Lexus RX450HL & RX400H - going full barge
Discussion
I think compared to the current crop of large SUVs, it's looks are among the best. 
Only thing I don't like yet is the little shelf thing at the bottom of the rear screen. (I'll have to find a pic)
It's nice not seeing too many about either.
Bit of a shock that the RC is being discontinued
Only thing I don't like yet is the little shelf thing at the bottom of the rear screen. (I'll have to find a pic)
It's nice not seeing too many about either.
Bit of a shock that the RC is being discontinued
What a great thread.
Im 50 and am starting to look at these hybrids. Not sure if it's my age but the idea of good reliability, quietness, and value for me seems to really hit home to me :-) Been keeping any eye on Rx400h as they do hold their value. Loving the NX300h too although they are in the 20K range.
Comments about the CVT are quite common, same with Rav4 Hybrids too. Seems most hybrids use a CVT. Toyota's / Lexus battery check seems to be a wise move but I didnt know that modern code readers should have some form of check as I do own a code reader.
I need to replace my Mrs old Suzuki Vitara and am thinking RX400h. So, will be keeping an eye on this thread :-)
Simon
Im 50 and am starting to look at these hybrids. Not sure if it's my age but the idea of good reliability, quietness, and value for me seems to really hit home to me :-) Been keeping any eye on Rx400h as they do hold their value. Loving the NX300h too although they are in the 20K range.
Comments about the CVT are quite common, same with Rav4 Hybrids too. Seems most hybrids use a CVT. Toyota's / Lexus battery check seems to be a wise move but I didnt know that modern code readers should have some form of check as I do own a code reader.
I need to replace my Mrs old Suzuki Vitara and am thinking RX400h. So, will be keeping an eye on this thread :-)
Simon
sbk1972 said:
What a great thread.
Im 50 and am starting to look at these hybrids. Not sure if it's my age but the idea of good reliability, quietness, and value for me seems to really hit home to me :-) Been keeping any eye on Rx400h as they do hold their value. Loving the NX300h too although they are in the 20K range.
Comments about the CVT are quite common, same with Rav4 Hybrids too. Seems most hybrids use a CVT. Toyota's / Lexus battery check seems to be a wise move but I didnt know that modern code readers should have some form of check as I do own a code reader.
I need to replace my Mrs old Suzuki Vitara and am thinking RX400h. So, will be keeping an eye on this thread :-)
Simon
Not tried it but http://priusapp.com/ May help. Think I will look at that.Im 50 and am starting to look at these hybrids. Not sure if it's my age but the idea of good reliability, quietness, and value for me seems to really hit home to me :-) Been keeping any eye on Rx400h as they do hold their value. Loving the NX300h too although they are in the 20K range.
Comments about the CVT are quite common, same with Rav4 Hybrids too. Seems most hybrids use a CVT. Toyota's / Lexus battery check seems to be a wise move but I didnt know that modern code readers should have some form of check as I do own a code reader.
I need to replace my Mrs old Suzuki Vitara and am thinking RX400h. So, will be keeping an eye on this thread :-)
Simon
The CVT thing is really just a matter of getting used to something different. The strangest thing to get used to is the the very rare occasion when you are slowing down and it flips from regen braking to using the disks. It doesn't happen very often but you get a noticeable surge. You need to get the braking just right for it to happen. Otherwise you never notice weather the engine is on or off, or weather you are using regen braking or normal braking.
sbk1972 said:
What a great thread.
Im 50 and am starting to look at these hybrids. Not sure if it's my age but the idea of good reliability, quietness, and value for me seems to really hit home to me :-) Been keeping any eye on Rx400h as they do hold their value. Loving the NX300h too although they are in the 20K range.
Comments about the CVT are quite common, same with Rav4 Hybrids too. Seems most hybrids use a CVT. Toyota's / Lexus battery check seems to be a wise move but I didnt know that modern code readers should have some form of check as I do own a code reader.
I need to replace my Mrs old Suzuki Vitara and am thinking RX400h. So, will be keeping an eye on this thread :-)
Simon
Depending on your budget/location you can still buy an approved used Rx400h direct from Lexus - that might be the way to go if you want a little more piece of mind? Im 50 and am starting to look at these hybrids. Not sure if it's my age but the idea of good reliability, quietness, and value for me seems to really hit home to me :-) Been keeping any eye on Rx400h as they do hold their value. Loving the NX300h too although they are in the 20K range.
Comments about the CVT are quite common, same with Rav4 Hybrids too. Seems most hybrids use a CVT. Toyota's / Lexus battery check seems to be a wise move but I didnt know that modern code readers should have some form of check as I do own a code reader.
I need to replace my Mrs old Suzuki Vitara and am thinking RX400h. So, will be keeping an eye on this thread :-)
Simon
On a side note, I was convinced the 400 felt quicker than the 450... and I was right! Over half a second quicker on the 0-60 compared to the newer one. (A lightning 7.4sec vs a stately 8sec)
Hi BrettMRC, thanks very much for the post. I currently drive a previous gen lexus rx450h, which is almost flawless except the seat, and the engine being slightly underpowered. I have owned the car for a few years but could never get the seat to be adjusted perfectly. It is potentially due to the softness of the padding, or due to my slim build. . My second car is a BMW 3 series, which has a very basic seat but oddly I found the hard BMW seat more supportive around the lower back.
Can you please share some detailed comparison between the RX450HL and the 45e? Such as cabin refinement , tyre/wind noise level, any day to day things that are only noticeable after owning the car for a while. Strangely I am in the opposite direction, thinking about getting a 45e.
You comment about the seat is interesting, does you RX450 have 4way lumber support? I noticed the BMW has way more adjustments than the lexus.
Can you please share some detailed comparison between the RX450HL and the 45e? Such as cabin refinement , tyre/wind noise level, any day to day things that are only noticeable after owning the car for a while. Strangely I am in the opposite direction, thinking about getting a 45e.
You comment about the seat is interesting, does you RX450 have 4way lumber support? I noticed the BMW has way more adjustments than the lexus.
In terms of direct comparisons I'll do what I can.
Two things that are very pertinent: first being the price, the X5 45e that I had carried a list price of over £85k, some £20-25k more than an Rx450hl, and there is a generational difference in the in car entertainment/infotainment. The Rx I have is a mid 2019 version with the less than optimal system, later versions have a much nicer user interface and better connectivity to apps etc - the X5-45e is the benchmark here as far as any car I have driven is concerned.
In terms of size, the 45e is probably slightly taller and wider - it certainly feels much bigger to drive. (Footprint on the driveway is broadly the same) The Rx feels like it's narrower to drive - I've not compared the dimensions but doubt there is a lot in it!
Performance... this is a no contest, hands down win the 45e - in a straight line it will batter 99.9% of vehicles on the road. The Rx isn't slow, but it's appreciably slower than the 45e.
Economy... hard one this - if you make use of the charging and only do short runs then the 45e is leagues ahead, on longer journeys, or if you can't charge then the Rx is probably ahead here.
Comfort... I think the Rx wins, especially for driver comfort. (I had the comfort seats in the 45e and they were a huge mistake I think, you might fare better if you are of slighter build) I never got properly comfy on a long trip in the 45e, the Rx on the otherhand is just magnificently comfortable.
The in car entertainment and driver aids are leagues ahead in the BMW, (assuming you spec it accordingly) and things like the "hey BMW" feature were/are amazing and really nice to use. (Even daft stuff like asking it to change the colour of the interior lights etc...it just worked and worked well, really simple to make phone calls etc)
The display key/phone app are good too, especially for pre-heating or cooling the car. (Lexus have a phone app but the functionality is more limited)
Presence/how it makes you feel... neither car ever had an issue making progress in traffic, or getting let out of junctions etc. The Rx is night and day a better car to look at and sit inside; truthly both made me think "wow!" when I first got in them and drove them.
I don't think the 45e feels like it's worth so much more than the Lexus, but that probably says more about the Rx's build and quality at the price point than anything bad about the fit and finish on the BMW.
My real issue with the 45e is the lack of knowledge base within the BMW service system/centres... If I remember tomorrow I will pull off the write up I had to give to Lex about why I was rejecting the vehicle and you will see what I mean.
Overall it's really hard to choose between them, a facelifted Rx will have an entertainment system that is much more comparable to that of the 45e... so beyond straight line performance and PHEV economy they are a dead heat in my eyes.
My recommendation? If it's a company car get the 45e... if it's your own money get the Lexus.
Two things that are very pertinent: first being the price, the X5 45e that I had carried a list price of over £85k, some £20-25k more than an Rx450hl, and there is a generational difference in the in car entertainment/infotainment. The Rx I have is a mid 2019 version with the less than optimal system, later versions have a much nicer user interface and better connectivity to apps etc - the X5-45e is the benchmark here as far as any car I have driven is concerned.
In terms of size, the 45e is probably slightly taller and wider - it certainly feels much bigger to drive. (Footprint on the driveway is broadly the same) The Rx feels like it's narrower to drive - I've not compared the dimensions but doubt there is a lot in it!
Performance... this is a no contest, hands down win the 45e - in a straight line it will batter 99.9% of vehicles on the road. The Rx isn't slow, but it's appreciably slower than the 45e.
Economy... hard one this - if you make use of the charging and only do short runs then the 45e is leagues ahead, on longer journeys, or if you can't charge then the Rx is probably ahead here.
Comfort... I think the Rx wins, especially for driver comfort. (I had the comfort seats in the 45e and they were a huge mistake I think, you might fare better if you are of slighter build) I never got properly comfy on a long trip in the 45e, the Rx on the otherhand is just magnificently comfortable.
The in car entertainment and driver aids are leagues ahead in the BMW, (assuming you spec it accordingly) and things like the "hey BMW" feature were/are amazing and really nice to use. (Even daft stuff like asking it to change the colour of the interior lights etc...it just worked and worked well, really simple to make phone calls etc)
The display key/phone app are good too, especially for pre-heating or cooling the car. (Lexus have a phone app but the functionality is more limited)
Presence/how it makes you feel... neither car ever had an issue making progress in traffic, or getting let out of junctions etc. The Rx is night and day a better car to look at and sit inside; truthly both made me think "wow!" when I first got in them and drove them.
I don't think the 45e feels like it's worth so much more than the Lexus, but that probably says more about the Rx's build and quality at the price point than anything bad about the fit and finish on the BMW.
My real issue with the 45e is the lack of knowledge base within the BMW service system/centres... If I remember tomorrow I will pull off the write up I had to give to Lex about why I was rejecting the vehicle and you will see what I mean.
Overall it's really hard to choose between them, a facelifted Rx will have an entertainment system that is much more comparable to that of the 45e... so beyond straight line performance and PHEV economy they are a dead heat in my eyes.
My recommendation? If it's a company car get the 45e... if it's your own money get the Lexus.
When I was in a Lexus dealership recently chatting to the sales person, I mentioned that the 45e seemed to have issues with the software (based on the reviews on this thread). He told me that it was a result of their co-opting with Toyota to use their battery tech and the pairing of the two proprietary systems (BMW ICE and Toyota hybrid tech) was a generation behind Lexus. It was an intriguing insight... but was he tickling my undercarriage? Metaphorically speaking.
Great response. Thanks very much.
How about the tyre and wind noise? Which car do you think is quieter at town and motorway speed?
Perhaps the seat in the latest RX is better. I will drop by the lexus dealer to have look.
What keeps me in the lexus brand is the build quality. The leather in my 7 years old car looks better quality than these in a brand new GLE I looked at this weekend, which is really disappointing. I also went to see a X5 with merino leather, which is much closer to the lexus quality. One area the BMW is much better is the cabin design. it looks much more stylish and modern compared to the lexus. Can you elaborate on why you prefer the interior of the RX?
How about the tyre and wind noise? Which car do you think is quieter at town and motorway speed?
Perhaps the seat in the latest RX is better. I will drop by the lexus dealer to have look.
What keeps me in the lexus brand is the build quality. The leather in my 7 years old car looks better quality than these in a brand new GLE I looked at this weekend, which is really disappointing. I also went to see a X5 with merino leather, which is much closer to the lexus quality. One area the BMW is much better is the cabin design. it looks much more stylish and modern compared to the lexus. Can you elaborate on why you prefer the interior of the RX?
BrettMRC said:
In terms of direct comparisons I'll do what I can.
Two things that are very pertinent: first being the price, the X5 45e that I had carried a list price of over £85k, some £20-25k more than an Rx450hl, and there is a generational difference in the in car entertainment/infotainment. The Rx I have is a mid 2019 version with the less than optimal system, later versions have a much nicer user interface and better connectivity to apps etc - the X5-45e is the benchmark here as far as any car I have driven is concerned.
In terms of size, the 45e is probably slightly taller and wider - it certainly feels much bigger to drive. (Footprint on the driveway is broadly the same) The Rx feels like it's narrower to drive - I've not compared the dimensions but doubt there is a lot in it!
Performance... this is a no contest, hands down win the 45e - in a straight line it will batter 99.9% of vehicles on the road. The Rx isn't slow, but it's appreciably slower than the 45e.
Economy... hard one this - if you make use of the charging and only do short runs then the 45e is leagues ahead, on longer journeys, or if you can't charge then the Rx is probably ahead here.
Comfort... I think the Rx wins, especially for driver comfort. (I had the comfort seats in the 45e and they were a huge mistake I think, you might fare better if you are of slighter build) I never got properly comfy on a long trip in the 45e, the Rx on the otherhand is just magnificently comfortable.
The in car entertainment and driver aids are leagues ahead in the BMW, (assuming you spec it accordingly) and things like the "hey BMW" feature were/are amazing and really nice to use. (Even daft stuff like asking it to change the colour of the interior lights etc...it just worked and worked well, really simple to make phone calls etc)
The display key/phone app are good too, especially for pre-heating or cooling the car. (Lexus have a phone app but the functionality is more limited)
Presence/how it makes you feel... neither car ever had an issue making progress in traffic, or getting let out of junctions etc. The Rx is night and day a better car to look at and sit inside; truthly both made me think "wow!" when I first got in them and drove them.
I don't think the 45e feels like it's worth so much more than the Lexus, but that probably says more about the Rx's build and quality at the price point than anything bad about the fit and finish on the BMW.
My real issue with the 45e is the lack of knowledge base within the BMW service system/centres... If I remember tomorrow I will pull off the write up I had to give to Lex about why I was rejecting the vehicle and you will see what I mean.
Overall it's really hard to choose between them, a facelifted Rx will have an entertainment system that is much more comparable to that of the 45e... so beyond straight line performance and PHEV economy they are a dead heat in my eyes.
My recommendation? If it's a company car get the 45e... if it's your own money get the Lexus.
Two things that are very pertinent: first being the price, the X5 45e that I had carried a list price of over £85k, some £20-25k more than an Rx450hl, and there is a generational difference in the in car entertainment/infotainment. The Rx I have is a mid 2019 version with the less than optimal system, later versions have a much nicer user interface and better connectivity to apps etc - the X5-45e is the benchmark here as far as any car I have driven is concerned.
In terms of size, the 45e is probably slightly taller and wider - it certainly feels much bigger to drive. (Footprint on the driveway is broadly the same) The Rx feels like it's narrower to drive - I've not compared the dimensions but doubt there is a lot in it!
Performance... this is a no contest, hands down win the 45e - in a straight line it will batter 99.9% of vehicles on the road. The Rx isn't slow, but it's appreciably slower than the 45e.
Economy... hard one this - if you make use of the charging and only do short runs then the 45e is leagues ahead, on longer journeys, or if you can't charge then the Rx is probably ahead here.
Comfort... I think the Rx wins, especially for driver comfort. (I had the comfort seats in the 45e and they were a huge mistake I think, you might fare better if you are of slighter build) I never got properly comfy on a long trip in the 45e, the Rx on the otherhand is just magnificently comfortable.
The in car entertainment and driver aids are leagues ahead in the BMW, (assuming you spec it accordingly) and things like the "hey BMW" feature were/are amazing and really nice to use. (Even daft stuff like asking it to change the colour of the interior lights etc...it just worked and worked well, really simple to make phone calls etc)
The display key/phone app are good too, especially for pre-heating or cooling the car. (Lexus have a phone app but the functionality is more limited)
Presence/how it makes you feel... neither car ever had an issue making progress in traffic, or getting let out of junctions etc. The Rx is night and day a better car to look at and sit inside; truthly both made me think "wow!" when I first got in them and drove them.
I don't think the 45e feels like it's worth so much more than the Lexus, but that probably says more about the Rx's build and quality at the price point than anything bad about the fit and finish on the BMW.
My real issue with the 45e is the lack of knowledge base within the BMW service system/centres... If I remember tomorrow I will pull off the write up I had to give to Lex about why I was rejecting the vehicle and you will see what I mean.
Overall it's really hard to choose between them, a facelifted Rx will have an entertainment system that is much more comparable to that of the 45e... so beyond straight line performance and PHEV economy they are a dead heat in my eyes.
My recommendation? If it's a company car get the 45e... if it's your own money get the Lexus.
Tyre and wind noise is minimal in both, although I made a point of having the 45e with smallest wheels/fattest tyres...
Re: what lexus said about technology integration....sounds like BS, or the salesman has misunderstood what he was told at some stage. (Lexus/Toyota tech is the same, methodology used in the 45e is similar in some respects and vastly different in others)
I would definitely recommend trying the seats again.
Re: what lexus said about technology integration....sounds like BS, or the salesman has misunderstood what he was told at some stage. (Lexus/Toyota tech is the same, methodology used in the 45e is similar in some respects and vastly different in others)
I would definitely recommend trying the seats again.
I'm thinking of selling my car while the used prices are strong and getting something half the price to use as the family workhorse.
I've had sports cars, coupes, 4WDs and estates, but I've never had a wafty barge before and quite fancy one. Probably because I'm now in my 40s. I started thinking of old RX400Hs and now I can't get the idea out of my head
I've had an Autotrader alert running for a few weeks but they don't come up very often so I may miss the moment, but I'm really tempted.
If I went to look at one, is it possible to check the battery condition? Is there a display on the dash somewhere or does it have to be properly inspected? It does seem they usually last the life of the car so I'm less concerned than I originally was.
I've had sports cars, coupes, 4WDs and estates, but I've never had a wafty barge before and quite fancy one. Probably because I'm now in my 40s. I started thinking of old RX400Hs and now I can't get the idea out of my head
I've had an Autotrader alert running for a few weeks but they don't come up very often so I may miss the moment, but I'm really tempted.
If I went to look at one, is it possible to check the battery condition? Is there a display on the dash somewhere or does it have to be properly inspected? It does seem they usually last the life of the car so I'm less concerned than I originally was.
Different versions of the '400h have varying displays - none of them will give you a % indicator of battery capacity per-se, but it is easier to view the status in the cars with the sat nav unit. (SE-L and above I think).
The cars without this will show a smaller batter display inside the drivers display.
The display in both cases shows a block representing the battery which under normal conditions will never/rarely show 100% full, it should show around 80% full under most conditions and discharges when in EV mode. (It remains below 100% to allow capacity for regenerative braking, when the battery is full you will feel a change in the brake pedal as it moves from EV to friction)
The battery can show 100% under some driving conditions, such as prolonged high speed where the engine is charging as well as providing drive.
A code reader that's capable of reading cell status will show individual cells, an indicator of a problem is a cell(s) with lower voltage than it's peers.
The cars without this will show a smaller batter display inside the drivers display.
The display in both cases shows a block representing the battery which under normal conditions will never/rarely show 100% full, it should show around 80% full under most conditions and discharges when in EV mode. (It remains below 100% to allow capacity for regenerative braking, when the battery is full you will feel a change in the brake pedal as it moves from EV to friction)
The battery can show 100% under some driving conditions, such as prolonged high speed where the engine is charging as well as providing drive.
A code reader that's capable of reading cell status will show individual cells, an indicator of a problem is a cell(s) with lower voltage than it's peers.
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