RE: Noble M12 GTO-3R

RE: Noble M12 GTO-3R

Monday 12th January 2004

Noble M12 GTO-3R

Graham Bell samples the latest evolution of the M12


Noble M12 GTO-3R The M12 will probably go down in automotive history as the pivotal model in Lee Noble’s career. That’s because despite some 20 years devising sports cars including the Ultima and Ascari Ecosse, it wasn’t until the M12 that the mainstream motoring press and buying public really sat up and took notice and Lee finally got the recognition and success his talents had long deserved.

Demand for the M12 over the past three years has seen Noble go from a company housed in one small industrial unit struggling to sell a car that nobody wanted (the M10, from which the M12 is derived) to one housed in several large industrial units, with international sales and a growing waiting list currently approaching the six month mark.

The 3R

Most of this is for the new M12 GTO-3R, which can be distinguished from both the original M12 GTO and the new GTO-3 by the revised nose with faired in lights, the equi-spaced 10 spoke wheels and leather rather than Alcantara trim. Overall though it’s essentially the same car, with the steel spaceframe chassis and custom made all round wishbone suspension being identical to the original M12’s and the only really significant changes being to the engine and transmission.

Noble M12 GTO 3R

The engine is now based around the 3-litre version of Ford’s Duratec V6, and as with earlier M12 powerplants is built by John Noble (no relation) in Chesterfield. Exactly what changes are made to the internals are a secret, but there’s no hiding the fact it has a couple of turbochargers tacked on externally, though these are smaller than used with the GTO’s 2.5-litre to help minimise lag.

Other external mods compared to the GTO include the repositioning of the air filters, which were mounted to the rear bulkhead but have now been moved aft to share the intercooler’s air box and cold air feed, while at the opposite end of the gas tract there’s a new exhaust system with visible twin tail pipes.

Power Mad

Maximum power is now up from 310bhp to 352bhp (at 6,200rpm) while torque is up from 320lb ft to 350lb ft, with that figure being pretty constant between 3,500 and 5,000rpm and about 85% of it being available from just 2,000rpm, making for a very tractable engine.

Noble M12 GTO 3R

Handling all this grunt is the new 6-speed Ford/Getrag gearbox and a Quaife automatic torque-biasing LSD (rather than an open Ford diff as used with the GTO/GTO-3’s 5-speed). As 1st and 2nd are slightly higher with the 6-speed, the 3R’s 3.7 second 0-60 time is barely quicker than the GTO’s, but with the 6-speed also having a lower 3rd, 4th and 5th the resulting close ratios give a marked improvement up through the gears.

The result of these powertrain changes is that while the 3R’s driving environment will (aside from minor trim changes) feel immediately familiar to GTO owners, the driving experience won’t.

In the original M12, progress along country roads is accompanied by the almost constant chirrup – whoosh, chirrup – whoosh produced by the turbos and induction system following every change of throttle setting, which while entertaining in small doses could prove tiring on long trips. In the 3R the chirrup – whoosh is still there, but it’s far more subdued and seems occasional rather than constant.

Quieter

This is partly due to the repositioned air filters and turbos and partly due to extra sound insulation, which combined with the 6-speed’s longer legged top gear (26.5mph per 1,000rpm as opposed to 23.2) also helps to reduce noise at motorway cruising speeds.

Another noticeable difference is the gear change, which with the 5-speed box is rather notchy, while the 6-speeder’s is apparently better. I say apparently because the linkage in the test car had developed a sloppiness that Noble hadn’t had time to deal with. I don’t know if it was related, but it also had a reluctance to engage first from neutral, though if you slotted it into second and then engaged first it went in fine. However, this was a minor irritation that only cropped up at junctions and in town, while the sloppy linkage wasn’t a real problem either, with only one wrongly engaged gear all day, though it would be interesting to see what it should be like.

Noble M12 GTO 3R

It would also be interesting to see what the steering would be like without power assistance as I don’t think mid-engined cars need it, but as most people these days want it, the M12 has it whether you like it or not.  Happily it isn’t one of those vague, lifeless systems but one that provides a reasonable amount of feel along with a reasonably quick 2.6 turns lock to lock. Although lacking the intimacy of the best non-assisted systems it does make for an easy, comfortable drive, with only a couple of really bad potholes producing any kick-back through the steering, which means that only a light grip on the wheel is required even along bumpy roads at high speed.

Bump

In fact the M12 seems to take high speed bumpy roads in its stride, remaining totally composed and feeling solidly planted to the tarmac and not in the least skittish like some cars do. This is probably partly down to the supple suspension and partly due to that rear wing, which far from being just a Max Power posing accessory does apparently make a noticeable difference to the car’s high speed stability.

The supple suspension pays dividends at low speed around town too, with manholes and patch repairs barely making themselves felt in the cabin, which combined with solid construction and good build quality also meant there were no creaks or rattles. It makes you wonder why some manufacturers continue to put rock hard suspension on their performance cars when the M12 proves that a skilful combination of supple suspension and stiff chassis can provide both a comfortable ride and outstanding handling.

Ah yes, the handling. The ability to tackle the bendy bits more quickly than just about anything else on the road has always been one of the M12’s big selling points. Well, not only does the 3R have exactly the same suspension that made the original M12 so good, it also has that LSD for improved traction, so it should be even better.

Easy does it

However, driving on damp public roads on a frosty December day dictated a decidedly cautious approach to cornering for this test - especially as I’d earlier had a 2.5-litre GTO sideways while accelerating from the urban limit along a straight country lane…

In the event the 3R proved to be so surefooted and confidence inspiring that even when driving cautiously along damp roads was still easy to travel very quickly. Although hardly approaching its cornering limits, I can tell you that the 3R turns in keenly and shrugged off my 30mph tight right hander test with not even a hint of understeer. And once you’ve given those Bridgestone S-03s chance to warm up, then even on damp roads it’ll drive out of tight bends in low gears with fairly enthusiastic throttle openings without any unwanted wheelspin or power oversteer.

That Quaife LSD is obviously a factor in this, as is the tractability of the 3-litre engine, which pulls strongly from low revs and exhibits a power delivery that feels more akin to a normally aspirated engine than a traditional tuned turbo job. Use its power to the full and the resulting performance is awesome, with acceleration that puts the 3R firmly in the exclusive sub-ten second 0-100mph club and a claimed top speed of 170mph.

Halt!

The stopping power provided by the all-round 330mm drilled and vented discs is rather impressive too, though with servo assistance and no ABS the 3R’s wheels did lock up during very heavy braking on the slippery roads. However, with some quick cadence braking the Noble was still able to stop both rapidly and in a straight line, while the nicely progressive brake pedal means that locked wheels aren’t normally a problem even on damp roads.

Overall the 3R proved to be very capable on both urban and rural roads, combining reasonable refinement with high levels of performance and driving enjoyment - but would it be possible to live with one on an everyday basis?

Noble M12 GTO 3R

Well, restricted rearward visibility makes for difficult reverse parking manoeuvres, and with no external stowage space, anything you need to carry has to go in the cabin, which has two good size door pockets, a couple of elasticated map pockets and some space behind the fixed back seats. It also has ample space for two humans, with the M12 accommodating drivers up to 6’ 4” tall and offering the option of air conditioning to keep them cosy.

So while the 3R might initially look more road and track toy than daily driver, it’s really no more impractical than an Elise, so if you can stretch to the £52,500+ it costs but can’t afford a runabout as well, then yes, you probably could live with one on an everyday basis.

I for one would certainly be willing to give it a try…

Copyright © Graham Bell 2004

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Author
Discussion

tuscansix

Original Poster:

535 posts

275 months

Tuesday 13th January 2004
quotequote all
No comment necessary.
Just bringing it to everyone's attention.

dejoux

772 posts

282 months

Wednesday 14th January 2004
quotequote all
*drool*

Who can afford a £50K car but cant afford a runabout

If someone wants to give me one Ill give it a try too




>> Edited by dejoux on Wednesday 14th January 03:54

blueyes

4,799 posts

251 months

Wednesday 14th January 2004
quotequote all
I've considered one but how do you manage when you go somewhere for a long weekend... let alone touring in Europe for a month? Send your luggage on? Buy clothes when you get there? Fit a trailer/roofrack? Any suggestions?

sidekick

266 posts

250 months

Wednesday 14th January 2004
quotequote all
The Noble luggage set provides more storage space than you'd imagine - certainly enough for a couple of weeks worth of summer gear. Having said that they're £500, which I'm afraid is daylight robbery for 6 nylon bags with a Noble logo stitched into them.

amg merc

11,954 posts

252 months

Wednesday 14th January 2004
quotequote all
blueyes said:
I've considered one but how do you manage when you go somewhere for a long weekend... let alone touring in Europe for a month? Send your luggage on? Buy clothes when you get there? Fit a trailer/roofrack? Any suggestions?


Well they say that's what the fitted luggage set is for, although it would make a mess of that tuxedo you brought along for Monte Carlo!

amg merc

11,954 posts

252 months

Wednesday 14th January 2004
quotequote all
sidekick said:
The Noble luggage set provides more storage space than you'd imagine - certainly enough for a couple of weeks worth of summer gear. Having said that they're £500, which I'm afraid is daylight robbery for 6 nylon bags with a Noble logo stitched into them.


I agree martin, surely someone with links to a factory in Asia Pacific could produce a set for around £150 incl. del?!

amg merc

11,954 posts

252 months

Wednesday 14th January 2004
quotequote all
dejoux said:
*drool*

Who can afford a £50K car but cant afford a runabout

If someone wants to give me one Ill give it a try too


I think we should start calling it a £60K car as, with factory options your close to £58K these days!
AMGMerc




>> Edited by dejoux on Wednesday 14th January 03:54

micknall

826 posts

248 months

Wednesday 14th January 2004
quotequote all
Someone said to me yesterday that the original GTO was a mere £40k, and now it's £60k. How can we justify such a rise? Before this gets out of hand, allow me to put things in perspective.

A new M12 GTO cost £50 shy of £45k when it was launched. But that was the base price: add aircon, metallic paint, a stereo and alarm and you'd be looking at closer to £48k.

Also bear in mind that we still produce the £47,950 GTO-3, which we only sell in small numbers. This is only £3k more than the original, but has the bigger and more powerful 3.0-litre engine, so it justifies its price increase well.

But so does the 3R. As always, you need to compare the base price of this car with the base price of the original 2.5 - that's £7,550, NOT '£20k' as some are now saying. But for that extra money you get a six-speed 'box, Quaife LSD, 500ccs extra engine capacity, 42bhp extra, 30lb ft more torque, leather interior, a CD/radio as well as a few other interior extras. You also get bi-xenon headlights, a new design of alloy and a re-styled front end. Not bad for £7,550, I'd say.

Fact is that we offer far more options for this car than we did when the M12 was originally launched, so it's easy to make a fully specced 3R look like poor value compared to its predecessor, if you add them all up.

I can't stress enough that the M12 range DOES still start well below fifty grand. And that's no exaggeration!

Marlon

735 posts

257 months

Wednesday 14th January 2004
quotequote all
Good points well made.

We do need to keep this in perspective and reinforce the value statement (away from "60k"), otherwise monkeys like Jezza Clarkson will continue to blurb on about "how it's becoming expensive..."

With a base price of 52.5k (it IS still 52.5k, isn't it Micknall ) and bearing in mind what you get for your money, the 3R is cracking value.

amg merc

11,954 posts

252 months

Wednesday 14th January 2004
quotequote all
Marlon said:
Good points well made.

With a base price of 52.5k (it IS still 52.5k, isn't it Micknall ) and bearing in mind what you get for your money, the 3R is cracking value.


Come on Marlon, let's be realistic - who has ever purchased a new 3R WITHOUT a/c, metallic paint or alarm (total £55,295) - OK it's not £60K but nor is it £52,500 ?!

micknall

826 posts

248 months

Wednesday 14th January 2004
quotequote all
AMG,

There were also very few GTO 2.5s sold without met. paint, an alarm and aircon, so that £7,500 gap still remains about the same...

Marlon

735 posts

257 months

Wednesday 14th January 2004
quotequote all
amg merc said:

Come on Marlon, let's be realistic - who has ever purchased a new 3R WITHOUT a/c, metallic paint or alarm (total £55,295) - OK it's not £60K but nor is it £52,500 ?!

Mine doesn't have metallic paint (Monza red), so there!

OK, so it does have air-con, sump, alarm, kitchen sink,....

:grumble-grumble:

But arguably most manufacturers quote a list price that is below the "average" retail price, and what we don't want is for the Noble "average" to become confused with the Noble "list" price, which is more frequently used as an index to compare like-for-like price and consequently value. If we take into consideration the popularity of optional items on the 3R we should (in fairness) do the same with Ferrari, Porsche, Mercades, etc... Personally, I think it better (for many reasons) to quote the 3R list price.

But I do take your point!

m12_nathan

5,138 posts

258 months

Wednesday 14th January 2004
quotequote all
The options seem a bargain when compare to the £3000 stripe on a Ferrari 360CS!

amg merc

11,954 posts

252 months

Wednesday 14th January 2004
quotequote all
All point valid and relevant as always!

I'll just add one last comment on this - why don't the factory include the cost of the alarm in the base price - it's not like you wouldn't order it - you'd never get insurance anyway - factory comments?!

sidekick

266 posts

250 months

Wednesday 14th January 2004
quotequote all
m12_nathan said:
The options seem a bargain when compare to the £3000 stripe on a Ferrari 360CS!


...and singled out in last weeks Autocar as THE worst value option you can buy from a car manufacturer. Have to say, it makes anything from Noble look like damn good value!

danmangt40

296 posts

283 months

Wednesday 14th January 2004
quotequote all
absolutely the cat's pajamas. If it's still in production when I can afford to spoil myself, It's the first thing I'll look at.

dannylt

1,906 posts

283 months

Thursday 15th January 2004
quotequote all
Graham Bell said:
Exactly what changes are made to the engine internals are a secret
Really? I thought they were quite open about this - basically just extra oil squirters on to the piston bottoms. I've even got some pictures somewhere - very nice clean engine build area they have!

LaurenceFrost

691 posts

251 months

Thursday 15th January 2004
quotequote all
m12_nathan said:
The options seem a bargain when compare to the £3000 stripe on a Ferrari 360CS!


I just wouldn't sleep at night knowing I'd been short changed by £2987.05!

I'm pretty sure Halfords sell something very similar for around £12.95.

MisterX

656 posts

249 months

Thursday 15th January 2004
quotequote all
LaurenceFrost said:

m12_nathan said:
The options seem a bargain when compare to the £3000 stripe on a Ferrari 360CS!



I just wouldn't sleep at night knowing I'd been short changed by £2987.05!

I'm pretty sure Halfords sell something very similar for around £12.95.


Perhaps you have failed to appreciate that the stripe actually makes the car go FASTER!!!

joust

14,622 posts

258 months

Thursday 15th January 2004
quotequote all
amg merc said:

Well they say that's what the fitted luggage set is for, although it would make a mess of that tuxedo you brought along for Monte Carlo!
Actually the "large" bag that fits behind the seats easily takes a suit, or two, along with most other things in the other 5 bags.

Compared to the Elise the car is a bloddy tardis in its ability to swallow stuff.

J