Anthony Davidson - Dick or not?
Discussion
lowdrag said:
The word from the ACO is that he was quite brusque and rude about it saying that "he should have seen me coming and got out of the way". Now the Porsche Curves are not a place for overtaking and contact or not anywhere offline=marbles=disaster. A second or so wouldn't have mattered at that stage of the race and it was downright dangerous driving in my opinion. Sports car racing is not like F1, and he should understand more of the ethos and culture of sports cars.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kU70l_cQ2doYou can see the attitude in the clip, regardless of the rights or wrongs of the move I don't see that this paints him in a good light... disappointed.
Edited by touching cloth on Wednesday 16th June 10:49
dirty boy said:
I've just been watching it, he left it wide open, AD was well within his rights to take the opportunity IMO.
I don't think he so much left it wide open, as found a Peugeot where he *needed* to be.Collard had begun to turn in when AD went through on the inside but couldn't carry on in towards the apex because there was the Pug there, so he just lost grip and off he went. These aren't like NASCARs where you may be able to run a high or low line, the GT cars seem to be far more dependent of being able to take the racing line as they don't have the aero grip of the LMP cars.
I don't suppose the aero impact on the Corvette of the Pug going by is negligible either, and likely contributed to the loss of grip he experienced.
From the video it looks like Collard has tried to just take the racing line, with the view to letting AD past after the Porsche curves. He did leave the door open, but that isn't really the issue - he didn't leave the door open with the intention of Davidson going through and preventing him from turning in.
If Davidson had apologised and not displayed such an awful attitude afterwards I would have said "fair enough, racing incident" as it is, I have lost a lot of respect for Davidson - when racing on track with other classes it is all about discretion which is something he should know as much as anyone.
If Davidson had apologised and not displayed such an awful attitude afterwards I would have said "fair enough, racing incident" as it is, I have lost a lot of respect for Davidson - when racing on track with other classes it is all about discretion which is something he should know as much as anyone.
You can't blame him for that move just because Collard went off. Both Audi and Peugeot take huge risks in lapping cars, McNish is a prime example for that as well.
It was just the first time that a move of either one of the competitors went wrong for the slower car.
What I didn't like about AD was that move on the Hunaudières as it was out of bounds but that move on Collard is what every driver of any of these 7 diesels would have done and probably had done during the 24, just without that very result which was bad luck for Collard
It was just the first time that a move of either one of the competitors went wrong for the slower car.
What I didn't like about AD was that move on the Hunaudières as it was out of bounds but that move on Collard is what every driver of any of these 7 diesels would have done and probably had done during the 24, just without that very result which was bad luck for Collard
I have to say this is a depressingly ill-informed and unintelligent thread on an alleged enthusiast's forum.
The Corvette Racing press release states the following:
"At 8:24 a.m., the No. 64 Corvette C6.R had hard contact with the barriers in the Porsche Curves after an aggressive pass by the No. 1 Peugeot LMP1. Driver Emmanuel Collard was not injured in the accident.
"I turned to the second left in the Porsche corner and the Peugeot was on the inside," Collard said. "I didn't know he was there, I was focused on my driving. There was no contact, but he was there on the inside and I missed the right line. The car lost grip, and I crashed."
So - they agree it was agressive. Manu admits he didn't know that the Peugoet was inside him. Manu admits that he went off line and shunted.
Racing accident, end of.
As for John Hindhaugh's on air attack on Ant, that was just unnecessary. Not sure what John was smoking this weekend but he didn't seem his usual jovial and light-hearted self at all.
So - Ant did make a hard move but I would respectfully suggest to the good people of pistonheads that his race performance was somewhat more impressive than Nigel's and that we should err on the side of supporting younger Brit talent, even if it is of the ginger variety. Davidson has the speed and ability to be the next McSquish so let's keep to objective views of the event and not resort to calling him names.
The Corvette Racing press release states the following:
"At 8:24 a.m., the No. 64 Corvette C6.R had hard contact with the barriers in the Porsche Curves after an aggressive pass by the No. 1 Peugeot LMP1. Driver Emmanuel Collard was not injured in the accident.
"I turned to the second left in the Porsche corner and the Peugeot was on the inside," Collard said. "I didn't know he was there, I was focused on my driving. There was no contact, but he was there on the inside and I missed the right line. The car lost grip, and I crashed."
So - they agree it was agressive. Manu admits he didn't know that the Peugoet was inside him. Manu admits that he went off line and shunted.
Racing accident, end of.
As for John Hindhaugh's on air attack on Ant, that was just unnecessary. Not sure what John was smoking this weekend but he didn't seem his usual jovial and light-hearted self at all.
So - Ant did make a hard move but I would respectfully suggest to the good people of pistonheads that his race performance was somewhat more impressive than Nigel's and that we should err on the side of supporting younger Brit talent, even if it is of the ginger variety. Davidson has the speed and ability to be the next McSquish so let's keep to objective views of the event and not resort to calling him names.
m. toad said:
I have to say this is a depressingly ill-informed and unintelligent thread on an alleged enthusiast's forum.
The Corvette Racing press release states the following:
"At 8:24 a.m., the No. 64 Corvette C6.R had hard contact with the barriers in the Porsche Curves after an aggressive pass by the No. 1 Peugeot LMP1. Driver Emmanuel Collard was not injured in the accident.
"I turned to the second left in the Porsche corner and the Peugeot was on the inside," Collard said. "I didn't know he was there, I was focused on my driving. There was no contact, but he was there on the inside and I missed the right line. The car lost grip, and I crashed."
So - they agree it was agressive. Manu admits he didn't know that the Peugoet was inside him. Manu admits that he went off line and shunted.
Racing accident, end of.
As for John Hindhaugh's on air attack on Ant, that was just unnecessary. Not sure what John was smoking this weekend but he didn't seem his usual jovial and light-hearted self at all.
So - Ant did make a hard move but I would respectfully suggest to the good people of pistonheads that his race performance was somewhat more impressive than Nigel's and that we should err on the side of supporting younger Brit talent, even if it is of the ginger variety. Davidson has the speed and ability to be the next McSquish so let's keep to objective views of the event and not resort to calling him names.
This has all been discussed on the main thread. The Corvette Racing press release states the following:
"At 8:24 a.m., the No. 64 Corvette C6.R had hard contact with the barriers in the Porsche Curves after an aggressive pass by the No. 1 Peugeot LMP1. Driver Emmanuel Collard was not injured in the accident.
"I turned to the second left in the Porsche corner and the Peugeot was on the inside," Collard said. "I didn't know he was there, I was focused on my driving. There was no contact, but he was there on the inside and I missed the right line. The car lost grip, and I crashed."
So - they agree it was agressive. Manu admits he didn't know that the Peugoet was inside him. Manu admits that he went off line and shunted.
Racing accident, end of.
As for John Hindhaugh's on air attack on Ant, that was just unnecessary. Not sure what John was smoking this weekend but he didn't seem his usual jovial and light-hearted self at all.
So - Ant did make a hard move but I would respectfully suggest to the good people of pistonheads that his race performance was somewhat more impressive than Nigel's and that we should err on the side of supporting younger Brit talent, even if it is of the ginger variety. Davidson has the speed and ability to be the next McSquish so let's keep to objective views of the event and not resort to calling him names.
It would appear that everyone who drives a GT car at Le mans, including those who have driven GT and prototypes, all agree that getting a GT car through the Porsche Curves at speed is an onerous task due to the car's weight and lack of downforce. Everyone who has knowledge of driving those cars says there is only one line through those curves, and the drivers appear to be saying that it's actually harder to drive a GT car at that part of the track than it is a prototype.
Have a look from 5' 20" of this film made last year which turns out to be bang on topic: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dK4sf36Bss4
The point i would like to make is not so much about AD, but about the drivers of the slower cars. It seems that many people are thinking that the the majority of the field, once you get beyond the leading group of prototypes - 3 Audis and 3 Pugs in this year's case - are there just to make the numbers up and provide opportunities for overtaking. But they're not.
I also think that not enough people are giving the drivers of the none-prototype classes any credit, and that any of them who gets hit by a faster car is automatically at fault. It seems that a great many think that the view from 2 patches of mirrored glass is the same as the view forwards from the windshield, but nothing could be further from the truth.
It also seems to me that a great many think that, when muscling a GT car through the Porsche Curves, the driver should not be concentrating to his maximum on the job at hand, but should be carrying out this difficult task whilst looking in the mirrors and the mirrors only. Well, I don't think they're going to do that, and i think most of the prototype drivers know that too. I certainly think the guys who win on a regular basis know that.
There is another point worth making imo. Pug were playing catch up. Why? Because thy hadn't done as good a job as other teams. Pug had suffered mechanical maladies and driver errors, costing them four laps in Pug #1's case. Is it right therefore that the other teams who had not made these mistakes, in whatever class they're in, should automatically fall over themselves in getting out of the way of a car(s) that are not being operated so well? I would suggest not.
The Corvette team were on schedule to come away with a great win. The Peugeot team were on schedule to come away with sod all. Did they know that at the time? Well, at the time AD tangled with the Vette yes, the maths was indeed saying that.
So I don't think AD can justify his "outta my way, I'm coming through" attitude. The only reason he was having to drive like that was 'cos a) his car had been unreliable and b) he'd tripped over another backmarker already, costing him time. Indeed I think AD himself said you can't win Le Mans without an error free run, so why was he clumsily barging his way past people having already suffered those errors? There was no (or certainly very little) point.
A great effort to get the Pug back somewhere near schedule, exciting to watch, they almost got close enough to where the Audis might have turned the wick up a bit in response, but all in all I'm not sure it's the best way to address the task of winning Le Mans, and AD's comments afterwards are those of a single seater driver and not an endurance driver, imo.
heebeegeetee said:
This has all been discussed on the main thread.
It would appear that everyone who drives a GT car at Le mans, including those who have driven GT and prototypes, all agree that getting a GT car through the Porsche Curves at speed is an onerous task due to the car's weight and lack of downforce. Everyone who has knowledge of driving those cars says there is only one line through those curves, and the drivers appear to be saying that it's actually harder to drive a GT car at that part of the track than it is a prototype.
Have a look from 5' 20" of this film made last year which turns out to be bang on topic: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dK4sf36Bss4
The point i would like to make is not so much about AD, but about the drivers of the slower cars. It seems that many people are thinking that the the majority of the field, once you get beyond the leading group of prototypes - 3 Audis and 3 Pugs in this year's case - are there just to make the numbers up and provide opportunities for overtaking. But they're not.
I also think that not enough people are giving the drivers of the none-prototype classes any credit, and that any of them who gets hit by a faster car is automatically at fault. It seems that a great many think that the view from 2 patches of mirrored glass is the same as the view forwards from the windshield, but nothing could be further from the truth.
It also seems to me that a great many think that, when muscling a GT car through the Porsche Curves, the driver should not be concentrating to his maximum on the job at hand, but should be carrying out this difficult task whilst looking in the mirrors and the mirrors only. Well, I don't think they're going to do that, and i think most of the prototype drivers know that too. I certainly think the guys who win on a regular basis know that.
There is another point worth making imo. Pug were playing catch up. Why? Because thy hadn't done as good a job as other teams. Pug had suffered mechanical maladies and driver errors, costing them four laps in Pug #1's case. Is it right therefore that the other teams who had not made these mistakes, in whatever class they're in, should automatically fall over themselves in getting out of the way of a car(s) that are not being operated so well? I would suggest not.
The Corvette team were on schedule to come away with a great win. The Peugeot team were on schedule to come away with sod all. Did they know that at the time? Well, at the time AD tangled with the Vette yes, the maths was indeed saying that.
So I don't think AD can justify his "outta my way, I'm coming through" attitude. The only reason he was having to drive like that was 'cos a) his car had been unreliable and b) he'd tripped over another backmarker already, costing him time. Indeed I think AD himself said you can't win Le Mans without an error free run, so why was he clumsily barging his way past people having already suffered those errors? There was no (or certainly very little) point.
A great effort to get the Pug back somewhere near schedule, exciting to watch, they almost got close enough to where the Audis might have turned the wick up a bit in response, but all in all I'm not sure it's the best way to address the task of winning Le Mans, and AD's comments afterwards are those of a single seater driver and not an endurance driver, imo.
Bravo sir - agree with all of that.It would appear that everyone who drives a GT car at Le mans, including those who have driven GT and prototypes, all agree that getting a GT car through the Porsche Curves at speed is an onerous task due to the car's weight and lack of downforce. Everyone who has knowledge of driving those cars says there is only one line through those curves, and the drivers appear to be saying that it's actually harder to drive a GT car at that part of the track than it is a prototype.
Have a look from 5' 20" of this film made last year which turns out to be bang on topic: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dK4sf36Bss4
The point i would like to make is not so much about AD, but about the drivers of the slower cars. It seems that many people are thinking that the the majority of the field, once you get beyond the leading group of prototypes - 3 Audis and 3 Pugs in this year's case - are there just to make the numbers up and provide opportunities for overtaking. But they're not.
I also think that not enough people are giving the drivers of the none-prototype classes any credit, and that any of them who gets hit by a faster car is automatically at fault. It seems that a great many think that the view from 2 patches of mirrored glass is the same as the view forwards from the windshield, but nothing could be further from the truth.
It also seems to me that a great many think that, when muscling a GT car through the Porsche Curves, the driver should not be concentrating to his maximum on the job at hand, but should be carrying out this difficult task whilst looking in the mirrors and the mirrors only. Well, I don't think they're going to do that, and i think most of the prototype drivers know that too. I certainly think the guys who win on a regular basis know that.
There is another point worth making imo. Pug were playing catch up. Why? Because thy hadn't done as good a job as other teams. Pug had suffered mechanical maladies and driver errors, costing them four laps in Pug #1's case. Is it right therefore that the other teams who had not made these mistakes, in whatever class they're in, should automatically fall over themselves in getting out of the way of a car(s) that are not being operated so well? I would suggest not.
The Corvette team were on schedule to come away with a great win. The Peugeot team were on schedule to come away with sod all. Did they know that at the time? Well, at the time AD tangled with the Vette yes, the maths was indeed saying that.
So I don't think AD can justify his "outta my way, I'm coming through" attitude. The only reason he was having to drive like that was 'cos a) his car had been unreliable and b) he'd tripped over another backmarker already, costing him time. Indeed I think AD himself said you can't win Le Mans without an error free run, so why was he clumsily barging his way past people having already suffered those errors? There was no (or certainly very little) point.
A great effort to get the Pug back somewhere near schedule, exciting to watch, they almost got close enough to where the Audis might have turned the wick up a bit in response, but all in all I'm not sure it's the best way to address the task of winning Le Mans, and AD's comments afterwards are those of a single seater driver and not an endurance driver, imo.
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