Tesla Model 3 revealed

[Zoon]

Mr Will said:

Refilling a hydrogen car takes 5 minutes, plus the time taken to drive to the filling station, queue up for the pump, queue up to pay and then drive back to the route you actually wanted to be on.

Recharging an electric car involves plugging it in when I get home at night and then unplugging it again the next morning. Total effort <30 seconds and it always has 200+ miles range when I get in each morning. I would go months without ever having to visit a public charging station.

Imagine for a moment that someone invented a hydrogen fuel cell for mobile phones (bear with me!). It is tiny and lightweight and would power your phone for a whole week on a single charge and recharge in just 5 minutes BUT you need to take it to a mobile phone shop to get it recharged - do you see how ridiculous the idea is?

It's as ridiculous as trying to drive 200 miles in an electric car at night with the wipers going and AC on.
Both have their benefits although ICE cars still have the edge for flexibility. How many EV's can you charge up at a public charging station in 30 minutes vs the same argument for ICE cars at a public filling station - do you see how ridiculous that is?

[jazzybee]

DoubleD said:

jazzybee said:

I think it will be good, Deposit paid. I am guessing by now there will have been 250k orders.... I should have been in the dealership yesterday.

You think it will be good, but what if it isn't?
I'm amazed that people don't care if they drive ok before blindly putting down a deposit!
That Ellen woman is obviously very intelligent.

Wow - Strange response.

I've driven the Model S a number of times, it handles very well, and phenomenal acceleration. Being in the Tech business, I love the tech.... It would not be to replace my MX5 or Aston, or to bomb around the Nurburgring, more main day to day car - The whole proposition with the Supercharging included as standard (thats what I was waiting to hear last night) is compelling. The deposit is refundable - so, if something better comes up in the meantime, then, no problem. If I wait until the car is available for a test drive, then the wait would be a couple more years.

[Quickmoose]

kambites said:

Leithen said:

dazwalsh said:

Is the tech not there to have solar panels built into the bonnet/roof to enable self charging or is that some way off yet?

Nowhere near viable and probably never will be for a single car surface to take in enough energy from the sun.

Indeed. Say you could get two square meters of panels on the car, that'd give you about 3kwh per day in the middle of summer in the south of England. That's enough for about ten miles. In winter in the north you'd be lucky to top up 5 miles a day.

Still a worthy idea though? for sundry other systems? DRLs, ICE, AC...the extra energy still a useful and free addition?...trickle charge

[jon-]

TIL Elon Musk wanted Tesla's Model lineup to spell SEX: Model S, Model E, Model X. However, Ford owns the term Model E, so Tesla opted for Model 3 to spell S3X

[smilo996]

Thought it was another April fool.

Americans see it as the national resurrection of their car industry. The tax deduction and thus rebate for a model S is 3.5 times that of a Prius so, given Americans love of size over anything else it is no wonder the Model S was popular and distorts the market for really innovative and energy conserving smaller cars.

Otherwise what is all the fuss about?
A completely conventionally series of cars built with conventional materials. The long range is entirely due to the sheer number of the cheap batteries under the floor and nothing to do with cutting edge design or technology.
The interior innovation supplied by gluing an ipad stuffed into the dash.

No wonder Americans love it. Then all the Ameri sheep from Europe just jump on board.

Compared to the BMW i3 which really is revolutionary, Tesla cars are like 70's Caddy.

If he was actually interested in the future and not selling snake oil then he would have put billions into hydrogen refining instead of building a massive battery factory 500 miles from the nearest port. Tesla would also He could also invest in the generation of electricity being pioneered using glass seeing as he has put it on top of his cars. The "revolutionary" battery storage for domestic use is not even as efficient or flexible as that being produced by Bosch.

His mega battery factory just adds to further pollution and pressure on the production of lithium.

Not once have I seen more than two people in a Model S and 90% of the time one person.

Harsh?

Edited by smilo996 on Friday 1st April 12:57

Edited by smilo996 on Friday 1st April 13:06

[dlockhart]

Impasse said:

In that case you'd have to question the wisdom of buying a £30k car in the first place.

Nope, lets assume they charge twice a week and do 120 miles on a charge - that's 12k a year

In your opinion What is the correct amount people should spend if they drive 12k a year?

[Pommygranite]

yayitsadiesel said:

unsprung said:

In the last 24 hours, Tesla have received 115,000 reservations, globally, for the Model 3. At $1000 per reservation, that's a cool £80,000,000.

No it isn't

Yes it is

[Pommygranite]

yayitsadiesel said:

unsprung said:

In the last 24 hours, Tesla have received 115,000 reservations, globally, for the Model 3. At $1000 per reservation, that's a cool £80,000,000.

No it isn't

Yes it is

[tadaah]

rscott said:

George111 said:

Mr Will said:

George111 said:

OK, I still can't recharge it where I work and if I live in an apartment in London I still can't recharge it at home. So it's still a dead duck with an even further reduced range from the previous Tesla cars. Surely with reduced performance you'd expect increased range . . . ?

Until you can recharge these cars at a couple of places in every town/village they're not going to catch on.

I could recharge one literally 6ft from my front door. I could also recharge it at work (Tesla Superchargers already in the carpark). The places that I visit that are both A) more than 100 miles away and B) would not allow me to do an overnight charge are virtually none-existent.

I'm not trying to claim that it is suitable for everyone, but central London apartment dwellers are only a small part of the population, and an even smaller percentage of the people who'd be looking to spend 35k on a car. This is a practical option for a significant number of people.

No it's not. The majority of car users in the UK do not have a drive, they park on the road and they can't charge a car on the road or have a drive/car parking area which is not directly next to the house. Electric charging is not feasible for the majority of people with the current technology, it doesn't work. Who wants to route their journey by supercharger charging points ? Nobody.

It does work for the few who can arrange their life to make it work or are willing to accept the limitations. That's great, I'm pleased for you But for me and millions of others, it's not feasible right now which is a shame because it's the only exciting and new technology on the horizon.

Not sure that part is true. This RAC Foundation report claims 75% are parked off the road. If these are on driveways, garages or private carparks, then there is the opportunity to install charging infrastructure. Even in urban areas, over 50% are parked on private land.

In all areas, 12 per cent of household vehicles are parked in a garage overnight; 61 per cent are parked on private property (but not garaged); 25 per cent are parked on the street; and 3 per cent are parked in other places.

The proportion of household vehicles parked overnight on private property but not garaged is highest in rural areas (72 per cent) and generally declines as settlement size increases, down to 55 per cent in urban conurbations.

- See more at: http://www.racfoundation.org/motoring-faqs/mobilit...

Plus if you cross referenced average incomes with people who don't have driveways, then removed inner city residents from that pool (becuase as discussed elsewhere they can use buses and the tube/metro as alternatives to cars if they wanted to) and cross referenced again with those able to afford a £35k car then you'd probably find a very significant number of potential customers with 1) off road parking 2) the money to buy a £35k car. I strongly suspect not having a driveway is not going to affect tesla's target market too much in this country

[tadaah]

yayitsadiesel said:

No it isn't

its pretty bloomin close

[tadaah]

Impasse said:

Galsia said:

Most people would only need to charge it once per week or so.

In that case you'd have to question the wisdom of buying a £30k car in the first place.

there are tens of thousands of cars (possibly hundreds of thousands) sold every year to people who only do 200 miles a week or less

[Impasse]

dlockhart said:

Nope, lets assume they charge twice a week and do 120 miles on a charge - that's 12k a year

In your opinion What is the correct amount people should spend if they drive 12k a year?

The previous comment suggested they'd only need to recharge once a week so that makes your mileage predictions to be about 6k pa. If that's the case then a small car with a corresponding small petrol engine might be a better financial buy if the cost of fuel is your primary concern when making purchasing decisions.

[Zoon]

Pommygranite said:

Yes it is

It's not, it's actually £80,388,661.60

[KTF]

tadaah said:

there are tens of thousands of cars (possibly hundreds of thousands) sold every year to people who only do 200 miles a week or less

People with scooters and motorbikes seem to cope quite well with <200 mile range.

[Tuvra]

I think the car will look a better in two tone (excuse the rough photoshop):

[Mr Will]

Zoon said:

Mr Will said:

Refilling a hydrogen car takes 5 minutes, plus the time taken to drive to the filling station, queue up for the pump, queue up to pay and then drive back to the route you actually wanted to be on.

Recharging an electric car involves plugging it in when I get home at night and then unplugging it again the next morning. Total effort <30 seconds and it always has 200+ miles range when I get in each morning. I would go months without ever having to visit a public charging station.

Imagine for a moment that someone invented a hydrogen fuel cell for mobile phones (bear with me!). It is tiny and lightweight and would power your phone for a whole week on a single charge and recharge in just 5 minutes BUT you need to take it to a mobile phone shop to get it recharged - do you see how ridiculous the idea is?

It's as ridiculous as trying to drive 200 miles in an electric car at night with the wipers going and AC on.
Both have their benefits although ICE cars still have the edge for flexibility. How many EV's can you charge up at a public charging station in 30 minutes vs the same argument for ICE cars at a public filling station - do you see how ridiculous that is?

How many people regularly do 200+ miles per day? Personally it's extremely rare that I do more than 120 - I'd expect a "200 mile" range EV to cover that quite comfortably even with lights and wipers on. I don't think that's unusual. The average UK driver has a commute of less than 10 miles each way, even if you add on school runs and some SDP mileage you are still a long way off taxing the range of a Tesla.

Regarding the filling stations, how much space does a public charging station take up vs a petrol/hydrogen station? It is practical to have a lot more of them, in much more convenient locations.

At home charging would also greatly reduce the demand. At the moment, I have to refuel at a petrol station roughly 25 times a year. With an EV that would drop to 2 or three times.

[Zoon]

KTF said:

People with scooters and motorbikes seem to cope quite well with <200 mile range.

Yes by stopping at a nearby petrol station when they need to refuel.

[Thankyou4calling]

There are an awful lot on this thread who are talking from there own perspective and making statements as if it's the same for all.

Dismissing electric cars for daft reasons that yes, might stop them buying one but there are an awful lot of people who it won't.

First if the car has a range of 200 miles that's MORE than the average mileage people drive in the UK each week, so talk of having to charge every night isn't a factor, they'd charge it once a week the same as they add fuel.

Saying most people don't have a drive may (may!) be true but an awful lot of people DO have a drive so home charging is an option, no hassle.

Saying there won't be enough electricity is nonsense, there is plenty and more can be generated, if more is used, far from the price rising it might well go down.

Teslas and electric vehicles aren't going to be for everyone, no car is but if they can put them out for £350 a month then trust me they will be snapped up by plenty.

Saying they'll not catch on sounds a bit like the bloke who didn't sign the Beatles or who dismissed mobile phones as only for the rich.

I must say though that sounds like a lot of deposits taken.

Edited by Thankyou4calling on Friday 1st April 13:08

[JD]

Impasse said:

dlockhart said:

Nope, lets assume they charge twice a week and do 120 miles on a charge - that's 12k a year

In your opinion What is the correct amount people should spend if they drive 12k a year?

The previous comment suggested they'd only need to recharge once a week so that makes your mileage predictions to be about 6k pa. If that's the case then a small car with a corresponding small petrol engine might be a better financial buy if the cost of fuel is your primary concern when making purchasing decisions.

The average UK annual mileage is 8K, or 150 miles per week.

Even taking the 215 mile range with a large deal of salt, would still indicate the average owner would require one charge a week.

[Mr Will]

smilo996 said:

Compared to the BMW i3 which really is revolutionary, the Tesla is like a 70's Caddy.

What exactly is so revolutionary about the tiny, short ranged, and expensive i3?