Driver aids and complacency.

[TonyRPH]

Over the years we have seen all sorts of electronic aids being added to cars.

Such things as ABS, air bags, lane assist etc. etc.

I was just reading an article about the new 5 series, and that takes it a step further (too far IMHO).

review said:

The new Five is also so high-tech that it will not only park itself, but change lanes and overtake on the driver’s behalf. It’ll use radar-based cruise control to stay in its lane, detect a car ahead, and signal before pulling out and passing.

So here we have a vehicle which is capable of overtaking, presumably using a computer and (presumably!) requiring minimal driver interaction.

The amount of complacency we see on the roads due to other driver aids is already overwhelming - surely this is just going to make matters worse?

I can see the headline now: "driver found asleep at wheel on motorway as car weaves through traffic driving itself"

I think technology is great - but I also think that vehicle manufacturers are taking it a little too far.

[TonyRPH]

ShaunTheSheep said:

*yawn*

Dizzys were awesome, who really needs to get to work on time when you could be out scrabbling with a timing light in the rain.

Cross plys were fine too, just numpties who couldn't drive had problems.


Oh no, wait...

All very well, but the change to all electronic ignition could hardly be considered a driver aid.

By 'driver aids' I'm specifically referring to technology that can take control of the vehicle.

[TonyRPH]

doogz said:

TonyRPH said:

All very well, but the change to all electronic ignition could hardly be considered a driver aid.

By 'driver aids' I'm specifically referring to technology that can take control of the vehicle.

What, like ABS? And traction control?

I knew I should have been more specific for the pedants out there.

Christ, this forum is getting st.

By "take control of the car" I was referring specifically to steering (as per the article I quoted from).

[TonyRPH]

doogz said:

I'm not being pedantic.

You're specifically talking about things that take control of the steering, to avoid a collision.

But things that take control of the brakes, or throttle, are ok?

I never said that, did I? This discussion was started primarily to discuss a system which will automatically perform an overtake (if the hype is to be believed).

doogz said:

What about stability control? Something that will actuate the throttle and brakes to aid in turning a corner when you'd otherwise end up out of control?

Where do limited slip differentials sit, in your opinion?

What do limited slip differentials specifically have to do with this discussion? You could ask 'what about 4 wheel drive?' etc. etc.

Yes, but none of those things **specifically** encourage the driver to be lazy - although ASC can give a false sense of security, encouraging a driver to drive faster through a bend than they possibly normally would.

But - to labour my point.

The BMW article referred specifically to change lanes and overtake on the driver’s behalf.

So, what we will see in the future are a bunch of robot drivers to lazy to drive their cars, and rely on this technology to a) take evasive action and b) (in the case of the BMW) perform an overtaking manoeuvre for them.

Which ultimately, will encourage some to become lazy and hence lead to complacency.

Phew, this is turning out to be harder work than I expected...

[TonyRPH]

Gaz. said:

Oh come on, you could see what Tony meant in his OP. Anything else is just arguing for the sake of it.

Thankyou.

Gaz. said:

Tony, that system on the 5 series might actually improve things if fitted to some HGV's. In the last 12 months their standards have fallen through the floor. But yes I agree with you, this is the antithesis of 'practice makes perfect' if you ask me.

(my bold) That's my point - off topic - but my son passed his test a short while back - and the car he learned to drive in had hill assist - luckily - he adapted just fine to the 11 year old A3 he bought upon passing, but one of his friends struggled with hill starts in an older car. Which begs the question; are we going to end up with a generation of drivers that can only drive with the assistance of electronic aids?

If so, then that's just wrong IMHO, because there is no skill in that, as driving is a skill.

[TonyRPH]

Ozzie Osmond said:

• Trains used to the driven by a driver - now they can be fully automatic and may not even have a driver.

Sure, but they are steered by the tracks, and can be stopped by a signal (if the driver is not paying attention).
This can't really be compared to driving on the roads.

Ozzie Osmond said:

• Planes used to be flown by a pilot - now they can be fully automatic through take-off, flight and landing.

And how many near misses (that we do get to hear of) has there been over the years? Probably far more than many of us would be comfortable with!

Ozzie Osmond said:

• Ships used to need lighthouses etc - now they can navigate automatically.

Until they run aground...

Ozzie Osmond said:

• Cars .....

I guess it's called progress.

I'm not opposed to progress, but how long will it be, before people are seen reading (some do this already!!), watching TV (this too!), and other activities that remove the focus of the driver from - driving...

An example has already been cited in this thread, that of the test driver responding to email whilst doing 150km/h.

I realise that we are gradually migrating toward autonomous motoring, but as an enthusiast, this is not the way I want to see things going.

[TonyRPH]

mrmr96 said:

<stuff>

The way I see it, is that even with ABS, the driver still has to drive the car.

But with forthcoming technology, even less emphasis is being placed on actually driving the car, as it will tend to drive itself.

Whilst in some ways I can see the benefit to this, the disadvantages (for me at least) outweigh the advantages.