Admission of negligence
Discussion
YoungMD said:
I think the point is Porsvhe charge a premium, we all know they charge over the odds (that's why they have nice coffee) thats fine but in return they have to deliver a premium product, simple.
I would be pissed too if they changed my tyres and either didn't check the old tyre wear or f'ed up the alignment. I'd expect kwik fit to do that but I'd be paying them half, checking there work, and knowing I was gambling.
But the old alignment couldn't be that far out else the old tyres would blow out. Also we know they need to replace alignment (or some such term) bolts.I would be pissed too if they changed my tyres and either didn't check the old tyre wear or f'ed up the alignment. I'd expect kwik fit to do that but I'd be paying them half, checking there work, and knowing I was gambling.
So perhaps we can conclude they did do the premium service, checked the alignment and got it wrong (by not doing up the lock nuts if there are any perhaps).
They can't really be sued for negligence as they have put the OP back in new tyres and fixed suspension. So not a huge risk in admitting fault.
Bert
sebulban said:
I paid for full geometry check when tyres changed in May as I said before.
And I believe this is the reason for Porsche saying to me today it was their fault and covering costs.
You didn't say that. You said you had 4 new tyres and no other work.And I believe this is the reason for Porsche saying to me today it was their fault and covering costs.
Now, I think it makes sense. They clearly did forget to tighten something up, which I suspect they found very quickly when they inspected the car after the blow out.
BertBert said:
But the old alignment couldn't be that far out else the old tyres would blow out. Also we know they need to replace alignment (or some such term) bolts.
So perhaps we can conclude they did do the premium service, checked the alignment and got it wrong (by not doing up the lock nuts if there are any perhaps).
They can't really be sued for negligence as they have put the OP back in new tyres and fixed suspension. So not a huge risk in admitting fault.
Bert
So by this logic unless someone dies we don't do anything or punish?So perhaps we can conclude they did do the premium service, checked the alignment and got it wrong (by not doing up the lock nuts if there are any perhaps).
They can't really be sued for negligence as they have put the OP back in new tyres and fixed suspension. So not a huge risk in admitting fault.
Bert
Just sweep under carpet.
YoungMD said:
To offer some useful feedback though, legally apart from getting them to check/ sort out the car theres not a lot more you could do, UK law kind of works on the principle that damages/compensation is only really paid when actual loss/ suffering can be proven
any loss/suffering????????????????????????davek_964 said:
You didn't say that. You said you had 4 new tyres and no other work.
Now, I think it makes sense. They clearly did forget to tighten something up, which I suspect they found very quickly when they inspected the car after the blow out.
I didn't realise it was considered work. Apologies.Now, I think it makes sense. They clearly did forget to tighten something up, which I suspect they found very quickly when they inspected the car after the blow out.
I had the extra bits done as made sense.
Im guessing this is why there has been some sort of admission as it will be noted on the OPC systems!
Kawasicki said:
any loss/suffering????????????????????????
I would say yes - poor chap has had to put up with us second guessing him and accusing him of burnouts etc.Now are you sure you sure a rival opponent didn't loosen those little bolts at the back?
It seems that your OPC did not complete the geo setup work leaving the car in an unsafe state. If so, they could have injured you and other road users...
I would never have tyres replaced at the dealer based on cost. At least with tyre outfits, that's their bread and butter and they normally form the habbit of doing the bolts up. Don't ever take it back there again, especially as you say this is the third abomination at the same OPC....
sebulban said:
I paid for full geometry check when tyres changed in May as I said before.
And I believe this is the reason for Porsche saying to me today it was their fault and covering costs.
Argh this changes things more than a little bit matey.And I believe this is the reason for Porsche saying to me today it was their fault and covering costs.
I think we've all been trying to help you just been a lot of speculation on the failure mechanism in the absence of this key info.
Not to worry we got there in the end I think.
Do let us know how resolves itself.
So OP, you've had an eventful couple of days, a motorway blow out resulting in a major scare, a row with your OPC and an apology, and now a 100 post thread on PH in the course of an evening. Every cloud and all...
I'm not even sure we can remember the original question...
Since conversation regarding the tyre saga is drawing to a close maybe I may ask you - what is a professional MMA fighter and is your vocation the real reason the OPC admitted fault so quickly?
I'm not even sure we can remember the original question...
Since conversation regarding the tyre saga is drawing to a close maybe I may ask you - what is a professional MMA fighter and is your vocation the real reason the OPC admitted fault so quickly?
Interesting post! I had my 997 "setup" by an official Porsche dealer and I was immediately suspicious as it was drifting to the right (against the road camber!) and the steering wheel wasn't even aligned!!. All pretty basic stuff, but speaking to the OPC "technical" staff, it is apparent they have very little idea of vehicle geometry. I took it straight up to Chris at Center Gravity and it was way off being correct and some clumsy attempts at adjusting the front and rear had been made. I queried it with the dealer and (due to some other issues) took it up with Porsche UK, neither were interested. Funny how it did not drive straight before CG setup, but after it's perfect.
A couple of years ago I had my geometry set up by a Porsche Centre, back in my naïve ownership days when I thought you paid top price to get top service.
Mistake.
The geo was done in October, a week after new front tyres were fitted. By May, and after 5k miles, the inside front tread was gone and you could just start to see the wire on both tyres. My normal mileage for the front is 25k with pretty even wear.
I then checked the tyre pressures for the first time since the work was done (yes, yes I know I should check them regularly but I did expect an OPC be able to pump tyres up correctly) and they were all wrong; front set to 2.5 bar and rear to 2 bar. These settings just happen to be around the wrong way. I should've been suspicious when I picked the car up as the front felt much lighter than before the geo was done. But, as I said naïve Porsche owner and I thought this was a result of the now "correct" geo settings.
I took it back saying there must be problem with the geometry. They checked it and agreed it was out by minutes, not seconds, at the front. But, only seconds at the rear. They put the reason down to me hitting a pot hole.
When I questioned how it was possible to hit a pot hole with such force as to put both front wheels out and not notice, they just said I must have done. When I then asked how both rear wheels were only out by a few seconds, again they could not explain how this "trench" I drove down did not affect the rears.
The end result was I had to purchase a new set of tyres, but they redid the geometry for free, as a gesture of goodwill.
Another Porsche Centre gets my business now.
Mistake.
The geo was done in October, a week after new front tyres were fitted. By May, and after 5k miles, the inside front tread was gone and you could just start to see the wire on both tyres. My normal mileage for the front is 25k with pretty even wear.
I then checked the tyre pressures for the first time since the work was done (yes, yes I know I should check them regularly but I did expect an OPC be able to pump tyres up correctly) and they were all wrong; front set to 2.5 bar and rear to 2 bar. These settings just happen to be around the wrong way. I should've been suspicious when I picked the car up as the front felt much lighter than before the geo was done. But, as I said naïve Porsche owner and I thought this was a result of the now "correct" geo settings.
I took it back saying there must be problem with the geometry. They checked it and agreed it was out by minutes, not seconds, at the front. But, only seconds at the rear. They put the reason down to me hitting a pot hole.
When I questioned how it was possible to hit a pot hole with such force as to put both front wheels out and not notice, they just said I must have done. When I then asked how both rear wheels were only out by a few seconds, again they could not explain how this "trench" I drove down did not affect the rears.
The end result was I had to purchase a new set of tyres, but they redid the geometry for free, as a gesture of goodwill.
Another Porsche Centre gets my business now.
GaryF said:
Kawasicki said:
any loss/suffering????????????????????????
I would say yes - poor chap has had to put up with us second guessing him and accusing him of burnouts etc.Now are you sure you sure a rival opponent didn't loosen those little bolts at the back?
mdianuk said:
Question is, was wheel alignment requested as part of changing the tyres? If not, I can't see why they are liable, and in any case, if they have agreed to put right and pay, why are you considering action? Compensation for what could have happened!!!
Forgetting (for a second) what MIGHT have happened, the OP has been seriously inconvenienced and a holiday spoilt, so some sort of compensation is surely due IF the garage was negligent. What sort of compensation, and how best to get it, is obviously open to debate. Now that we (appear to) have the full picture, it definitely looks like the garage that did the alignment was quite severely negligent.
On the other hand, proving that on a car that's been driven around for 6 weeks / 1k miles would be much harder. The settings could have been changed anywhere in that time. Even if they weren't, as already mentioned - it is the driver responsibility to ensure the car is roadworthy each time they use it. Whether people actually do check tyres etc. before they set off is a moot point - it is your responsibility and as a result this should have been noticed by the OP much earlier, and far before the tyre exploded. Even if it was not noticed purely from how it drove.
I'm surprised Porsche have agreed to remedy it so quickly, and it's good they did. But I'll be even more surprised if they compensate with anything significant.
On the other hand, proving that on a car that's been driven around for 6 weeks / 1k miles would be much harder. The settings could have been changed anywhere in that time. Even if they weren't, as already mentioned - it is the driver responsibility to ensure the car is roadworthy each time they use it. Whether people actually do check tyres etc. before they set off is a moot point - it is your responsibility and as a result this should have been noticed by the OP much earlier, and far before the tyre exploded. Even if it was not noticed purely from how it drove.
I'm surprised Porsche have agreed to remedy it so quickly, and it's good they did. But I'll be even more surprised if they compensate with anything significant.
Gassing Station | Boxster/Cayman | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff