New BMW's getting stolen using blank BMW keys

[clockworks]

I collected my 525d E61 on Saturday - secondhand from the "trade-in outlet" of the local BMW dealership. The sales staff there denied all knowledge of this problem.
I called in at a car audio/security installers, and they hadn't heard about it either. He phoned one of their suppliers, who were aware of the problem. He spoke to their tech rep for advice.
I've decided to do what the tech rep did to his own car - fit a "plip upgrade" alarm with a "passive" driver ID card and ultrasonics.

As long as I've got the ID card about my person, there's no difference in operation - standard radio key unlocks the car and turns off both alarms. The ID card disables the secondary immobiliser.

Secondary ultrasonics should sort out the blind spot problem. Even with a cloned key, the secondary immobiliser will stop the car being driven away.

[eastsider]

GuyWMD said:

I had exactly the same experience a few weeks ago whilst in my local dealer near the office. BMW UK are aware of it, but from the sounds of it haven't even passed anything down the network.

Exactly the opposite, its a systematic denial, designed, communicated (and I imagine if it came to it enforced) from the top - BMW UK.

[eastsider]

andyroo said:

Well, I'm gutted to be posting this, but my ex's (and mine I suppose, I let her have it when we split up) BMW 650i was taken from outside her house last night. I went over yesterday to help her with a viewing on it where a couple in their late twenties/early thirties came to view it. They asked all the right questions, showed the right interest, agreed a price and penciled in Thursday to come back and do a faster payment bank transfer. The car was still there at midnight, I went back home, had a call at 9:30 this morning from my ex to say the car had gone.

This is (was) it: http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/3844608.htm

Whilst trying to figure out how they did it, I came across this thread. Bit disappointed that BMW didn't give us any kind of warning about this, particularly as it has recently been in for quite an expensive service and new tyres.

Bah.

Sorry to hear this. Do you think the ad alerted potential thieves to location of the car at all? Any funny calls asking where car is etc?

In large cities I think they just drive around and see what is parked on the streets in regular places, but rural that would take an impractical amount of time.

[angrybird]

I called BMW customer service to ask what they were doing about the increased rate of BMW thefts as clearly the thieves had found a way in.they are definitely aware of the problem as the woman read out an email about how BMW complies with Uk regulation as it was not only BMW's been stolen and owners should naturally take extra precautions against thieves. Not something you think about when buying an X5, especially when they sell it as been so secure!

[youngsyr]

Billyray911 said:

youngsyr said:

Can anyone recommend where to get an "OBD Port Disabled" sticker from - I'd ideally like one printed on a clear backing that can be fixed to the inside of the window facing outwards.

Page 77 may be of use.

Thanks, saw that, but I don't have the ability to print myself and the ones on ebay no longer seem to be listed?

[HurryUpAndWait]

youngsyr said:

Thanks, saw that, but I don't have the ability to print myself and the ones on ebay no longer seem to be listed?

You have PM.

[eastsider]

angrybird said:

the woman read out an email about how BMW complies with Uk regulation as it was not only BMW's been stolen and owners should naturally take extra precautions against thieves.

Exactly proves my point that the denial messaging flows from the top. I work in corporate comms so I know what I'm talking about. Denial is the modern business way, at least for the moment.

BMW's statement about complying with all regulation etc is documented several times on this thread. Doesn't matter one jot what regulation your car complied with if its just been taken (in a matter of minutes) by thieves many steps ahead anything anyone has bothered to regulate!

[Brummmie]

A friend of mine is a salesman at a BMW main agent, they do know.

[sinizter]

eastsider said:

Exactly proves my point that the denial messaging flows from the top. I work in corporate comms so I know what I'm talking about. Denial is the modern business way, at least for the moment.

BMW's statement about complying with all regulation etc is documented several times on this thread. Doesn't matter one jot what regulation your car complied with if its just been taken (in a matter of minutes) by thieves many steps ahead anything anyone has bothered to regulate!

They are never going to admit knowing how big an issue this is - because it will cost them millions and if software updates take as long as hours, the dealer network won't be able to do anything but this ...

So, unless legally forced to, nothing is going to happen.

[BE57 TOY]

clockworks said:

I collected my 525d E61 on Saturday - secondhand from the "trade-in outlet" of the local BMW dealership. The sales staff there denied all knowledge of this problem.
I called in at a car audio/security installers, and they hadn't heard about it either. He phoned one of their suppliers, who were aware of the problem. He spoke to their tech rep for advice.
I've decided to do what the tech rep did to his own car - fit a "plip upgrade" alarm with a "passive" driver ID card and ultrasonics.

As long as I've got the ID card about my person, there's no difference in operation - standard radio key unlocks the car and turns off both alarms. The ID card disables the secondary immobiliser.

Secondary ultrasonics should sort out the blind spot problem. Even with a cloned key, the secondary immobiliser will stop the car being driven away.

How much was that? And who fitted it?

[clockworks]

It's being fitted tomorrow by Flying Sparks. Cobra G368. I think that you can get the alarm for about £100. Costs more that that for fitting.

[mrmr96]

clockworks said:

I collected my 525d E61 on Saturday - secondhand from the "trade-in outlet" of the local BMW dealership. The sales staff there denied all knowledge of this problem.
I called in at a car audio/security installers, and they hadn't heard about it either. He phoned one of their suppliers, who were aware of the problem. He spoke to their tech rep for advice.
I've decided to do what the tech rep did to his own car - fit a "plip upgrade" alarm with a "passive" driver ID card and ultrasonics.

As long as I've got the ID card about my person, there's no difference in operation - standard radio key unlocks the car and turns off both alarms. The ID card disables the secondary immobiliser.

Secondary ultrasonics should sort out the blind spot problem. Even with a cloned key, the secondary immobiliser will stop the car being driven away.

Agreed.

On 6th August mrmr96 said:

RUSTLE said:

Other than a diskolok and the stickers, any other ideas out there?

You can get immobilisers which disarm using a proximity key fob. So once you unlock the car with your normal key and climb in then the mere presence of the new aftermarket key fob will disarm the new aftermarket immobiliser. I've seen these for about £200-300 installed. Can't find the link at the min though. Seems like a good system which will prevent these "Gone in 60 secs" thefts with the key programmer, since the thief won't have the aftermarket fob for the immobiliser.

[JimmyTheHand]

eastsider said:

Sorry to hear this. Do you think the ad alerted potential thieves to location of the car at all?

not saying it was this, but with a couple looking at car what is the chance of one them being able to slip something into ODB port while other is looking under bonnet? Then mates come around later.

[andyroo]

JimmyTheHand said:

eastsider said:

Sorry to hear this. Do you think the ad alerted potential thieves to location of the car at all?

not saying it was this, but with a couple looking at car what is the chance of one them being able to slip something into ODB port while other is looking under bonnet? Then mates come around later.

Looking back, I think it was exactly this. Had I been aware of this OBD issue, I would have taken precautions, but I had no idea. When they arrived, the car was parked facing away from house, and the guy asked if i could pop the bonnet. He then sat in the car poking buttons and whatnot with me standing to the side, and then his partner asked me to show her how to open the boot. I opened it, but stayed at the rear quarter in view of the drivers seat.

After I took the guy for a test drive, I parked the car nose towards the house. He asked me to pop the bonnet again, and the sat in the drivers seat to poke buttons again. His partner started talking from in front of the car, so I walked over to talk to her, putting the bonnet between myself and the guy. This would have been an opportune moment.

The sneaky thing is that he then sent a text the following evening saying he'd seen another car and he was no longer interested. Assuming that someone else actually took my car in the night, it means there is no way of pinpointing any crime to any person at any stage. The car is likely in pieces by now, with no hope of tracking the criminals involved. Even if we did come across the couple that came to look at the car, there is literally nothing that they can proven guilty of.

It seems that they can just trawl through the classifieds and pick out the exact cars they want. It's completely unsuspecting and it leaves BMW owners in a very awkward position for a private sale, because even if they disable the OBD, they could still well be letting criminals into their houses to discuss bank transfers and HPIs. It's virtually risk-free for the criminals involved.

[JimmyTheHand]

andyroo said:

The sneaky thing is that he then sent a text the following evening saying he'd seen another car and he was no longer interested. Assuming that someone else actually took my car in the night, it means there is no way of pinpointing any crime to any person at any stage.

I trust you have passed onto Police - they may not be able to do much, but if they are aware of the details maybe they'll be able to build a pattern if others suffer similarly

[andyroo]

JimmyTheHand said:

I trust you have passed onto Police - they may not be able to do much, but if they are aware of the details maybe they'll be able to build a pattern if others suffer similarly

Reported it sunday morning, police are coming over to take a statement on Tuesday evening

[S Works]

eastsider said:

GuyWMD said:

I had exactly the same experience a few weeks ago whilst in my local dealer near the office. BMW UK are aware of it, but from the sounds of it haven't even passed anything down the network.

Exactly the opposite, its a systematic denial, designed, communicated (and I imagine if it came to it enforced) from the top - BMW UK.

Well someone is aware of it. I know that some staff have been warned to keep away from posting on this thread, for instance.

[MadAdMan]

angrybird said:

My x5 3.5 black sport was stolen off our drive in the early hours of Tuesday in west london, no forced entry and no one heard anything. Our street is well lit and fairly active as its a through way. We even have CCTV on our drive but frustratingly our home automation system had crashed and we didn't know our CCTV wasn't working. However, it certainly didn't deter these thieves. We've heard nothing from the police since getting our crime reference number. What I find most shocking of all is we went about our lives quite happily, thinking our car was fairly safe, taking precautions of parking it on the drive with camera etc and all along the police, BMW and insurance companies know about this problem of been able to steal a BMW in a minute and not doing ANYTHING to make the average consumer aware of this. Ive only started searching to understand how it was possible to steal the car and come across so many threads and forums on this subject. byway are BMW, police,councils or insurance companies not informing people of this. It would have been so easy to fit a tracker had I known that it was easy to hack into a BMW, disgusting customer service! All the taxes and premiums we pay and for nothing.

ditto, X5 black sport, parked on drive under street light @ 3:15am! (i was lucky and heard something so interrupted them, but they had already removed all the idrive/screen/hd and obd opened) if BMW had forewarned us we could have been better prepared. Subject to the sales of goods laws - it appears BMW have sold us something that is not fit for purpose. A car alarm that has multiple design flaws in blind spot due to cost cutting for uk (left hand drive models) and as such 'technically' BMW should cover the cost of alarm upgrading (at min) full recall (at max)

[MadAdMan]

youngsyr said:

Can anyone recommend where to get an "OBD Port Disabled" sticker from - I'd ideally like one printed on a clear backing that can be fixed to the inside of the window facing outwards.

just had mine back from the printers, these were the designs - email me and ill send you the PDF

[MadAdMan]

roofer said:

Its key copying, and they need to access the original as far as i am aware to copy it.

unfortunately not only way to counter act is to fit a secondary alarm and upgrade the sensors( to negate blind spot) , disable or move the OBD port and stick a disclock on. Park you P&J in an alarmed garage. If you want to use a tracker there a few choices (dont buy tracker though) remember you'll need VHF + GPS at minimum as they can be easily located and jammed. CCTV's do not do anything*, they are just masking up and still stealing (*this is from the met and private security firm)