Fun daily £10K budget
Discussion
Pistonheads gurus I need your assistance… earlier this year I purchased myself an A90 Supra which has been a dream car of mine ever since they dropped the concept. It replaced a Mini Cooper S coupe. As a ‘daily’ I also have a 2012 Ibiza FR, with the 2.0tdi 140bhp engine.
The plan was to use the Supra on the weekends, and use the Ibiza for the trips to the office (110 mile round trip, mixture of motorway, dual carriage or some nice twisty A/B roads). Currently head to the office 2 days as week, plus site visits. The problem is, every time I have to drive the Ibiza now after being in the supra I hate it… high driving position, clattery diesel noise etc. As such I’m now using the Supra as a daily, and I’m worried the specialness of it is wearing off. Also, some of my site visits for work aren’t to the best places, and my line of work it can be frowned upon if you show up in a bright red sports car…
So I think I need a fun daily to replace the Supra. The requirements are:
0-60 in sub 8 seconds
Manual
No more than 80,000 miles
Reasonable reliability
‘Fun’ to drive (entirely subjective).
£10K budget, but less would be helpful…
Doesn’t need to be massively practical as partner has Mazda 3 for tip runs.
I’ve come up with this short list:
Mazda mx5 NC1. Plenty in budget. Had one back few years ago and seems to hit the criteria. Fun enough, reliable, cheap etc. BUT I’ve read nothing but horror stories about some pretty shocking rust appearing on low mileage cars. Budget is healthy enough that I could get a rot box and get it repaired… but not sure I want the hassle. Plus I’ve had one already so something new Would be good.
FN2 civic type R. Had an EP3 back in the day so familiar with the engine. Honda reliability, and I find the lack of torque and revving them out entertaining, certainly much different driving experience to the Supra. Downsides…. They’re thin on the ground and many look abused and tired. Also I loved my EP3 and worried the FN2 may jade my memories of that it doesn’t serve me well.
BMW Z4 E85, either 2.5i, 2.5si or 3.0si facelift cars. Would meet the ‘fun’ aspect as roof comes off. Manual box makes it different to the supra. 2.5si seems the sweet spot but not many around and prices seem very strong for what are at their newest 15 year old cars. Albeit their design in my opinion has aged well. Apart from roof motors they seem generally quite reliable with few horror stories. They look like they wear their high miles well, and a 3.0si fully spec’s with over 100K miles can be had for around £6K leaving plenty of budget for repairs. I have an aversion (right of wrong!) about cars over 100K, but if I can look past this there are some bargains to be had….
R56 Mini Cooper S. been there, done that. Had an earlier R53 before the Mini. Both minis have been expensive Beasts to keep on the road, with plenty of well known serious faults. Again prices seem very strong on these at the minute, and whilst I love minis as a package, I’ve always been driving them with one eye open thinking they’re about to throw up a big bill.
Audi mk2 TT Roadster. Not really ‘fun’ but would be well built. Not sure the roadster works design wise, and the coupe would just seem a bit too similar to the supra…
Back in the day 10K would be a healthy budget, but I’m really struggling to come up with any other suggestions which are workable. The Z4 is the front runner, but I am mindful of their age…
So over to you… find me my next daily.
The plan was to use the Supra on the weekends, and use the Ibiza for the trips to the office (110 mile round trip, mixture of motorway, dual carriage or some nice twisty A/B roads). Currently head to the office 2 days as week, plus site visits. The problem is, every time I have to drive the Ibiza now after being in the supra I hate it… high driving position, clattery diesel noise etc. As such I’m now using the Supra as a daily, and I’m worried the specialness of it is wearing off. Also, some of my site visits for work aren’t to the best places, and my line of work it can be frowned upon if you show up in a bright red sports car…
So I think I need a fun daily to replace the Supra. The requirements are:
0-60 in sub 8 seconds
Manual
No more than 80,000 miles
Reasonable reliability
‘Fun’ to drive (entirely subjective).
£10K budget, but less would be helpful…
Doesn’t need to be massively practical as partner has Mazda 3 for tip runs.
I’ve come up with this short list:
Mazda mx5 NC1. Plenty in budget. Had one back few years ago and seems to hit the criteria. Fun enough, reliable, cheap etc. BUT I’ve read nothing but horror stories about some pretty shocking rust appearing on low mileage cars. Budget is healthy enough that I could get a rot box and get it repaired… but not sure I want the hassle. Plus I’ve had one already so something new Would be good.
FN2 civic type R. Had an EP3 back in the day so familiar with the engine. Honda reliability, and I find the lack of torque and revving them out entertaining, certainly much different driving experience to the Supra. Downsides…. They’re thin on the ground and many look abused and tired. Also I loved my EP3 and worried the FN2 may jade my memories of that it doesn’t serve me well.
BMW Z4 E85, either 2.5i, 2.5si or 3.0si facelift cars. Would meet the ‘fun’ aspect as roof comes off. Manual box makes it different to the supra. 2.5si seems the sweet spot but not many around and prices seem very strong for what are at their newest 15 year old cars. Albeit their design in my opinion has aged well. Apart from roof motors they seem generally quite reliable with few horror stories. They look like they wear their high miles well, and a 3.0si fully spec’s with over 100K miles can be had for around £6K leaving plenty of budget for repairs. I have an aversion (right of wrong!) about cars over 100K, but if I can look past this there are some bargains to be had….
R56 Mini Cooper S. been there, done that. Had an earlier R53 before the Mini. Both minis have been expensive Beasts to keep on the road, with plenty of well known serious faults. Again prices seem very strong on these at the minute, and whilst I love minis as a package, I’ve always been driving them with one eye open thinking they’re about to throw up a big bill.
Audi mk2 TT Roadster. Not really ‘fun’ but would be well built. Not sure the roadster works design wise, and the coupe would just seem a bit too similar to the supra…
Back in the day 10K would be a healthy budget, but I’m really struggling to come up with any other suggestions which are workable. The Z4 is the front runner, but I am mindful of their age…
So over to you… find me my next daily.
Thanks for all the replies folks, some useful things to think about. The ibiza is now up for sale...
pb8g09 said:
Why wouldn’t you replace the Ibiza for a nicer daily like a Volvo or Skoda and keep the Supra?
Or do you not like the Supra as much as you dreamt you would?- I would imagine the Supra will largely be depreciation free (very slow) over the long term.
Nicer daily would beat the Ibiza for sure, but not sure if i'd end up feeling the same as I do now, that it's not fun enough... Or do you not like the Supra as much as you dreamt you would?- I would imagine the Supra will largely be depreciation free (very slow) over the long term.
Xcore said:
M135i
Going to be too similar to the Supra... pb8g09 said:
I think you can get an F56 2 litre Mini Cooper S for that budget now - and they're far more reliable than the older versions if that's the only worry.
This could be a good shout. Last time I checked prices of the F56 they seemed strong, but perhaps they'd squeeze into the top end of the budget. Havent heard too many horror stories about the F56. davek_964 said:
Different cars, but I bought my Mk 2 TT Roadster for the same reasons : Because I was using my "fun" car every day, and I wanted to stop. It didn't work - it simply meant I had a Mk 2 TT Roadster that I didn't use.
Since then, I had a period of about 8 months without the fun car, and the TT grew on me. I do have a "fun" car again, but the TT does get used more now and it is a decent car. I like it, but I still use the "fun" car more than I should, and if you bought a TT Roadster I suspect you'd find the same.
There is the risk of this... the plan for the Supra was weekend use only, and maybe into work once a month but i'm basically using as my daily and the ibiza hasn't moved for a few weeks. I could also find myself in the position where I enjoy the second fun car more than the supra... Since then, I had a period of about 8 months without the fun car, and the TT grew on me. I do have a "fun" car again, but the TT does get used more now and it is a decent car. I like it, but I still use the "fun" car more than I should, and if you bought a TT Roadster I suspect you'd find the same.
Vsix and Vtec said:
I drove an FN2 as a daily for 2 years, which i still had at the time of my joining PH (hence the second part of my name). Whilst I adored it, and would gladly have another, it was the lack of compliance on typical British roads that wore me down and led to me getting something better suited to the long weekend drives.
If I was looking for a fun Honda daily, I'd probably go for a CRZ. Similar boot space to the FN2, similar sporty feel, but less harsh and also reasonably less to run.
I had thought about the CRZ, I do like them but not sure if it would be quick enough... on paper its slower than the Ibiza, albeit likely to be more engaging. I see you can do few mods and remap to release a bit more power which i'd end up exploring. If I was looking for a fun Honda daily, I'd probably go for a CRZ. Similar boot space to the FN2, similar sporty feel, but less harsh and also reasonably less to run.
Earthdweller said:
I’d echo what coldel says .. Z4 30Si is pretty much unbeatable as a package
The 2.5i is only 170bhp and the difference in insurance/running costs between the 218bhp of the 25Si and the 265bhp of the 30Si is negligible .. I’d go for the 30Si every time although there isn’t much in it real world performance between them and some reckon the 25Si is a freer revving unit
I’d add that you need to remove the runflats, check the suspension has been renewed as if not it’ll be shagged and do a clutch delay valve delete .. and you’ll have a great car
The only problem is finding one, and a good one, as they are a rare car, only 693 manual ones sold in the U.K.
I think the 2.5si is the pick from what I can see. Certainly much more of them around than the 3.0si. Prices seem strong on the 3.0, but also they don't seem to be selling, I had my eye on a low mileage one relatively local to me. Up on Autotrader for nearly £9K, appeared on ebay starting bids at £6K and didn't have a single bid. Wonder if the owner will reduce price accordingly... The 2.5i is only 170bhp and the difference in insurance/running costs between the 218bhp of the 25Si and the 265bhp of the 30Si is negligible .. I’d go for the 30Si every time although there isn’t much in it real world performance between them and some reckon the 25Si is a freer revving unit
I’d add that you need to remove the runflats, check the suspension has been renewed as if not it’ll be shagged and do a clutch delay valve delete .. and you’ll have a great car
The only problem is finding one, and a good one, as they are a rare car, only 693 manual ones sold in the U.K.
the later E89 is cheaper in many instances than the 3.0si, but I'm not totally sold on the looks of the E89, and worried about that overly complicated folding roof going wrong!
Spec of the facelift E85 are all over the place, some properly decent spec cars missing heated seats... surely thats a must have for the UK. Alot of the 2.5si have minimal options as well, although I think as a minimum heated seats would be required!
Thanks that’s all really useful information.
It’s rapidly dawning on me that a decent E85 2.5si/3.0si with the spec I want may be hard to come by. There’s not hundreds of them around, and annoyingly most the decent ones seem to be 3 hour plus drives away.
Time to decide whether I’d be happy with the prefacelift, which seems there are many more examples, hold fire until a good example crops up or go down the Audi route… of which there are literally hundreds of them around.
Eurgh it’s never straightforward…
It’s rapidly dawning on me that a decent E85 2.5si/3.0si with the spec I want may be hard to come by. There’s not hundreds of them around, and annoyingly most the decent ones seem to be 3 hour plus drives away.
Time to decide whether I’d be happy with the prefacelift, which seems there are many more examples, hold fire until a good example crops up or go down the Audi route… of which there are literally hundreds of them around.
Eurgh it’s never straightforward…
Thanks all for your feedback, really useful to get others opinions and views.
Deffo leaning towards the Z4, I might try a drive in the lower bhp 2.5i, as there are more around and seem to have better specs bizarrely. Won’t set the world alight but I’ve got the Supra for that… should be comparable in a straight line to a stock NC mx5.
But right now I’ve got a flight to catch. Week of sunny Gran Canaria here we come…
Cheers again all!
Deffo leaning towards the Z4, I might try a drive in the lower bhp 2.5i, as there are more around and seem to have better specs bizarrely. Won’t set the world alight but I’ve got the Supra for that… should be comparable in a straight line to a stock NC mx5.
But right now I’ve got a flight to catch. Week of sunny Gran Canaria here we come…
Cheers again all!
Just to update this for those who are interested; I ended up buying a 2008 Z4 2.5si… for what I consider to be a bit of a bargain price.
It’s an SE but Very well specced, with M sport seats in red, which are heated, CD changer, M sport suspension, m sport multi function wheel, PDC, auto lights and wipers… in fact they only option it seems to be missing are the xenon lights.
It’s done 77K and paid just over £4K for it, missed one service back in 2017. Paintwork needs a good polish as it’s black and shows all the swirls; and wheels a refurb but beyond that it’s a smart little car. Pulls well, sounds great… rather pleased with it!
It’s an SE but Very well specced, with M sport seats in red, which are heated, CD changer, M sport suspension, m sport multi function wheel, PDC, auto lights and wipers… in fact they only option it seems to be missing are the xenon lights.
It’s done 77K and paid just over £4K for it, missed one service back in 2017. Paintwork needs a good polish as it’s black and shows all the swirls; and wheels a refurb but beyond that it’s a smart little car. Pulls well, sounds great… rather pleased with it!
I’ll get some proper photos later today!
Roof motor needs a relocation, but it’s been garaged for the last 8 years, and there is a receipt for a replacement motor from BMW in the service history just prior to that so I’m hopeful it’s not too wet/crusty down there.
I’m trying to not get carried away on spending as it’s just a second car… but… it’s going to get the roof motor done, front suspension refresh, either refurbed or replaced wheels, and a trip to a detailer for a correction…. It will be truly mint then!!
Roof motor needs a relocation, but it’s been garaged for the last 8 years, and there is a receipt for a replacement motor from BMW in the service history just prior to that so I’m hopeful it’s not too wet/crusty down there.
I’m trying to not get carried away on spending as it’s just a second car… but… it’s going to get the roof motor done, front suspension refresh, either refurbed or replaced wheels, and a trip to a detailer for a correction…. It will be truly mint then!!
Funnily enough I'm already a member on there, have been since 2013 when apparently I was considering an E85 before. I settled on the MX5 as they were much cheaper and running costs were significantly less...
As promised here's a snap of the beast:
I did the deal yesterday but didn't pick up the car until today as travelled down alone yesterday to see it. It was a 90 minute drive home which I was slightly worried about, but my partner followed me back and it was fine, bar having to shut the bonnet firmly as I failed to latch it properly... Averaged 39mpg on the way home which I was impressed by. Its much much more refined than my old MX5 was on the motorway, hardly any wind noise and the stock stereo sounds better than my Supra... Most importantly it got the seal of approval from my partner. She is incredibly patient when it comes to my car buying/ranting/browsing/constantly talking about it... she couldn't believe the price paid nor how good it looked in the flesh. The red seats are a strange one, they all look almost hot pink in some pictures but in the flesh they're a lovely deeper wine colour. Really suits the black paintwork. This was prior to me giving the inside a once over with some interior detailer.
So the car isn't perfect - its 15 years old and the interior is showing signs of this. However a few hours with some interior detailing has brought it back to life and got rid of what I think is make-up/foundation from most interior surfaces. This was my third pass over the steering wheel, and it now looks much much better...
The change is quite astonishing, the leather has come up almost like new. The MOT history mentioned front lower suspension bushes worn, specifically front lower arm rear bushes and you can feel it under heavy braking so this will need rectifying sooner rather than later. As mentioned before the wheels need a refurb and the paint could do with going over with a polisher. almost ashamed to post the state of this rear wheel, it is grotty but i'll get it sorted...
From what i've read and seen its a common complaint with these split rims. I'm not sure if i'm going to refurb these or get a different style. Before picking it up I was convinced it needed a set of these (I think they're MV2's?!) but in the flesh I quite like the style which is on the car already.
The paint work looks good from a few metres, but up close you can see it needs some work. Also the parking sensors which were working yesterday appear to have died overnight. But from reading online this is a common problem and could be sorted with some electrical cleaner or if that fails replacement of sensors. None of which sounds too difficult or expensive to sort out.
But not being negative, ultimately it was a cheap car. The original invoice in 2008 was £32K, which is apparently £49K in todays money. So it seems a lot of car for the money. Even with suspect front bushes the turn in is nice and quick, there is plenty of mechanical grip and the engine is delightful. I put half a tank of V Power in it on the way back, and it is probably all in my head but it seemed to quieten right down and felt much keener to rev. It's not the quickest car in the world, but having a decent 6spd manual again found me with a massive grin on my face, and its quick enough for my 'sensible' car! Reviews at the time when they came out suggests you can really feel their weight when cornering, but it doesn't feel that porky to me. Brakes are fantastic. Definitely the right car. (but ask me again in the depths of winter...!)
Thanks for all the advice...if anyone is interested I might start a readers car on this one.
As promised here's a snap of the beast:
I did the deal yesterday but didn't pick up the car until today as travelled down alone yesterday to see it. It was a 90 minute drive home which I was slightly worried about, but my partner followed me back and it was fine, bar having to shut the bonnet firmly as I failed to latch it properly... Averaged 39mpg on the way home which I was impressed by. Its much much more refined than my old MX5 was on the motorway, hardly any wind noise and the stock stereo sounds better than my Supra... Most importantly it got the seal of approval from my partner. She is incredibly patient when it comes to my car buying/ranting/browsing/constantly talking about it... she couldn't believe the price paid nor how good it looked in the flesh. The red seats are a strange one, they all look almost hot pink in some pictures but in the flesh they're a lovely deeper wine colour. Really suits the black paintwork. This was prior to me giving the inside a once over with some interior detailer.
So the car isn't perfect - its 15 years old and the interior is showing signs of this. However a few hours with some interior detailing has brought it back to life and got rid of what I think is make-up/foundation from most interior surfaces. This was my third pass over the steering wheel, and it now looks much much better...
The change is quite astonishing, the leather has come up almost like new. The MOT history mentioned front lower suspension bushes worn, specifically front lower arm rear bushes and you can feel it under heavy braking so this will need rectifying sooner rather than later. As mentioned before the wheels need a refurb and the paint could do with going over with a polisher. almost ashamed to post the state of this rear wheel, it is grotty but i'll get it sorted...
From what i've read and seen its a common complaint with these split rims. I'm not sure if i'm going to refurb these or get a different style. Before picking it up I was convinced it needed a set of these (I think they're MV2's?!) but in the flesh I quite like the style which is on the car already.
The paint work looks good from a few metres, but up close you can see it needs some work. Also the parking sensors which were working yesterday appear to have died overnight. But from reading online this is a common problem and could be sorted with some electrical cleaner or if that fails replacement of sensors. None of which sounds too difficult or expensive to sort out.
But not being negative, ultimately it was a cheap car. The original invoice in 2008 was £32K, which is apparently £49K in todays money. So it seems a lot of car for the money. Even with suspect front bushes the turn in is nice and quick, there is plenty of mechanical grip and the engine is delightful. I put half a tank of V Power in it on the way back, and it is probably all in my head but it seemed to quieten right down and felt much keener to rev. It's not the quickest car in the world, but having a decent 6spd manual again found me with a massive grin on my face, and its quick enough for my 'sensible' car! Reviews at the time when they came out suggests you can really feel their weight when cornering, but it doesn't feel that porky to me. Brakes are fantastic. Definitely the right car. (but ask me again in the depths of winter...!)
Thanks for all the advice...if anyone is interested I might start a readers car on this one.
Mr Tidy said:
I do like a red interior!
But your wheels are 108s which tend to be expensive to refurb as they need to be split for a proper job, and the bolts tend to snap which can get expensive when they are about £5 each with 20 in each wheel.
So I sold mine while they still looked decent!
Yes my research has suggested it could be upto £100 a corner… I think that’s a job which can wait till Summer! But your wheels are 108s which tend to be expensive to refurb as they need to be split for a proper job, and the bolts tend to snap which can get expensive when they are about £5 each with 20 in each wheel.
So I sold mine while they still looked decent!
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