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I'm also interested to hear how you'll get this road legal. I went the other way (road GT3 with Cup parts, down to 1200kg or so, and then back to road again) and getting it registered in the UK took me 5 months. Was a huge ball ache.
Although I put the carpets and console back in, the lack of plastic wheelarch liners seems to be the primary cause of cabin noise, like a bag of gravel in a washing machine. Strangely enough I don't find solid bushes too much of a problem - the camber is far more of an issue on the road.
Although I put the carpets and console back in, the lack of plastic wheelarch liners seems to be the primary cause of cabin noise, like a bag of gravel in a washing machine. Strangely enough I don't find solid bushes too much of a problem - the camber is far more of an issue on the road.
fioran0 said:
Its only the pump thats electric (instead of engine aux belt driven). Its still a hydraulic rack.
Theres several benefits but I always think the main one is fire risk reduction. Theres no hydraulic lines running the length of the car and across the engine bay with the electric pump. Its mounted up front with a couple of short runs to the rack (i am using better quality lines on mine) and so removes all those headaches.
I much prefer the electric pump over the engine mounted unit on the grounds that its a compact installation, moves weight towards the front and can be swapped in and out without any hassles if need be. Its a much better engineering solution if you can live with it being in your boot space. It also sounds cool and gives you an extra switch to turn on before you can drive the car
The RSR rack is faster than the regular rack as I already mentioned. It also has a better feel I think (though they all feel good). Theres almost zero difference in steering effort with the pump running or not on the RSR one.
That's very interesting info, thanks! I was under impression that RSR's and even GT3's had same steering racks(ratios)Theres several benefits but I always think the main one is fire risk reduction. Theres no hydraulic lines running the length of the car and across the engine bay with the electric pump. Its mounted up front with a couple of short runs to the rack (i am using better quality lines on mine) and so removes all those headaches.
I much prefer the electric pump over the engine mounted unit on the grounds that its a compact installation, moves weight towards the front and can be swapped in and out without any hassles if need be. Its a much better engineering solution if you can live with it being in your boot space. It also sounds cool and gives you an extra switch to turn on before you can drive the car
The RSR rack is faster than the regular rack as I already mentioned. It also has a better feel I think (though they all feel good). Theres almost zero difference in steering effort with the pump running or not on the RSR one.
I have been thinking using the RSR's electric pump in (also) street driven GT3. I wonder how long the pump would last in a car that gets run say 6000 miles a year? That's lot more hours than any race car?
Does the pump make loud noise when it's running? I wouldn't think it can be heard when driving?
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|http://thumbsnap.com/6yyDV3Uq[/url]Hi Neil. Ignore the location of the harness belt. Silly boys did not think to use the harness bars on the cage. Currently I still run it with a bare floor. In relative terms it has done very little road miles so it has not been an issue. Although over the years I've always run them this way. Just need to keep it clean. It is in with a mate for some more fettling and should be back with me by the end of Jan. The centre console is going as I can't use the foot rest which is a shame as I wanted to keep some references to a road car. RS style door cars with a basic radio and door speakers. Electric windows remain. Need to do a couple of test days to get me and the car up to speed.
Yes to the handbrake. The only way it will need registered as a "kit" is if I change my name to Michael Knight and it starts talking.
Why no wheel liners? Did you have to take them out to fit race rubber or did they just get chewed up and binned?
When you say solid bushes do you mean suspension? If so then I agree. Ive never had any problems in GT3s etc on the road with them. I dont find ride much changed at all if I am honest in terms of compliance, though the car feels a million miles better as a result of their install.
The solid gearbox mount is the main source of my cabin noise. It creates a direct sound bridge with the shell. Add in the Cup gearbox, flywheel and my clutch setup and the noise at idle is seriously loud. I have lexan windows (the 1/4s are vented too), zero sound deadening, a 110db supercup exhaust and an engine thats no shrinking violet. At idle, even with the doors open I literally cannot hear the exhaust or engine above the rattling transmitted inside. The shell is also significantly stiffer than a stock GT3 shell so amplifies a touch more as a result. On throttle and moving this noise recedes somewhat but theres still decent whine and clanking given theres literally zero give anywhere. Even the lightweight driveshafts add to the aural input. None of this is news of course, I will freely admit to quite liking it and its not like I havent been around it plenty but my helmet is usually on for long drives so muffles things. Earplugs are the solution of course but it would be nice to not need them.
Why no wheel liners? Did you have to take them out to fit race rubber or did they just get chewed up and binned?
When you say solid bushes do you mean suspension? If so then I agree. Ive never had any problems in GT3s etc on the road with them. I dont find ride much changed at all if I am honest in terms of compliance, though the car feels a million miles better as a result of their install.
The solid gearbox mount is the main source of my cabin noise. It creates a direct sound bridge with the shell. Add in the Cup gearbox, flywheel and my clutch setup and the noise at idle is seriously loud. I have lexan windows (the 1/4s are vented too), zero sound deadening, a 110db supercup exhaust and an engine thats no shrinking violet. At idle, even with the doors open I literally cannot hear the exhaust or engine above the rattling transmitted inside. The shell is also significantly stiffer than a stock GT3 shell so amplifies a touch more as a result. On throttle and moving this noise recedes somewhat but theres still decent whine and clanking given theres literally zero give anywhere. Even the lightweight driveshafts add to the aural input. None of this is news of course, I will freely admit to quite liking it and its not like I havent been around it plenty but my helmet is usually on for long drives so muffles things. Earplugs are the solution of course but it would be nice to not need them.
JarmoL said:
That's very interesting info, thanks! I was under impression that RSR's and even GT3's had same steering racks(ratios)
I have been thinking using the RSR's electric pump in (also) street driven GT3. I wonder how long the pump would last in a car that gets run say 6000 miles a year? That's lot more hours than any race car?
Does the pump make loud noise when it's running? I wouldn't think it can be heard when driving?
The 996 GT3 uses the exact same rack as the C2, boxster etc. Same with the 997 GT3. There are several options for the motorsport cars.I have been thinking using the RSR's electric pump in (also) street driven GT3. I wonder how long the pump would last in a car that gets run say 6000 miles a year? That's lot more hours than any race car?
Does the pump make loud noise when it's running? I wouldn't think it can be heard when driving?
The pump should be fine, theres electric pumps being used in an array of regular production every day cars (or were at least before the switch to cheaper electric motors) without a need for annual replacement. Porsche dont use the pumps on street cars though so its not a cheap upgrade. Its over £2000 for the pump, two hoses and a couple of adaptors if you buy new. You also need the engine and gearbox out to remove the old lines.
The pump can definitely be heard with it running and when driven. How intrusive will of course depend on how loud your car is and how much interior you have to muffle it out.
Thanks Graeme.
Looks super clean, as I said, supremely jealous
Thats interesting ref the bare floors. I have wooden floor boards down anyways but just figured it would get scratched up and messy in short order without something else in there. Even the race cars start to look tatty in a relatively short time. I will run with my rubber flooring since its down and gauge how messy it gets as a way to feel whether it can be removed without headaches.
I feel you on the centre console, its nice to have somewhere to stick things thats for sure. I couldnt run one if i wanted the shifter up on stilts so didnt have much option there. It can make things look a little more civilised by having it though.
Looks super clean, as I said, supremely jealous
Thats interesting ref the bare floors. I have wooden floor boards down anyways but just figured it would get scratched up and messy in short order without something else in there. Even the race cars start to look tatty in a relatively short time. I will run with my rubber flooring since its down and gauge how messy it gets as a way to feel whether it can be removed without headaches.
I feel you on the centre console, its nice to have somewhere to stick things thats for sure. I couldnt run one if i wanted the shifter up on stilts so didnt have much option there. It can make things look a little more civilised by having it though.
marky911 said:
Speaking of Cheeper van hire, where is Ade lately? Not seen him on here for a while.
Same place a whole bunch of others are. Off doing other things in the non virtual world and only occasionally checking in just to see if theres a chat going on that they feel like engaging with. Its a bit..... folks out in their underpants shouting at the wind in here. I assume the only appeal is the chance to chinwag with a few others one doesnt have the luxury of seeing in person regularly. Thats where I am atleast.If I lived closer to people I would just get them down the pub of an evening instead.
Edited by fioran0 on Monday 30th December 02:12
fioran0 said:
Thanks, Glad its of interest to atleast some.
Graeme, I am supremely jealous of anyone running stripped out older cars. The interiors always look sublime when done right and you get so much lightness on top. Theres too much clutter in the later cars that cannot be done away with. Its my one grumble.
Do you still have a bare interior? What have you done about the floor covering? Ive provisionally made some rubber flooring ala the 911R. It looks ok but there something nice about an expanse of metal. My race cars always end up a pain with bare flooring with dirt and gravel etc and I have to assume its endlessly worse for something that is used on the road hence my rubber install. If you are still bare I'd really like to hear how you find it. Same for you Steve, you use yours on the road too right? Did you just fling in floor mats or are you both ballers and issue special footwear upon entry?
Parts life will be more or less as per a regular 996 GT3, though some bits of course will need checked on more frequently. Not using it racing stretches the time line out massively. Even race cars that are just club raced see their life extend by a serious measure by dropping down to this less stressful environment as I am sure you can imagine.
Terry, the base car was my old 2004 996 Cup. I had an off and the shell was toast. I started on the well trodden path of reshelling (or filling up the spares truck) when I decided that I'd just use the opportunity to change up to a 997 cup and build something interesting instead with the 996 Cup instead.
NeilGraeme, I am supremely jealous of anyone running stripped out older cars. The interiors always look sublime when done right and you get so much lightness on top. Theres too much clutter in the later cars that cannot be done away with. Its my one grumble.
Do you still have a bare interior? What have you done about the floor covering? Ive provisionally made some rubber flooring ala the 911R. It looks ok but there something nice about an expanse of metal. My race cars always end up a pain with bare flooring with dirt and gravel etc and I have to assume its endlessly worse for something that is used on the road hence my rubber install. If you are still bare I'd really like to hear how you find it. Same for you Steve, you use yours on the road too right? Did you just fling in floor mats or are you both ballers and issue special footwear upon entry?
Parts life will be more or less as per a regular 996 GT3, though some bits of course will need checked on more frequently. Not using it racing stretches the time line out massively. Even race cars that are just club raced see their life extend by a serious measure by dropping down to this less stressful environment as I am sure you can imagine.
Terry, the base car was my old 2004 996 Cup. I had an off and the shell was toast. I started on the well trodden path of reshelling (or filling up the spares truck) when I decided that I'd just use the opportunity to change up to a 997 cup and build something interesting instead with the 996 Cup instead.
Edited by fioran0 on Sunday 29th December 03:07
I have the original wooden floor plates. To be honest they are fine but best if you wear reasonably grippy footwear. I do skulk about on the road quite happily but the harnesses and race seats sometimes make exiting junctions a bit difficult. Like your car, mine has a solid mounted box so earplugs are also useful.
My biggest problem is set up as its cheaper to run the car on slicks at track days so thats the primary set up objective. This leads to a few lock up problems on the road. I did look at an adjustable bias set up - which I much prefer - but it the car wouldn't then be correct in spec. My half way measure solution was a motorsport ABS unit which works well on the road and circuit. With an adjustable bias, you can just run more rear for the road - effectively a wet brake bias set up. That should be fine. On the track, the car will be very good. Nice project.
fioran0 said:
Why no wheel liners? Did you have to take them out to fit race rubber or did they just get chewed up and binned?
When you say solid bushes do you mean suspension? If so then I agree. Ive never had any problems in GT3s etc on the road with them. I dont find ride much changed at all if I am honest in terms of compliance, though the car feels a million miles better as a result of their install.
That's right. Slicks kept rubbing the arches which also had to be rolled a little.When you say solid bushes do you mean suspension? If so then I agree. Ive never had any problems in GT3s etc on the road with them. I dont find ride much changed at all if I am honest in terms of compliance, though the car feels a million miles better as a result of their install.
Yep, I mean suspension. I find it quite bearable on the road. I thought about solid mounts for gearbox etc but decided against going deaf in middle age.
BTW, 110dB!!! Looks like you won't be doing any track days then.
Steve Rance said:
I do skulk about on the road quite happily but the harnesses and race seats sometimes make exiting junctions a bit difficult.
I have the same problem plus a full roll cage (for which no doubt others will severely admonish me). Thankfully I am short enough not to be too close to the metal above my head, but I still strap the harness on as tightly as possible to prevent movement. This and the tiny wing mirrors mean the act of changing lane on the motorway partially requires the Force. I suppose the upside is I tend to be very well behaved in traffic.Love this project. More please!
marky911 said:
Still looks great Graeme! Are you racing this then or just track days?
Speaking of Cheeper van hire, where is Ade lately? Not seen him on here for a while.
Many thanks Mark. It has been built to go racing. 2013 did not go as planned. I did two races but knew we had an issue with the car. So parked it up until it gets sorted. The plan for 2014 will be to do three or four races. Speaking of Cheeper van hire, where is Ade lately? Not seen him on here for a while.
Harris_I said:
That's right. Slicks kept rubbing the arches which also had to be rolled a little.
Yep, I mean suspension. I find it quite bearable on the road. I thought about solid mounts for gearbox etc but decided against going deaf in middle age.
BTW, 110dB!!! Looks like you won't be doing any track days then.
Thought so ref the rubbing. You can have wide rubber or low height on the street shells but not both unfortunately. LOL on the hearing, even those urethane gearbox mounts are proving a bit much for quite a few hardened track rats. Yep, I mean suspension. I find it quite bearable on the road. I thought about solid mounts for gearbox etc but decided against going deaf in middle age.
BTW, 110dB!!! Looks like you won't be doing any track days then.
Thats FIA 110db too, so thats drive by sound level measured at a sound station 50ft away on track side or whatever it was at that time, not static 110db measured 10ft from the back end of the car. Track days can suck it
(actually I have a 997 Cup system thats quieter that I can run for those things, or i will fit up some supertraps to the ends if I need to).
I had a good old chuckle on the door mirrors. They are great at close quarter (ie a car a foot away from your 1/4 panel) but less good when out in the open huh!!!
I have a rear view camera Im going to put in. Even a rear view mirror isnt much cop any more. Its useless with that rear wing though theres some vision now its at roof height rather than the lower stock 6Cup height. A little screen on the dash with a continuous feed from the rear is whats needed.
Edited by fioran0 on Friday 3rd January 17:03
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