Tuesday 8th November 2005

Marcos on show at MPH05

V8-powered TSO GT2 coupe to be driven on-stage

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Marcos TSO GT2

Marcos is to show the TSO GT2 coupé at MPH05 this month. The live theatre event roars into Birmingham’s National Exhibition Centre and London’s Earls Court and the TSO GT2 will be driven daily at both shows. The 75-minute shows will be presented by Top Gear's Jeremy Clarkson and Richard Hammond.

Just in case you'd forgotten, the TSO GT2 is a British machine housing a 450bhp aluminium alloy 5.7-litre V8 engine with over 90 per cent of peak torque on hand at 2,200rpm, offering easy overtaking and 50 to 70mph in two seconds. Max torque is 393lb-ft at 5,000rpm. The chassis was developed in conjunction with Prodrive and the car's weight is distributed 50:50 front to rear, providing predictable handling. Stoppers consist of 330mm AP racing brakes.

The MPH05 show runs from 10-13 November (north) and 17-20 November (south). Marcos said its staff will be ready to answer questions on its stand.

[johnjr]

Well it is finally nice to see marcos giving us a new car that actually that it looks like it'll go somewhere unlike the Mantis. Looks nice and sounds the business it just a shame that prat clarkson is goin to be driving it at the show. and he'll probably slate it. shame cos it looks like it has real potential . its on my wish list.

[Tripps]

johnjr said:

Well it is finally nice to see marcos giving us a new car that actually that it looks like it'll go somewhere unlike the Mantis. Looks nice and sounds the business it just a shame that prat clarkson is goin to be driving it at the show. and he'll probably slate it. shame cos it looks like it has real potential . its on my wish list.

It's certainly going somewhere and is fantastic fun to drive and very well put together - go and have a look on the stand, the boss, Tony, will be there and is the sort of guy who'll happily answer any questions you might have.

Clarkson will probably go through the reliability, "kit car", no airbags and driver aids lines they usually use on such cars, but the throaty V8 speaks much louder

[dinkel]

Clarckson won't fit in, Hamster maybe . . . Saggy killer this is . . .

. . . for the small people that is.

[Tripps]

dinkel said:

Clarckson won't fit in, Hamster maybe . . . Saggy killer this is . . . . . . for the small people that is.

Tis a bit cosy - good reason to lose those extra pounds though...

Fits me like a glove thankfully

[zippee]

I had a look at this on Sunday at the Classic show at the NEC. Spoke with the chap who used to work for TVR (can't remember his name).
The TSO looks amazing in the flesh, like a beefed up T350 from the front and takes a lot of its styling cues from it as well.
He mentioned they've got 60 odd orders already with production due to start in Jan. First impressions I'd say it should really give TVR a run for their money and I'd certainly consider one over a Sagaris - if I could afford either that is.

[Tripps]

zippee said:

Spoke with the chap who used to work for TVR (can't remember his name).

That doesn't round it down, spoke to three ex-TVR fellas when I visited the factory, but my guess would be that it was Ben who'd have been on the stand.

[jpf]

Ben, as in Ben Samuelson?

Anyone see Chris Marsh?

[Tripps]

jpf said:

Ben, as in Ben Samuelson? Anyone see Chris Marsh?

Nah, not that Ben, would have recognised him!

Chris Marsh left a few years back, not sure whether he had left before Tony Stelliga or weas bought out by him, but the last thing in the media is that he's bought Farbound and is taking them from high-priced supercars to sub-£60k GTs.

[rev-erend]

Well it does have a great engine - seems to share a lot of the TVR design idea's
but the styling seems to be very heavy.

Where the TVR looks like it was designed with flowing detail the Marco looks overly heavily designed, the front is almost pretty but is not quite, the wheels look good from a distance but look not so good close up, the interior looks like another opportunity missed - All IMHO.

I think the design has tried to encapsulate too much of Marco heritage, plus a hint of TVR : perhaps them should have just made a clear sheet of paper approach.

[richb]

zippee said:

I had a look at this on Sunday at the Classic show at the NEC. Spoke with the chap who used to work for TVR (can't remember his name).

Damian McTaggart? He was one of the key designers at TVR who went to Marcos, which is why the Marcos uses the design for the front half of the Griffith Speed 6 show car. Rich...

[Tripps]

rev-erend said:

Well it does have a great engine - seems to share a lot of the TVR design idea's but the styling seems to be very heavy. Where the TVR looks like it was designed with flowing detail the Marco looks overly heavily designed, the front is almost pretty but is not quite, the wheels look good from a distance but look not so good close up, the interior looks like another opportunity missed - All IMHO. I think the design has tried to encapsulate too much of Marco heritage, plus a hint of TVR : perhaps them should have just made a clear sheet of paper approach.

And here I was liking the simplified design, in the similar fashion to the simplicity of the Griff - then again if we didn't all have different views on these things, we'd all be happy with a Vectra! It must be said that Marcos are quite open about the fact they are hoping to appeal to those customers have left behind, with the styling and the V8 engine with its power and reliability.

As I recall the wheels are changing for production, as they intend to use a bespoke design, and the dash will go through some changes before the final cut, a few styling alterations will occur on the outside, but that is mostly complete now, although as I recall its moved on from the pictures in the article.

You need to drive it to see where the clean sheet of paper was used, that Prodrive knowledge is worth every penny on the road, rather than bumbling along with the same chassis design used for decades they've taken a quantum leap forwards and certainly reaped the rewards.

[mrmaggit]

Marcos have been tweaking the car substantially over the last few months. Having driven both the GT2 and the TSO, and having had time to muse over both, I'd say the aim is somewhere between the T350 and a baby Aston in style, but with the performance and handling to beat up a Sagaris, the sound of a Rover V8, and the reliability of the GM motor.

Sounds like a winning idea if you put it like that, doesn't it?

[Tripps]

mrmaggit said:

Sounds like a winning idea if you put it like that, doesn't it?

Do you reckon you'd go for it if they could prise a little more headroom for you then?

Lovely pics of your Griff in Evo BTW

[dinkel]

mrmaggit said:

Marcos have been tweaking the car substantially over the last few months. Having driven both the GT2 and the TSO, and having had time to muse over both, I'd say the aim is somewhere between the T350 and a baby Aston in style, but with the performance and handling to beat up a Sagaris, the sound of a Rover V8, and the reliability of the GM motor. Sounds like a winning idea if you put it like that, doesn't it?

Did you fit in?

[burriana]

I saw the TSO when it was launched 18 months ago at the NEC and loved it then, styling, engine, even the 2-tone paint job and I had a couple of emails from Tony himself.

Being totally honest, the only thing that stopped me getting one was paying full whack for a brand new, new model, from a niche car manufacturer, hence the potential for big losses come resale time.

I have now started to look to see if there are any TSOs on the second hand market yet, but to no avail.

This coupe though ... faaantastic and now that I think I've done my time in convertibles, looks like I'll be looking for one of these in a couple of years

Agree with the Aston styling comments. Very nice.

[Tripps]

burriana said:

Being totally honest, the only thing that stopped me getting one was paying full whack for a brand new, new model, from a niche car manufacturer, hence the potential for big losses come resale time.

Marcos resale values have rules of their own, check out Red Line Sportscars, they have a '94 Mantara Spyder at £20k, a '97 Mantis Spyder for £27.5k and a '96 LM 500 for £22,250, OK these are the top price examples but compared to say TVR models selling at independent dealers, Fernies for example, have an '02 Tuscan that's dropped to around the same prices (£28k) as the Mantis, but has had five years less to depreciate by around the same amount.

Whether the cars shift quickly and at those prices is another question, something you'd only get a feel for if you were more involved with Marcos owners I'd guess.

Must say though that fear of the unknown is why I've not comitted yet as yet, feeling quite safe in the TVR world, knowing the dealers, specialists and having contact with lots of owners, the jump into the unknown is quite daunting.

[mrmaggit]

Thanks for the comments, yes I do fit in. When I went to visit Marcos which turned out to be the EVO photo-shoot, the GT2 didn't have the pedal box moveable, which the production ones will. Hence, I had to slide the seat right forward to be able to comfortably reach the pedals. On the TSO, I had the same problem, but the upper edge to the windscreen is higher (as it will be on the production GT2), so forward visiblity is OK.

[DJC]

Tripps said:

jpf said: Ben, as in Ben Samuelson? Anyone see Chris Marsh? Nah, not that Ben, would have recognised him! Chris Marsh left a few years back, not sure whether he had left before Tony Stelliga or weas bought out by him, but the last thing in the media is that he's bought Farbound and is taking them from high-priced supercars to sub-£60k GTs.

Yeah it was probably Ben.
That lad knows his stuff and is going to become one hell of an engineer!

[Tripps]

mrmaggit said:

Thanks for the comments, yes I do fit in. When I went to visit Marcos which turned out to be the EVO photo-shoot, the GT2 didn't have the pedal box moveable, which the production ones will. Hence, I had to slide the seat right forward to be able to comfortably reach the pedals. On the TSO, I had the same problem, but the upper edge to the windscreen is higher (as it will be on the production GT2), so forward visiblity is OK.

Ah, I'd assumed you'd been invited by EVO to come along and make the comparison, did they clean your car for you then? Mine was filthy when we arrived, as we'd been having fun on the local roads

Not driven the TSO as yet, as it was away on the day we visited, but we're returning to see that as soon as possible, as the friend I took along is dead keen and I'm 80/90% at the moment, love the car but have to be somewhat sensible

Didn't seating issues myself, but I'm a similar build to Tony which makes life easier as the car will likely have been designed to fit snugly around him.

[rumplestiltskin]

Chris Marsh now owns Farboud Cars, after a spell at Invicta.