Checking outriggers/chassis

[ewan221]

As I understand the chassis and outriggers can appear perfectly sound underneath but may be like Swiss cheese on top. Is there any way of checking this out without s body lift ?

[philh]

You can get small cameras like doctors use to look down your throat.

[phillpot]

Unless there are reciepts for work done or photographs just assume there is rot !

[EggsBenedict]

Yes there is. You need to jack the car up (usually you do this at the front, just behind the front wheel. Shove an axle stand under one of the main rails of the chassis if you're worried about safety. Get a sharp screwdriver and a soft mallet together. Take the screwdriver and jab it into the outrigger by aiming to come into the outrigger from the top. You won't be able to, of course, but you should get enough of an angle on it to be able to come down toward the floor through the outrigger. Do this anywhere there's a joint. The main areas are just behind the front wheel, either side of the tube that runs in the middle of the car to the main chassis, and then at the rear, just in front of the rear wheel. Get in on top of/behind the plates that mount the outrigger to the car. On mine, doing this check resulted in the screwdriver going clean through the chassis outrigger. I wish I'd known how to check this properly before I bought it - I'd banged the outriggers with a hammer and a big screwdriver, but from the bottom only. It costs just over two grand to get this sorted out.

[phillpot]

EggsBenedict said:

Shove an axle stand under one of the main rails of the chassis if you're worried about safety.

yeah, or rotten outriggers might literally be the last thing you worry about !!!!!

Not sure how many prospective sellers will take too kindly to you attacking their p&j with a hammer and screwdriver

[ewan221]

So basically you would be advised to look for one that has already had chassis/outrigger work done rather than one thats original and well looked after ?

[EggsBenedict]

phillpot said:

yeah, or rotten outriggers might literally be the last thing you worry about !!!!!

Not sure how many prospective sellers will take too kindly to you attacking their p&j with a hammer and screwdriver

well, you either check, or you assume they've something to hide, right? Right now, if I were to try to sell my car, I'd obviously just show the receipt for the work that's recently been done. But similarly, if I was selling and I hadn't had this work, I would do the check myself. At that point, if I found rot, I guess I have the choice between getting it done / knocking the cost of the work off the price / keeping shtum and then not letting someone do the same check...

[SILICONE KID]

Hello Im very interested in your car,do you mind if i bring a lump hammer,bolster chisel and angle grinder? he will tell you to FK OFF.!
You could try these .
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/X-Ray-Specs-Classic-Novelty-...

Edited by SILICONE KID on Thursday 10th March 21:00

[EggsBenedict]

SILICONE KID said:

Hello Im very interested in your car,do you mind if i bring a lump hammer,bolster chisel and angle grinder? he will tell you to FK OFF.!

what an odd reply. I suggested a sharp screwdriver and a soft mallet. TBH, if you don't do this check, be prepared for this:



these are my outriggers on the floor on Dan Taylor's workshop. When I was looking for mine, I did say to the vendors that I would be jacking the car up and checking the chassis - nobody batted an eyelid whose car I saw.

[ralphy12345]

philh said:

You can get small cameras like doctors use to look down your throat.

Or via other orifices......endoscope in action:


Visual checking is not enough, you need to get to the top of the outriggers. View as seen by MOT inspector (he gave the car a pass):



and how it actually was:


R

[quattrophenia]

EggsBenedict said:

Yes there is. You need to jack the car up (usually you do this at the front, just behind the front wheel. Shove an axle stand under one of the main rails of the chassis if you're worried about safety. Get a sharp screwdriver and a soft mallet together. Take the screwdriver and jab it into the outrigger by aiming to come into the outrigger from the top. You won't be able to, of course, but you should get enough of an angle on it to be able to come down toward the floor through the outrigger. Do this anywhere there's a joint. The main areas are just behind the front wheel, either side of the tube that runs in the middle of the car to the main chassis, and then at the rear, just in front of the rear wheel. Get in on top of/behind the plates that mount the outrigger to the car. On mine, doing this check resulted in the screwdriver going clean through the chassis outrigger. I wish I'd known how to check this properly before I bought it - I'd banged the outriggers with a hammer and a big screwdriver, but from the bottom only. It costs just over two grand to get this sorted out.

I take it your from the old skool of H&S! I like your style.
Maybe the O/P could take a hack saw along to his next perspective purchase and cut a little piece of the floor pan out so he can check the rails definitively

[Naybr]

If the car has been regularly used and isn't in pristine condition (and by that I mean that the visible bits of the chassis aren't perfect) then you should assume that there is rot. These cars are over ten years old now and they are all going to rot out sooner or later.

If there is, then it's not the end of the world. Just budget £1700 or so when you are negotiating the price, and then get it done. All else being equal, you will still end up with a great car!

[quattrophenia]

I think the uncertainty is the main issue with chassis condition. If you buy a car knowing it needs work you are almost in a better position than thinking it's going to be ok for the next few years, only to be suprised when it fails it's MOT and needs £££s spending.
I would agree that if the chassis shows little sign of preventative maintenance and there is visible rust underneath, then it is likely that the tops are worse. I would also be aware of very fresh waxoil that has simply been used to mask a more serious problem. It is a bit of a tightrope walk I'm afraid. Also maybe note the condition of the wishbones/shocks as a very rough indication of the overall condition of the car.

[BliarOut]

Tap them from underneath with a half pound hammer, a solid outrigger should ring (kinda) whereas a rotten one will make a dull crunchy thud sort of noise...

[biper]

I think that bidding someone in the bks by £1700 to have work done is somewhat unreasonable.
You are looking at a car that is 10+ years old and expecting it to be perfect or as near is.
I would be happy to negotiate half that price, if a problem was found, as you are the one who is going to benifit. Otherwise I would be asking a more realistic price had the work already been carried out.
Where do you call the line. Look through the history and notice it hasn't had a new clutch....That's going to need replacing at some point, so bid him £850 less.
Also the hood hasn't been replaced, there's another £850 because the stitching has more than likely perished.
If you have reservations about the car just walk away.

Edited by biper on Friday 11th March 10:15

[Naybr]

I did say "budget" not "bid". Not quite the same thing. Just have in your mind that you are probably going to have to spend this money in the fairly near future. If, with this in mind, the deal still makes sense, then go ahead...

[biper]

Fair enough, but you get the gist of what I am saying.
That said if there are say 5000 Chimaeras still on the road or those for sale, what percentage of those do you think have had NEW outriggers.
I am not trying to be argumentative, I just think we have to put things into prospective.

[ralphy12345]

'm in agreement that buyers should budget on work that needs doing being added to the purchase cost: no point in ending up buying a car and then not having the monies to do necessary work.

As more and more outriggers are replaced there will come a time in the future that non-repaired cars will be in the minority - and will have to be priced accordingly if the owners really want to sell.

R

[TJC46]

ewan221 said:

So basically you would be advised to look for one that has already had chassis/outrigger work done rather than one thats original and well looked after ?

In my opinion this is the best route to go. As well as the new outriggers, lots of other work will probably have been done as well. Take it from someone who has been there, done that, etc. There are some chims out there with as near perfect chassis as you could want, BUT THESE ARE FEW AND FAR BETWEEN. Mine wasnt the horror story with chassis rails falling apart,but i had decided before purchasing any chim, that i would lift the body off and strip the chassis. I didnt fancy taking the chance of a possible rotten chassis beneath me, when for want of a better description, i dont hang around when driving it.
The rotten chassis is now the norm, as pictures from underneath look ok, but when you lift the body off its a different matter. Even if i coudnt do the work myself, a otherwise very nice chim with rotten outriggers should not stop you buying it, the price must be reflected accordingly.
I think in another 5 to 10 years,it will be harder to sell a chim that hasnt had chassis work. I.M.O

[V8isa]

Dan Melladay at Lincoln fabricates and fits outriggers. These are the ones he fitted to my Chim