Brake bleeding - Am i a sell out?

[spend]

Don't assume your master cylinder is fine, cleaning out the crap sometimes seems to push them over the edge..

Have you bled all 4 in sequence and carefully checked everywhere for leaks..

[Krautchimaera]

I would also assume you have a problem with your master cylinder. Bleeding the brakes by pumping the pedal often calls for problems. If the car hasn't had regular changes of the b/f in its past, very often the moisture in the fluid will lead to rusting in the master cylinder after the end of its usual travel. When bleeding the brakes, the piston and seal will be pushed further than usually with the seal getting scraped by the rust in the bore.
If you are lucky you can recover the master cylinder by honing and fitting new seals, or you need a new one.
Best to bleed brakes with easybleed or similar system where you do not use the brake pedal.

my 5 pennies worth.

Bernd

[Simon Says]

Certainly agree with the last 2 posts,its worse case scenario but it happens very hard sometimes to give the ideal advice on this kind of thing without being with the car,bit like a Doctor without the patient

[Bassfiend]

Did you get anywhere with this last week Lewis? You were going to have them bled by the local garage on Thursday I think?

Phil

[lewis s]

Did'nt manage to get down to the garage in the end due to the weather, but i managed to get down to the local halfords and pick up an eezi-bleed kit and had another go today. I only tried bleeding the front two calipers today due to time constraints and unfortunately made no difference.

Hopefully once the snow (and my hands) defrost i will have one more go and if not i will have a look at the master cylinder to see if thats my problem

Very frustrating

[Bassfiend]

Krautchimaera said:

I would also assume you have a problem with your master cylinder. Bleeding the brakes by pumping the pedal often calls for problems. If the car hasn't had regular changes of the b/f in its past, very often the moisture in the fluid will lead to rusting in the master cylinder after the end of its usual travel. When bleeding the brakes, the piston and seal will be pushed further than usually with the seal getting scraped by the rust in the bore.
If you are lucky you can recover the master cylinder by honing and fitting new seals, or you need a new one.
Best to bleed brakes with easybleed or similar system where you do not use the brake pedal.

my 5 pennies worth.

Bernd

Have to say that my "change" was done using an eezibleed and not by pumping the pedal (wasn't possible to do it that way as I was working alone and TBH that method is a pain in the backside) - I'm pretty sure that the fluid reservoir wasn't allowed to get low during bleeding either ...



Phil

[lewis s]

SUCCESS!

Managed to work on the car today and locate the master cylinder bleed nipple. Bled the master cylinder (what a pain!) and now all is well and the pedal feels firm and controllable with plenty of stopping power. Now i just need to get out driving and bed in the pads.

I took some photos of the bleed nipple to help any of you to locate it if you have any trouble. Its a right pig to get to.





And all masked up and re-sealed

Edited by lewis s on Thursday 14th January 22:21

[scotty_d]

Glad your all sorted Lewis and handy to know where that nipple is too now.

[Bassfiend]

Right - that's another job to add to the list for this weekend. Thanks for the photos too ... never had problems finding nipples before but that one I'd not have thought of.

So the list for this weekend is...

1) Drain coolant, remove coolant hoses and radiator.
2) Clean up and repaint bottom metal coolant pipe.
3) Flush block.
4) Remove and replace thermostat and gasket.
5) Fit old fan brackets and fans to new radiator.
6) Replace radiator with gorgeous new ally one (still no idea whether it fits of course).
7) Replace coolant hoses with nice blue silicone hoses.
8) Refill with new antifreeze.
9) Replace regulator pack on alternator (hopefully the "new" one will fit).
10) Replace battery (won't start car after two days in the current weather).
11) Grope around for nipple and bleed master cylinder.

Jesus! :O

Phil

Edited by Bassfiend on Friday 15th January 06:47

[roysum]

roysum said:

I had exactly the same problem.......(mechanical stop too)
Finished up at Neil Garner's who bled the master cylinder for me, there's a bleed nipple accessible via the clutch reservoir opening, bloody tight though. All sorted. Obviously I let the fluid get too low when bleeding.
Have since replaced the rear calipers using the Gunson eazi bleed, no problem, well worth the money.

Roy

Ah, well done Lewis !

[Bassfiend]

OK - What on earth did you use to get to that nipple to undo it? I can't get an 11mm normal socket on it, my 11mm deep socket fits but is then too "deep" to get a wobble bar onto it and out through the hole. Only thing we've been able to come up with here is to go get a 1/4" flexible extension in the morning and hope that gives us enough bend to get out of the hole.

Phil

[lewis s]

I did'nt say it was easy

I used one of these:

http://www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/...

with a screwdriver through the other end to get enough leverage to crack it open, but then there is still not enough room to turn the nipple

I then got the see through plastic tubing from the bleed kit and heated the end in a glass of hot water to soften, and managed to squeeze it over the nipple (i could'nt get it on while it was cold)

After it had cooled over the nipple. I had to twist the tube to open and close the nipple during the bleeding process. After it was bled i used the ratchet spanner to nip it up again.

Bit of a faff i know but it worked for me

[Bassfiend]

Thanks for the clarification on how you did it - sounds like an excuse to buy more tools.

Phil

[lewis s]

They are bloddy handy to have

Also if at all possible try and blag a Halfords trade card, tools, batteries and fluids are now over 50% off

[scotty_d]

Bassfiend said:

5) Fit old fan brackets and fans to new radiator.
6) Replace radiator with gorgeous new ally one (still no idea whether it fits of course).

I hope it does as mine is a copy of your spec and should be with me next week.

[Bassfiend]

lewis s said:

They are bloddy handy to have

I went and got myself that set of ratchet spanners but still couldn't get enough movement to get the nipple undone - latest "plan" is to pop the deep socket on the nipple and drill a 5mm or so diameter hole in the wing above it to feed the wobble bar through then grommet and seal it afterwards...

lewis s said:

Also if at all possible try and blag a Halfords trade card, tools, batteries and fluids are now over 50% off

My mate managed to get a duplicate trade card on his account for me - I know they don't normally issue extra cards but it seems he swung it somehow.

Got about £12 off that £80 set of ratchet spanners on Sunday, £25 off a £94 battery on Saturday, £5 off an Eezibleed (that was about 25%) - not huge savings but useful just the same.

Phil

[Pink_Floyd]

I can sse the bleed nipple and can get a 11mm 3/8th drive socket on it but it won't turn. Don't want to apply to much pressures as I don't want to break anything. The system was empty so I am filling it up. Fronts are fine all bled and working, but the rears, although clear fluid is coming out, applying the brakes does not stop the rear wheels turning. So I assume that it is air in that part of the master cylinder, Any other way to remove that air??.

[Ximinez]

Hello,

I recently had my fair share of grovelling in the footwell in order to replace the brake master and servo. After finishing the job and bleeding the system, the top end of the pedal still felt spongy as others reported in this thread. Since I did not want to spill any brake fluid on the cleaned carpets I applied a different approach to bleeding the master cilinder. I used the assistance of the brake servo to apply more pressure on the system so the piston for the rear section in the master cilinder would travel further and hopefully pushed out the trapped air. After 5 rounds of pushing and holding the pedal, the trapped air escaped out of the rear calliper. So for anyone dealing with the same situation, try this approach first before fiddling with bleed valve on the brake master cilinder and spilling brake fluid.

Brgds,
Eduard

[Sardonicus]

Ximinez said:

Hello,

I recently had my fair share of grovelling in the footwell in order to replace the brake master and servo. After finishing the job and bleeding the system, the top end of the pedal still felt spongy as others reported in this thread. Since I did not want to spill any brake fluid on the cleaned carpets I applied a different approach to bleeding the master cilinder. I used the assistance of the brake servo to apply more pressure on the system so the piston for the rear section in the master cilinder would travel further and hopefully pushed out the trapped air. After 5 rounds of pushing and holding the pedal, the trapped air escaped out of the rear calliper. So for anyone dealing with the same situation, try this approach first before fiddling with bleed valve on the brake master cilinder and spilling brake fluid.

Brgds,
Eduard

Servo assistance will not allow any more travel to the pistons in the MC you got a good pedal through fluke or perseverance

[phazed]

Also, the bleed nipple on the master cylinder is there for a reason!

2 minutes to bleed this and job done, (unless you shear it off )