Fed Up With Wannabe Entrepreneurs...

[zaktoo]

KingRichard said:

zaktoo said:

how does one explain their business model to someone else without the good ideas simply being appropriated?

Confidentiality Agreement

Surely the wealthier party just buys their way out of trouble via long drawn out court cases that the poorer party can't afford to contest properly?

[JustinP1]

zaktoo said:

how does one explain their business model to someone else without the good ideas simply being appropriated?

As King Richard says, you draw up a non-disclosure or confidentiality agreement.

However, traditionally people hugely overvalue the 'worth' of a simple idea. I come up with about 8 of 10 business models a year, but only have the funds and personal time to devote to one.

The idea is not the 'value' it is the way it is brought to market, what if anything makes it different, and the way that it is managed and expanded that is actually the value.

After all, if this was not the case, surely if the 'best of the best' that get through to the TV part of Dragons Den, they are forced to explain their business model which could be easily copied by a million people watching it.

Not all have the balls to risk remortgaging their house to put £100,000 behind it and less have the time, nouse, or ability to take the project to fruition.

[sa_20v]

JustinP1 said:

Not all have the balls to risk remortgaging their house to put £100,000 behind it and less have the time, nouse, or ability to take the project to fruition.

Hence my frustration when such individuals come to me and ask me to hold the baby - of course I would if it were a good idea.

On a different note, Peter Jones refuses to sign NDAs - I wouldn't trust him...

[JonRB]

"Aaaaahm ooot"

[jamesw2000]

sa_20v said:

JustinP1 said:

Not all have the balls to risk remortgaging their house to put £100,000 behind it and less have the time, nouse, or ability to take the project to fruition.

Hence my frustration when such individuals come to me and ask me to hold the baby - of course I would if it were a good idea.

On a different note, Peter Jones refuses to sign NDAs - I wouldn't trust him...

did you see the the one where he told the two guys straight up - why should I invest in your idea (website to order local fast food or something) when I can get my team of 20+ web guys to knock up a site that is twice as good as yours in 2 weeks and market it more effectivly and steal all your market share...

Edited by jamesw2000 on Monday 18th February 23:18

[JustinP1]

sa_20v said:

JustinP1 said:

Not all have the balls to risk remortgaging their house to put £100,000 behind it and less have the time, nouse, or ability to take the project to fruition.

Hence my frustration when such individuals come to me and ask me to hold the baby - of course I would if it were a good idea.

On a different note, Peter Jones refuses to sign NDAs - I wouldn't trust him...

Thats interesting!

Maybe he doesnt have the time or can be bothered to get his legal bods to look over each one before hearing someones two minute pitch.

If there are people still queueing up then, I suppose he doesnt have to. Maybe its a bargaining tool along the lines of "Look, I have given you a more than fair offer which gives you a good chance of paying off your mortgage in a few years with zero financial risk to you... take it, or I will run with it myself anyway and redevelop your idea from scratch and catch up in a few weeks and probably be better than your plan anyway..."

[stimmers]

jamesw2000 said:

odyssey2200 said:

sa_20v said:

With three of the last four so-called 'opportunities' I've been introduced to, wannabe 'entrepreneurs' (usually people of sound mind, in respectable jobs and earning upwards of 40k) expected me to basically fund their existing lifestyle for a whole year (or longer) whilst they attempted to establish themselves in a market they clearly knew nothing about. Is this at all normal, because I usually cause such people run to the hills when I state that such investment is for their business/idea alone - just ahead of breaking the news that their business model has more holes than a Dutch brothel...

I can understand some people not wanting to take a risk, but what gives them the right to try and offload it onto someone else - I didn't!? I'm also finding it difficult to understand how such individuals, usually in the upper echelons of reasonable sized organisations, are so utterly inept when it comes to business - some even on par, if not inferior, to that of school children partaking in a Young Enterprise Scheme.

Please tell me I'm not alone in my frustrations.

sa_20v

How does one go about getting a business plan to a VC for consideration?

depending on your circumstances I would use VC capital as a last resort, try to avoid parting with equity at all costs for finance. You'd be suprised how much cash you can raise through interest free credit cards, personal loans etc if you're only planning a small venture to avoid being charged extortionate interest rates. If your running something whilst still employed then they can be a good option.

Obviously if you are looking for larger amounts of funding say £50K upwards then you will need to approach lenders. But cling on to every single % of equity you can, it will stand you in good stead in the long term. I would rather pay a high interest rate than give away part of my business. If the VC is going to bring certain expertise / skills to the business that cannot be found elsewhere or no one will lend you any money at all as your idea is very high risk then VC may be a good option.

Edited by jamesw2000 on Monday 18th February 20:31

Very good advice. Last place on earth you want to go to for capital to start a new business is a VC, until you have exhausted all other routes. The best allies you have are your friends, family and their friends and family. Its amazing what support and interest you can drum up from this network of people if you genuinely have a good business proposition.

[JamieBeeston]

JonRB said:

"Aaaaahm ooot"

I Do like Duncan..

Peter Jones is just too smarmy....

I liked how Richard would always wind him up and poach / coach his potentials

Shame he wasnt invited back ;(

[KingRichard]

JamieBeeston said:

JonRB said:

"Aaaaahm ooot"

I Do like Duncan..

Peter Jones is just too smarmy....

I liked how Richard would always wind him up and poach / coach his potentials

Shame he wasnt invited back ;(

Yeah I liked Richards style as well. I also like Duncan... Theo and Peter Jones occasionally wind me up - there's often no need to slate genuine misguided people. Having said that, it is funny watching them rip apart some complete cocktard

Who's that blonde bint again? The fat one... she does my head in I'd do the more milfy looking one though

[stimmers]

KingRichard said:

JamieBeeston said:

JonRB said:

"Aaaaahm ooot"

I Do like Duncan..

Peter Jones is just too smarmy....

I liked how Richard would always wind him up and poach / coach his potentials

Shame he wasnt invited back ;(

there's often no need to slate genuine misguided people.

Thats TV for you.

MILFY one? Seriously? Both females who have been on DD are revolting

[Plotloss]

jamesw2000 said:

sa_20v said:

JustinP1 said:

Not all have the balls to risk remortgaging their house to put £100,000 behind it and less have the time, nouse, or ability to take the project to fruition.

Hence my frustration when such individuals come to me and ask me to hold the baby - of course I would if it were a good idea.

On a different note, Peter Jones refuses to sign NDAs - I wouldn't trust him...

did you see the the one where he told the two guys straight up - why should I invest in your idea (website to order local fast food or something) when I can get my team of 20+ web guys to knock up a site that is twice as good as yours in 2 weeks and market it more effectivly and steal all your market share...

Edited by jamesw2000 on Monday 18th February 23:18

Thats not him showing his true colours as a shark, its him showing that theres nothing unique in the pitched idea.

Subtle yet significant difference.

Whoever asked about finding VC funding, its quite simple really, you just arrive with a pot of Vaseline and bend over. Especially if its a web based business.

[sa_20v]

JamieBeeston said:

JonRB said:

"Aaaaahm ooot"

I Do like Duncan..

Peter Jones is just too smarmy....

I liked how Richard would always wind him up and poach / coach his potentials

Shame he wasnt invited back ;(

I heard that Richard wasn't invited back because Peter Jones basically ran the show down there. It's a shame, I have a lot of respect for Farley.

[JustinP1]

Plotloss said:

jamesw2000 said:

sa_20v said:

JustinP1 said:

Not all have the balls to risk remortgaging their house to put £100,000 behind it and less have the time, nouse, or ability to take the project to fruition.

Hence my frustration when such individuals come to me and ask me to hold the baby - of course I would if it were a good idea.

On a different note, Peter Jones refuses to sign NDAs - I wouldn't trust him...

did you see the the one where he told the two guys straight up - why should I invest in your idea (website to order local fast food or something) when I can get my team of 20+ web guys to knock up a site that is twice as good as yours in 2 weeks and market it more effectivly and steal all your market share...

Edited by jamesw2000 on Monday 18th February 23:18

Thats not him showing his true colours as a shark, its him showing that theres nothing unique in the pitched idea.

Subtle yet significant difference.

Whoever asked about finding VC funding, its quite simple really, you just arrive with a pot of Vaseline and bend over. Especially if its a web based business.

Completely agreed.

The business owners have put their cards on the table and said what they think their business to be worth.

The investor put his cards on the table and said what he thinks their business to be worth. Not as much as the business owners...

[KingRichard]

stimmers said:

KingRichard said:

JamieBeeston said:

JonRB said:

"Aaaaahm ooot"

I Do like Duncan..

Peter Jones is just too smarmy....

I liked how Richard would always wind him up and poach / coach his potentials

Shame he wasnt invited back ;(

there's often no need to slate genuine misguided people.

Thats TV for you.

MILFY one? Seriously? Both females who have been on DD are revolting

Yeah sure... Admittedly it's more her attitude but I'd kick her around the bedroom

[Soir]

KingRichard said:

stimmers said:

KingRichard said:

JamieBeeston said:

JonRB said:

"Aaaaahm ooot"

I Do like Duncan..

Peter Jones is just too smarmy....

I liked how Richard would always wind him up and poach / coach his potentials

Shame he wasnt invited back ;(

there's often no need to slate genuine misguided people.

Thats TV for you.

MILFY one? Seriously? Both females who have been on DD are revolting

Yeah sure... Admittedly it's more her attitude but I'd kick her around the bedroom

didn't she start red letter days which made huge losses and managed to sell it? (think theo may have been involved in buying it)

[boycieboy]

Soir said:

KingRichard said:

stimmers said:

KingRichard said:

JamieBeeston said:

JonRB said:

"Aaaaahm ooot"

I Do like Duncan..

Peter Jones is just too smarmy....

I liked how Richard would always wind him up and poach / coach his potentials

Shame he wasnt invited back ;(

there's often no need to slate genuine misguided people.

Thats TV for you.

MILFY one? Seriously? Both females who have been on DD are revolting

Yeah sure... Admittedly it's more her attitude but I'd kick her around the bedroom

didn't she start red letter days which made huge losses and managed to sell it? (think theo may have been involved in buying it)

Yes she did and I'm sure I read somewhere that most of the dragons clubbed together to buy it from her when it went bust (out of sympathy???)

She now has a area specific social network type site that she is selling franchises for, can't remember what it is called or if it is doing any good?