but the sellers fine may make some people think twice about selling a car to someone who they know to be banned.
s from driving for life if caught without insurance, no exceptions. Place their details onto some sort of database where a dealer can check to ensure that the person buying the car isn't banned. Then implement a law that anyone who sells a car to anyone banned for life will also be prosecuted and fined. This may of course not prevent them gaining second hand cars, but the sellers fine may make some people think twice about selling a car to someone who they know to be banned. 
It is defintely not fair on the rest of us, we should not be forced to subsidise illegal drivers, and our nanny state does not punish uninsured drivers heavily enough!
Imho, the first offence should warrant a full 5 years inside, the second offence a full 10 years - with similar sentences for the do gooders who most certainly would object.
Imho, the first offence should warrant a full 5 years inside, the second offence a full 10 years - with similar sentences for the do gooders who most certainly would object.
wedge girl said:
Most offenders calculate the fine if they are convicted will be far cheaper than buying insurance.
Herein lies the problem.
The penalty should either be astronomically high and enforced (none of this 26p a week for 578 years malarky), involve taking and crushing the car (assuming its not nicked) or custodial.
BliarOut said:
Just to play devils advocate for a moment, lets say an administratove error meant a good faith driver was uninsured. Still think it warrants five years inside?
Clearly common sense would need to be employed by the authorities [*]. I'd imagine it would be fairly clear whether a driver in question was a scroat or just unlucky / uninformed.
[*] Yeah, I know...
When I took out insurance for the MX5 fully comp was cheaper than 3rd party, fire and theft.
I did wonder if this was down to our personal injury compensation culture gone mad, I for one would be happy to cover my own personal injury via a seperate policy if this would see a marked reduction in premiums.
Insurance seems to becoming an option which has to be wrong,I can see how for many it is no longer affordable especially for young drivers but I do feel premiums no longer reflect the drivers ability, accident record let alone the cost of replacing the car, to have to pay more for insurance than the car is crazy.
I did wonder if this was down to our personal injury compensation culture gone mad, I for one would be happy to cover my own personal injury via a seperate policy if this would see a marked reduction in premiums.
Insurance seems to becoming an option which has to be wrong,I can see how for many it is no longer affordable especially for young drivers but I do feel premiums no longer reflect the drivers ability, accident record let alone the cost of replacing the car, to have to pay more for insurance than the car is crazy.
wedge girl said:
Car insurance could rise by 10 per cent as a million uninsured drivers send costs soaring, motorists were warned yesterday. Premiums could go up as much as a tenth or more this year to cover illegal drivers - who are nine times more likely to be involved in an accident, and ten times more likely to have a drink-driving conviction.
Most offenders calculate the fine if they are convicted will be far cheaper than buying insurance.
But is it fair on the rest of us? Should we be forced to subsidise illegal drivers? Are uninsured drivers punished heavily enough?
why are we paying extra to cover the uninsured whilst they actually remain uninsured? sounds like another excuse to increase prof.... premiumspdV6 said:
Isn't it going into the sinking fund for (partially) compensating victims of uninsured drivers?
Exactly, no one is covering uninsured drivers, this is to cover US when our car is damaged by one of these people, or by a hit and run driver, or by a deer etc etc.
Either way, I can't see what good a driving ban would do, nothing short of a custodial sentence is going to stop them.
wedge girl said:I know someone who wrote off 2 brand new cars in her 1st year of driving (her mum paid for everything). Her lifetime insurance payments will never recover the costs
Insurance seems to becoming an option which has to be wrong,I can see how for many it is no longer affordable especially for young drivers but I do feel premiums no longer reflect the drivers ability, accident record let alone the cost of replacing the car, to have to pay more for insurance than the car is crazy.
wedge girl said:
Car insurance could rise by 10 per cent as a million uninsured drivers send costs soaring, motorists were warned yesterday. ... illegal drivers - who are nine times more likely to be involved in an accident, and ten times more likely to have a drink-driving conviction.
I don't suppose that such drivers are too bothered by speed control initiatives. Initiatives which, of course, bother the fully registered and more likely accident-free driver.
The press roll out this 'insurance is going up' story every year. Nothing new here. Mine is always more at renewal and I shop around and get it for the same/less. The cops are trying to cut down on uninsured/illegal drivers with lots of ANPR, but the DVLA system is still the weak link.
So it's another no news story.
So it's another no news story.
BliarOut said:
Just to play devils advocate for a moment, lets say an administratove error meant a good faith driver was uninsured. Still think it warrants five years inside?
No, the numb bugger that made the administrative error should - if it was proved that your "good faith driver" had a genuine record of being insured.
Targarama said:
The cops are trying to cut down on uninsured/illegal drivers with lots of ANPR, but the DVLA system is still the weak link.
...as is the supposition that uninsured/illegal drivers will bother to register their correct details with the DVLA in the first place.
Its a
joke.I have been hit twice by uninsured drivers in the last 5 years. In both cases the other party was 100% at fault (I was stopped at a pedestrian crossing and traffic lights respectively.)
In the first case, the other party gave false details and the police did bu99er all to chase him. I was disgusted. My insurance company made a fair job of chasing him, but with no luck. After a hell of a row, they agreed not to affect my NCB, but it did cost me £300 (my excess).
In the second case, the other drive gave false details to me AND the Police whom I demanded attend the scene. (Yes, demanded. I was NOT going to take "No" for an answer from the 999 popsy). He was picked up 3 days later by a seperate police force, who found the producer from the first accident in his pocket, and he confessed all. He went to court, where he was fined £150 (on top of his other 3 outstanding fines) and (I believe) given 6 points. Now, 2 years later, I am owed my first £20/month payment for the NCB and loss of earnings. He will be paying this back, to me, over a period of 1 1/2 years (providing he doesn't go AWOL in the meantime.)
Is the system harsh enough? No. Not at all. All I can hope is that the BiB get an ANPR system up and running and regularly post ANPR cameras and catch squads on local roads. I am told that uninsured drivers account for between 1 in 2 and 1 in 3 cars on the roads in London, and am also told that up until recently the Police have done nothing at all about it, as "It isn't a priority, Sir." Namely, the law-abiding motorist will put up and shut up and make the BiB's job easier.
It may be mentioned that both scum I had the (un)fortunate encounter of meeting fitted every stereotype in the book. Age, gender, race, flash mobile 'phone, loud music, foul language. The only difference was that one was in a flash BMW (M)318, the other in a scruffy Mazda 323.
Just my £0.02's worth.
Oli.
In the first case, the other party gave false details and the police did bu99er all to chase him. I was disgusted. My insurance company made a fair job of chasing him, but with no luck. After a hell of a row, they agreed not to affect my NCB, but it did cost me £300 (my excess).
In the second case, the other drive gave false details to me AND the Police whom I demanded attend the scene. (Yes, demanded. I was NOT going to take "No" for an answer from the 999 popsy). He was picked up 3 days later by a seperate police force, who found the producer from the first accident in his pocket, and he confessed all. He went to court, where he was fined £150 (on top of his other 3 outstanding fines) and (I believe) given 6 points. Now, 2 years later, I am owed my first £20/month payment for the NCB and loss of earnings. He will be paying this back, to me, over a period of 1 1/2 years (providing he doesn't go AWOL in the meantime.)
Is the system harsh enough? No. Not at all. All I can hope is that the BiB get an ANPR system up and running and regularly post ANPR cameras and catch squads on local roads. I am told that uninsured drivers account for between 1 in 2 and 1 in 3 cars on the roads in London, and am also told that up until recently the Police have done nothing at all about it, as "It isn't a priority, Sir." Namely, the law-abiding motorist will put up and shut up and make the BiB's job easier.
It may be mentioned that both scum I had the (un)fortunate encounter of meeting fitted every stereotype in the book. Age, gender, race, flash mobile 'phone, loud music, foul language. The only difference was that one was in a flash BMW (M)318, the other in a scruffy Mazda 323.
Just my £0.02's worth.
Oli.
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