The Project Singlecoil & Me Have Been Working On.........T
Discussion
Well chaps, here's a rendering of the proposed design for a trackday kit car that we have been working on.
The design here is about 4 weeks out of date, but the shape is mainly unchanged, most changes are around the front mounted rad ducting as a result of some preliminary CFD I have carried out..
This is the first "whole car design" I have done and there are still a few areas in the coming weeks that will be finessed to make more elegant/address any CFD issues.
All CONSTRUCTIVE comment welcome.
The design here is about 4 weeks out of date, but the shape is mainly unchanged, most changes are around the front mounted rad ducting as a result of some preliminary CFD I have carried out..
This is the first "whole car design" I have done and there are still a few areas in the coming weeks that will be finessed to make more elegant/address any CFD issues.
All CONSTRUCTIVE comment welcome.
Edited by TheDetailDoctor on Wednesday 10th March 15:44
Saw this on Fiat Forum a while back. Any details on what running gear you're thinking of using?
It looks quite Sports 2000 inspired, which are lovely looking cars, not sure about practicality for the road though being roof-less? Then again theres plenty of rag top and roofless kit cars about that sell nonetheless!
It looks quite Sports 2000 inspired, which are lovely looking cars, not sure about practicality for the road though being roof-less? Then again theres plenty of rag top and roofless kit cars about that sell nonetheless!
Edited by yazza54 on Wednesday 10th March 15:44
yazza54 said:
Saw this on Fiat Forum a while back. Any details on what running gear you're thinking of using?
Don't know why you would have seen it there, I thought this was the first time it had been published.The running gear will be the engine and gearbox from the Audi A4/VW Passat, which, for those that don't know, is longitudinally mounted, unlike virtually every other FWD car. The engine of choice will be the VAG 1.8t, although it's anticipated that other engines such as RS4 could be used.
Looks pretty good - is it intended to be road legal?
Constructive criticism: My biggest concern would be that when translated to full scale, it will look a bit slab-sided due to the flat side panels between the wheel arches. See the photos of my old Raffo on the 'ugliest kit car' thread, for the effect you don't want to achieve! Maybe think about introducing a bit of a 'waist' to the centre section?
I'm also not personally convinced by the double-bubble fairing in front of the cockpit - apart from anything else it would make fitting a wind deflector more complicated (and fussy-looking) than it needs be (how about a single bubble with an 'aerojet' type venturi deflector, a la Lotus 49/Renault Spider?).
...but those are minor issues of personal taste - I'd say it's certainly on the right track!
ETA: That's better ^^^ (the updated body rendering above). Also, on reflection, the plain disc wheels on the original model aren't helping with the slab-sided effect; it will look better with real wheels on it, I think.
Constructive criticism: My biggest concern would be that when translated to full scale, it will look a bit slab-sided due to the flat side panels between the wheel arches. See the photos of my old Raffo on the 'ugliest kit car' thread, for the effect you don't want to achieve! Maybe think about introducing a bit of a 'waist' to the centre section?
I'm also not personally convinced by the double-bubble fairing in front of the cockpit - apart from anything else it would make fitting a wind deflector more complicated (and fussy-looking) than it needs be (how about a single bubble with an 'aerojet' type venturi deflector, a la Lotus 49/Renault Spider?).
...but those are minor issues of personal taste - I'd say it's certainly on the right track!
ETA: That's better ^^^ (the updated body rendering above). Also, on reflection, the plain disc wheels on the original model aren't helping with the slab-sided effect; it will look better with real wheels on it, I think.
Edited by Sam_68 on Wednesday 10th March 16:02
Sam_68 said:
I'm also not personally convinced by the double-bubble fairing in front of the cockpit - apart from anything else it would make fitting a wind deflector more complicated (and fussy-looking) than it needs be (how about a single bubble with an 'aerojet' type venturi deflector, a la Lotus 49/Renault Spider?).
The intention is to be fully road legal yes.I do also have some very rough ideas as to a body featuring a closed cockpit, Non of which I'm happy to share at this point.
That is one of the areas we have been thinking about. I've got many itterations of a single bubble, non of which I'm happy with to be honest, just tends to look like a blob.
Edited by TheDetailDoctor on Wednesday 10th March 16:17
TheDetailDoctor said:
I've got many itterations of a single bubble, non of which I'm happy with to be honest, just tends to look like a blob.
Then maybe make it a low blob (no higher than the cockpit combing round the sides) with a smoked polycarbonate 'aerojet' screen on top to add detail interest?You're probably going to need some sort of wind deflector to reduce buffeting in the cockpit, so you might as well make a virtue out of a necessity?
Sam_68 said:
Looks pretty good - is it intended to be road legal?
Constructive criticism: My biggest concern would be that when translated to full scale, it will look a bit slab-sided due to the flat side panels between the wheel arches. See the photos of my old Raffo on the 'ugliest kit car' thread, for the effect you don't want to achieve! Maybe think about introducing a bit of a 'waist' to the centre section?
The flat sides will look better when he publishes a more detailed picture, and maybe from a different angle. There should be a line showing where the cockpit moulding joins the sidepod, parallel to the ground, 350mm up from the bottom edge. The sides needs to be straight (in plan view) because that decision needed to be made in order to simplify and stregthen the chassis, which extends into the side pods (and which will provide side impact protection.Constructive criticism: My biggest concern would be that when translated to full scale, it will look a bit slab-sided due to the flat side panels between the wheel arches. See the photos of my old Raffo on the 'ugliest kit car' thread, for the effect you don't want to achieve! Maybe think about introducing a bit of a 'waist' to the centre section?
It is first and foremost a road car, and will be priced at no more than middle of the market, hopefully a bit less. It will be in fact comparatively cheap to build because the builder won't need to spend too much on upgrading the engine.
Hi there.
You could break up the "slab sided" look with those curved vent arrangements, behind the front wheel and/or in front of the rear wheel. Do you know what I mean? Otherwise it looks fine to me. I like the idea of the Renault Spyder windscreen/ duct idea though.
See pic of SPIRE below.
Geoff.
You could break up the "slab sided" look with those curved vent arrangements, behind the front wheel and/or in front of the rear wheel. Do you know what I mean? Otherwise it looks fine to me. I like the idea of the Renault Spyder windscreen/ duct idea though.
See pic of SPIRE below.
Geoff.
I like this picture (another early version) better than the others
I've notified the chassis/suspension designer that we've 'gone public' so he may well choose to post a picture of where he has got to with the chassis.
Both DD and the chassis guy have had to work within restrictions which have included a decent wheelbase (2500 in the pictures, but shortly to be extended by another 50 or 100mm) and the requirement for the chassis to extend into the sidepods for reasons of stiffness and occupant protection,
As I'm sure you have all guessed, the large air intake incorporates a sturdy rollover bar and braces. It will also allow for a large intercooler to be mounted above the engine.
I've notified the chassis/suspension designer that we've 'gone public' so he may well choose to post a picture of where he has got to with the chassis.
Both DD and the chassis guy have had to work within restrictions which have included a decent wheelbase (2500 in the pictures, but shortly to be extended by another 50 or 100mm) and the requirement for the chassis to extend into the sidepods for reasons of stiffness and occupant protection,
As I'm sure you have all guessed, the large air intake incorporates a sturdy rollover bar and braces. It will also allow for a large intercooler to be mounted above the engine.
spyder dryver said:
Hi there.
You could break up the "slab sided" look with those curved vent arrangements, behind the front wheel and/or in front of the rear wheel. Do you know what I mean? Otherwise it looks fine to me. I like the idea of the Renault Spyder windscreen/ duct idea though.
See pic of SPIRE below.
Geoff.
Good god, that's the first time I've seen one of those, the two are quite similar.You could break up the "slab sided" look with those curved vent arrangements, behind the front wheel and/or in front of the rear wheel. Do you know what I mean? Otherwise it looks fine to me. I like the idea of the Renault Spyder windscreen/ duct idea though.
See pic of SPIRE below.
Geoff.
I would echo some of the comments above in so much as it does looke a little slab-sided. It also looks a little long for its body height. I guess it is similar in this respect to a true LMP type car but would probably need more work to accentuate the arches if this is what you are trying to achieve. I think that we are more used to seeing proportions similar to the Spire GT-R in a kit. I appreciate that the scoop includes the ROP but it also looks out of proportion and reminded me of the hood on a baby's pram. You could still fit a large intercooler above the engine with a smaller inlet?
Why such a long wheelbase compared to track?
Regarding body, initial impression is that you need to put some shape into the side to break up what people have called the slab sided, this will help looks but will also make the car seem more cohesive and give an impression of being better finished with no extra cost in manufacture ( flat panel areas look cheap in fibreglass IMO).
The scoop needs a redesign, your entering a Market with a lot of similar looking competition and so looks and initial impression is going to be critical.
Could you makeit a 2 tier scoop, keeping the width at the bottom and then having a better proprtiond scoop at the top?
Regarding body, initial impression is that you need to put some shape into the side to break up what people have called the slab sided, this will help looks but will also make the car seem more cohesive and give an impression of being better finished with no extra cost in manufacture ( flat panel areas look cheap in fibreglass IMO).
The scoop needs a redesign, your entering a Market with a lot of similar looking competition and so looks and initial impression is going to be critical.
Could you makeit a 2 tier scoop, keeping the width at the bottom and then having a better proprtiond scoop at the top?
andygtt said:
Why such a long wheelbase compared to track?
The track is defined by the donor, of course. The width (1700mm) could be increased to cover wider rear wheels, but this car is being specified with very close attention to overall cost. The wheelbase is still shorter than the Ultima, and is needed to provide enough legroom (this car is going to have enough room for everybody, unlike most kit cars on the market).andygtt said:
your entering a Market with a lot of similar looking competition and so looks and initial impression is going to be critical.
Well I suppose the Spire looks similar but I'm not aware of what else does? In any case this car will only be more expensive that cars such as the MK Indy by the amount that it actually needs to be, so that will help sales against cars that are perceived to be similar 
p1doc said:
i take it is is still in utero so to speak or is full prototype being made?
It's still at the design stage, DD is using Solidworks, as is the chassis designer (useful for checking the two fit eachother). Once the design is pretty much finalised the idea is to make a full-scale pattern and take moulds from it.It's the process of going from numbers in a computer to physical reality which will be the tricky bit. There are various techniques for doing so, some involving 5-axis routers. I can't afford anything like that so am going to have to use more 'manual' techniques. I've had what I think is a good idea about how to do that, but it is still a big undertaking for one person, and I will have to finance it from my earnings working on other people's kit cars.
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