Discussion
So, how about, manufacturers and or other exhibitors get in for free to ensure a good show and the visitors pay regardless of what car they arrive in. That will mean less cars in the fields but more in the halls, manufacturers could contribute to their owners clubs to ensure a club gathering by offering say a free bbq and/or beers. Or kit car drivers should perhaps be charged 50% less than tin top drivers.
Organisers could put an amount on one side to award to the best most entertaining stands. I would build an Exocet in a weekend if there was a carrot dangling, others could have give aways, or music or pay for a live band or donate a prize for the car quiz at night on the basis that the MC keeps mentioning who gave what.
The organisers could also award the club stands with prizes for best display, not in terms of quantity but quality.
I do hope there are more than half a dozen reading all this thread and I hope would be or existing show organsiers are finding it informative.
I wonder if any changes will be made or will it be too much trouble for the organisers to put in the extra effort required to provide a more attractive shop window for kit cars?
Edited to add that; A worrying point is that it appears only 3 kit car show exhibitors are contributing to this thread, are the others not interested or do they see this as a waste of time, or are they just reading?
Mr Cooling should be on here who organises Stoneleigh to let us know what improvements he plans to use to boost next years attendance.
Organisers could put an amount on one side to award to the best most entertaining stands. I would build an Exocet in a weekend if there was a carrot dangling, others could have give aways, or music or pay for a live band or donate a prize for the car quiz at night on the basis that the MC keeps mentioning who gave what.
The organisers could also award the club stands with prizes for best display, not in terms of quantity but quality.
I do hope there are more than half a dozen reading all this thread and I hope would be or existing show organsiers are finding it informative.
I wonder if any changes will be made or will it be too much trouble for the organisers to put in the extra effort required to provide a more attractive shop window for kit cars?
Edited to add that; A worrying point is that it appears only 3 kit car show exhibitors are contributing to this thread, are the others not interested or do they see this as a waste of time, or are they just reading?
Mr Cooling should be on here who organises Stoneleigh to let us know what improvements he plans to use to boost next years attendance.
Edited by Stuart Mills on Friday 14th October 16:14
I have heard kit owners complain when they have to pay to get in, but it's always surprised me that they normally don't have to tbh. When our owners club goes to other (non-kit) shows there's normally a fee, albeit reduced. A discount for turning up in a kit would probably work I'd have thought, although there will be moans from some.
I've heard it said that the kit cars driven there are part of the show so why should they pay to get in & help draw the crowds to help the promoter's pocket. Anyone & everyone - exhibiting manufacturers, parts sales companies, kit car drivers &, of course the multiple MOP - going to a show have costs especially with petrol (& diesel) the price it is &, may be this reinforces this kit car owners' attitude of why should I pay to get in to exhibit my car? Now, tbh, I partly - only partly - agree with this sentiment BUT, as the economics of today's shows are slightly different to 5 years ago, say, then I don't see why, as the last poster said, a 'contribution' of, say, half price shouldn't be charged & paid by the kit car drivers.
I'm 'only' a kit car builder & driver - I've built one & currently have no plans to build another - but I enjoy going to shows whether there is a reasonable entrance fee or if it's free. I'm not a visionary,not an organiser or business man so have difficulty in thinking of ways to make the shows more attractive & to draw in hundreds more punters so sorry I'm not a lot of help on that score but I can see that there have been a lot of good ideas mentioned above.
I'm 'only' a kit car builder & driver - I've built one & currently have no plans to build another - but I enjoy going to shows whether there is a reasonable entrance fee or if it's free. I'm not a visionary,not an organiser or business man so have difficulty in thinking of ways to make the shows more attractive & to draw in hundreds more punters so sorry I'm not a lot of help on that score but I can see that there have been a lot of good ideas mentioned above.
The Black Flash said:
I have heard kit owners complain when they have to pay to get in, but it's always surprised me that they normally don't have to tbh.
Yes, I must admit that I was annually pleasantly surprised that I got in free at Stoneleigh... I always felt a bit furtive/dishonest, just driving through the gates without paying, and every year expected the policy to have changed, to the point where I would usually stop and ask 'is it still free then?', even though they never tried to flag me down.For me, it would have been reward enough to be allowed to drive right into the heart of the complex and park up near the entrance halls, instead of having a mile's hike over the bridge from the far end of the car park, then having to stand in a queue with dozens of eurobox drivers to buy a ticket.
But I guess that doesn't work these days.... the car parks are empty, so not so far to walk, and there aren't any queues at the ticket kiosk any more.
Stuart Mills said:
I will not mention female (wet) mud wrestling.....
Why not?...Eureka!! I think you have just found the answer to the problem...Three bouts, five, ten minute rounds should be enough.............
Or:-
How about ALL exhibiters big and small pay a nominal fee for their stand, say £10/20, and charge EVERYONE, including kit car owners a paltry £5 entry.....The organiser sets his own food stalls up, (not concessions) keeping all the profits.....The place would be packed.
Plus the mud wrestling, I can't see how it could fail..........
What's the phone number for Dragon's Den?
Not so much incorrect as totally f
king pointless.
People are just trying to put forward ideas that may or may not help improve a show - that's all.
In the same way that if I want to buy a kitcar it doesn't mean I want to design and build it from ground up, so if I want to go to a decent Kit Car Show I don't necesarily want to organise it!
king pointless. People are just trying to put forward ideas that may or may not help improve a show - that's all.
In the same way that if I want to buy a kitcar it doesn't mean I want to design and build it from ground up, so if I want to go to a decent Kit Car Show I don't necesarily want to organise it!
smash said:
Not so much incorrect as totally fking pointless.
People are just trying to put forward ideas that may or may not help improve a show - that's all.
In the same way that if I want to buy a kitcar it doesn't mean I want to design and build it from ground up, so if I want to go to a decent Kit Car Show I don't necesarily want to organise it!
This.king pointless. People are just trying to put forward ideas that may or may not help improve a show - that's all.
In the same way that if I want to buy a kitcar it doesn't mean I want to design and build it from ground up, so if I want to go to a decent Kit Car Show I don't necesarily want to organise it!
Better to leave it to the experts who have the experience and the contacts built up over many years...
However, sometimes it is good to think outside the box....(hate that expression)...instead of following the same old tired formula.
There were two other ideas that I put into motion when organising the Sports and Kit Car Show.
The first was a media day held about 10 days prior to the event at Long Marston dragstrip where manufacturers were invited free of charge to meet the press and to let them drive the cars. The media took to this and it worked well for those who supported it. Photos in the local press immediately prior to the show meant that some manufacturers had people heading for their stand in preference to all others.
The second was putting out forms for show visitors to complete whereby they could select up to three manufacturuers whose cars they would like to test drive. These forms were put in a box at the show and sent to the selected manufacturers after the event. Some found that they had up to 20 people willing to travel to their workshops for test drives.
However, there is yet another prime requirement for shows to work and that is - people make their own shows. Enthusiam and commitment equates to success whilst apathy and petty criticism kills them.
In the two instances cited above, not all manufacturers and indeed not all those builders who attended the show wanted to be part of the media day whilst not one manufacturer ever came back and commented on whether having up to 20 people being directed to their premises for test drives was a good thing.
I'm not so sure that either of these ideas are around today, and yet both were effective, simple and almost cost free.
As I say people make their own shows. Apathy kills them. That is as true today as it was when I promoted my first show 37 years ago.
The first was a media day held about 10 days prior to the event at Long Marston dragstrip where manufacturers were invited free of charge to meet the press and to let them drive the cars. The media took to this and it worked well for those who supported it. Photos in the local press immediately prior to the show meant that some manufacturers had people heading for their stand in preference to all others.
The second was putting out forms for show visitors to complete whereby they could select up to three manufacturuers whose cars they would like to test drive. These forms were put in a box at the show and sent to the selected manufacturers after the event. Some found that they had up to 20 people willing to travel to their workshops for test drives.
However, there is yet another prime requirement for shows to work and that is - people make their own shows. Enthusiam and commitment equates to success whilst apathy and petty criticism kills them.
In the two instances cited above, not all manufacturers and indeed not all those builders who attended the show wanted to be part of the media day whilst not one manufacturer ever came back and commented on whether having up to 20 people being directed to their premises for test drives was a good thing.
I'm not so sure that either of these ideas are around today, and yet both were effective, simple and almost cost free.
As I say people make their own shows. Apathy kills them. That is as true today as it was when I promoted my first show 37 years ago.
Dennis that really is a disingenuous post. Stafford was your responsibility and this thread was about the Stafford Show, why it failed and what could be done to revive it or the industry.
You must have seen the car crash coming that was this year's Stafford Show. Old records in my possession show that on 31st December of one year the forthcoming March Stafford Show already had 38 manufacturers and 89 trade stands booked and paid for. That's a lot of floor space covered 10 weeks out. 10 weeks out from this year's Stafford show you were clearly looking at a near empty hall which you continued to present to the public as a show. You must have known deep down that the event was heading for disaster. A disaster you could have steered the public and the many other people who were still prepared to believe and invest in you away from something you knew would be awful.
You also keep saying that Stafford was 'sabotaged' by the manufacturers, hence you must have known that long before this show took place that it was doomed as your empty hall continuously kept shouting at you. Yet you just bowled on with what was a charade. Be honest with yourself Dennis, were you fully honest with the public on this show? You could have cancelled this show long before it disgraced itself by charging the public to enter a near empty hall. In not doing so you also severely damaged the industry - and not for the first time.
Dennis you asked to be told what the problem was even if you were the problem. Sorry to say but you were indeed the problem and for more reasons that I have expressed here.
If the show was indeed 'sabotaged' then there must be an awful lot of people out there who were trying to tell you something very unpleasant and which you ignored in the run up to the event.
Whatever you may feel about the Stoneleigh organisers, they still put on a show that you can only aspire to imitate.
You must have seen the car crash coming that was this year's Stafford Show. Old records in my possession show that on 31st December of one year the forthcoming March Stafford Show already had 38 manufacturers and 89 trade stands booked and paid for. That's a lot of floor space covered 10 weeks out. 10 weeks out from this year's Stafford show you were clearly looking at a near empty hall which you continued to present to the public as a show. You must have known deep down that the event was heading for disaster. A disaster you could have steered the public and the many other people who were still prepared to believe and invest in you away from something you knew would be awful.
You also keep saying that Stafford was 'sabotaged' by the manufacturers, hence you must have known that long before this show took place that it was doomed as your empty hall continuously kept shouting at you. Yet you just bowled on with what was a charade. Be honest with yourself Dennis, were you fully honest with the public on this show? You could have cancelled this show long before it disgraced itself by charging the public to enter a near empty hall. In not doing so you also severely damaged the industry - and not for the first time.
Dennis you asked to be told what the problem was even if you were the problem. Sorry to say but you were indeed the problem and for more reasons that I have expressed here.
If the show was indeed 'sabotaged' then there must be an awful lot of people out there who were trying to tell you something very unpleasant and which you ignored in the run up to the event.
Whatever you may feel about the Stoneleigh organisers, they still put on a show that you can only aspire to imitate.
This thread will only be of use to the industry if continued in a constructive manner, please do not use this space to have a go at Den, your posts prior to today are appreciated as they have shed light and suggest what may work in the future and what did/did not work in the past.
So please continue to assist by giving us the benefit of your experience but please do not get personal with those currently involved in the industry.
I mentioned Mr Cooling as I hope he will be reading at least and hope everyones joint efforts help him to understand that more effort is required to improve the attendance figures at Stoneleigh. I don't want to hear "numbers are down because of X or Y" I need to hear "we are trying harder in these more difficult times"
So please continue to assist by giving us the benefit of your experience but please do not get personal with those currently involved in the industry.
I mentioned Mr Cooling as I hope he will be reading at least and hope everyones joint efforts help him to understand that more effort is required to improve the attendance figures at Stoneleigh. I don't want to hear "numbers are down because of X or Y" I need to hear "we are trying harder in these more difficult times"
Fair Parking said:
Is that the best you've got left?
If people want to bicker then let's do it someplace different to a public forum, what we are ALL of us here trying to achieve are better shows and events. I'm sure that Den wants better events, in fact he said so quite a while ago in this thread. I'm sure FairParking wanted better events, he has certainly been very helpful and open about his experiences, successes and failures. I'm also inclined to think several of the other commentators on this forum who've taken to having a pop at people would also like to see things getting better. As Sam say's let's move on.
So guys and girls cann we grow up a bit and see if we can be constructive. As several of us have said on here, there's been some good input with varieties of viewpoints let's try and work together
If people do want to take this and any other topics to a more private discussion then I have a website on which you can do it which is aimed at the industry and for the industry to discuss exactly this kind of subject, plus all the others that we all have to get through to have the right to build our own vehicles and allow people to have the freedom to chose something different and niche.
It would be good to talk about this and the other issues that affect us all these days and we are very happy to chat to anyone about this on our stand at Exeter, of course you'll be admiring our car so we appreciate that the discussions will be light and purely ideas and different thoughts to consider. We do not expect and indeed do not want to see people bickering and fighting.
So guys and girls cann we grow up a bit and see if we can be constructive. As several of us have said on here, there's been some good input with varieties of viewpoints let's try and work together
If people do want to take this and any other topics to a more private discussion then I have a website on which you can do it which is aimed at the industry and for the industry to discuss exactly this kind of subject, plus all the others that we all have to get through to have the right to build our own vehicles and allow people to have the freedom to chose something different and niche.
It would be good to talk about this and the other issues that affect us all these days and we are very happy to chat to anyone about this on our stand at Exeter, of course you'll be admiring our car so we appreciate that the discussions will be light and purely ideas and different thoughts to consider. We do not expect and indeed do not want to see people bickering and fighting.
qdos said:
I'm sure that Den wants better events, in fact he said so quite a while ago in this thread.
I do indeed, and for me, re-joining this forum was intended to, amongst other things, enable me to get a 'feel' for how best I can serve the show side of the kit car industry in the future.I admitted, early on in this thread, that this year's Stafford show wasn't good. I further admitted personal failings. However, Ron's observations/allegations go way beyond my personal culpability and, in my humble opinion, are not worthy of response due to the aggressive/rude way in which they are put. That said, he made a number of valid points which, if expressed differently, would make for excellent ongoing debate.
one eyed mick said:
I humberly request that this topic should be closed for our own good !!!
Well, I hillmanly (or jaguarly for those more up-market, or impishly for those more down-market) request that this topic should continue for the good of the kit car industry !!!As I said earlier in this thread, keep the bickering out of this forum.
I have the keys to this thead
:jangle jangle:
And I don't want to close it, as it is a fascinating one.
The Sin Bin can also be a lonely place (especially at weekends, when only a skeleton staff walk the sin bin corridors)
Keep personal fights away from PH please.
Last warning.
I have the keys to this thead
:jangle jangle:
And I don't want to close it, as it is a fascinating one.
The Sin Bin can also be a lonely place (especially at weekends, when only a skeleton staff walk the sin bin corridors)
Keep personal fights away from PH please.
Last warning.
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