Plans to use hard sholder on Motorways.

[scared but happy]

http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0
Seems a good idea (Once they clear off the rubbish and old lorry tyres). Next can we have overtaking on the Inside?

But there is ALWAYS a downside

The Times said:

The speed limit on all carriageways will be reduced to 50mph once the hard shoulder is in use.

So to ease conjestion they open a lane then slow it all down again DO any of these people drive?

Edited by scared but happy on Thursday 31st August 07:08

[Yugguy]

Actually, slowing speeds when busy does help flow - it reduces the bunching effect, where you slow for a queue then floor it to the next one.

[NHyde]

A definite NO for me . Whilst not all congestion is caused by accidents , I dread to think how the emergency services are going to get to the head of the queue when somebody needs them . That includes my daughter who is a Paramedic .

[ARH]

No one will use lane 1 let alone the hard shoulder, what are they thinking about. It will probably cost £millions for new signs, advertising and such and we will still be only using the 2 lanes that are used now.

[MrFlibbles]

The hard shoulder was being used at rush hour on the M42 yesterday morning....

It seemed to take a bit of encouragement to get people to use it though!

[Oakey]

I can see future headlines already:

"Motorists allowed to drive through fields in order to beat traffic jams on hard shoulder"

[Parrot of Doom]

Very dangerous idea IMO. If you want more space on the motorways, then build more ing lanes.

I've driven in Malaysia and they drive all over the shop on their motorways (which aren't that bad actually), and its frightening.

[baSkey]

they'll ahve to do a better job of sweeping up the hard shoulder...

and besides many hard shoulders are construced differently to the main carriageway so they'll have to improve that or they'll fall apart...

[jasandjules]

And what the hell do the people who break down do???

[TonyHetherington]

baSkey said:

they'll ahve to do a better job of sweeping up the hard shoulder...

Initially, yes, but long term cars running over it will keep it clear so that wouldn't be a long term problem I'm sure.

I can see both sides of the argument on this one. There is a definite need to increase capacity on many of our motorways, but equally you need to get people to use that hard shoulder properly if it is to be effective. Will they? Will they *******. On 4 lane motorways (M25 after M23 jct for example) people STILL stay in lane 3 for no reason - this will happen if the hard shoulder is opened too.

Hard shoulders were NEVER engineered to have a constant traffic flow over them, and so I would be very scared in letting Joe Bloggs use it.

[combemarshal]

jasandjules said:

And what the hell do the people who break down do???

The M42 has huge pull off areas very regularily along it, they would have to do the same to other motorways if they were going to adopt this.

[Peter Ward]

This has been in plan for a while. The M42 changes accommodated this by adding laybys every so often (1/2 mile?). Not quite the same thing as a hard shoulder but presumably you're intended to limp along till you reach one.

As I've said before, we do have to be careful with this one. Dual carriageways have no hard shoulder, while tractors/horses/bikes/pedestrians are all allowed to use them. And the speed limit is 70. If we want to say that not having a hard shoulder on a motorway is inherently dangerous -- even at 50 -- then this argument will rapidly be turned back on us in support of reducing D/C limits.

But you do have to wonder who thought up the idea of reducing safety in the name of increasing road capacity. Or perhaps it's not like that? If you don't have motorway hard shoulders then you immediately remove the "killed on the hard shoulder" deaths from the stats. This could actually improve motorway safety .

[Mr Whippy]

I'd like to know how you use slip roads then.

Do you end up having the lane 0 traffic trying to merge with lane 1 traffic when leaving the motorway (basically a lane of cut-off people, who then decide never to use lane 0).

And entering the motorway, do you just never really join?

I can see some nasty accidents when people are adjusting their brains to having a lane 0.

Dave

[jatinder]

I think its the way people drive that effects traffic. All these people who cannot maintain speed, hog lanes, rubber necking, tailgating, elephant racing etc cause a lot of congestion.

[Mr Whippy]

jatinder said:

elephant racing etc cause a lot of congestion.

Bloody hell they do that down south now?

[thinfourth]

Oakey said:

I can see future headlines already:

"Motorists allowed to drive through fields in order to beat traffic jams on hard shoulder"

Have you seen the old landie thread

This can only be a good thing

[ali_kat]

Well, its been working well on the 11 mile stretch of the M42 that has been specially widened for this over the last few days

People are using it, sensibly, even me

And as for the emergency services being able to get to the head of it for an accident, people will have to move to let them pass, the same way they do on any other road without a hard shoulder.

[anonymous-user]

Mr Whippy said:

I'd like to know how you use slip roads then

I was thinking about that. Every scenario I run in my head ends up with a nasty accident