close to knocking my landlord clean out..!!!

[m3sye]

Bit of advice guys before I lose it with my residential landlord. I am moving into a new house and I let him know last Friday that it was possibly going to be this Sat (he wanted it asap, so didn't have to do the 1 month notice as per my contract) but I would call him to confirm. He took that upon himself to tell his mate(his landlord, he moved out with a gf but they split up)that he would be out of his house Saturday. The move in date has now been put back to the 14th a Saturday as some work needs to be finished at the house I'm moving to and they could not get the workman in till then.

I am away on the 14th as its my GF's birthday so have told him I will be moving out on the Sunday the 15th. He has been kicking off saying he wants to be in earlier etc etc and just now I have had a voice mail from him he will not wait till late afternoon Sunday and will start moving his stuff in at 12noon.

Obviously I am NEVER going to be able to get all my furniture etc out of the house by then, so the last thing I want is him coming in with all his boxes etc.

What are my rights?

[JustinP1]

Just tell him he can come if he wants, but he may be waiting a while, and if he wants he can give you a hand lifting as it will get done faster.

[sonic_2k_uk]

Tell him you're there for another month, as per your contract

[mondeoman]

If you have a contract, you can stick to the one months notice and tell him to lump it

[dazco]

He has no right to go in your home without your permission if you are still under contract.

[Wings]

dazco said:

He has no right to go in your home without your permission if you are still under contract.

Not entirely correct, for under many Tenancy Agreements drafted for the purpose of an Assured Shorthold Tenancy as defined in Section 19A of the Housing Act 1988 as amended by the Housing Act 1996, there invariably will be the following clause;

“Permit the Landlord to enter the Premises at all reasonable hours upon 24 hours written notice, to inspect the premises, furniture and effects therein, to carry out any repairs or maintenance to the Premises or elsewhere which the Landlord may consider necessary and for the purpose of allowing prospective tenants or purchasers to view the premises.” end.

My advice to the OP would be that he seeks to avoid a confrontation with the Landlord, and therefore tries to appease him by seeking to reach a solution to the situation. One solution might be to set aside one room of the property for the landlord to move his items of furniture to, at an agreeable time to suit all parties. As a guarantee that the landlord plays ball with the tenant, the tenant is legally entitled to change either the cylinder (£3.95) to the main door nightlatch lock, or to any other type of main door lock, informing the landlord of having done the same, loss of keys being one excuse I can think of for the OP having to do the same.

[dazco]

Wings said:

dazco said:

He has no right to go in your home without your permission if you are still under contract.

Not entirely correct, for under many Tenancy Agreements drafted for the purpose of an Assured Shorthold Tenancy as defined in Section 19A of the Housing Act 1988 as amended by the Housing Act 1996, there invariably will be the following clause;

“Permit the Landlord to enter the Premises at all reasonable hours upon 24 hours written notice, to inspect the premises, furniture and effects therein, to carry out any repairs or maintenance to the Premises or elsewhere which the Landlord may consider necessary and for the purpose of allowing prospective tenants or purchasers to view the premises.” end.

My advice to the OP would be that he seeks to avoid a confrontation with the Landlord, and therefore tries to appease him by seeking to reach a solution to the situation. One solution might be to set aside one room of the property for the landlord to move his items of furniture to, at an agreeable time to suit all parties. As a guarantee that the landlord plays ball with the tenant, the tenant is legally entitled to change either the cylinder (£3.95) to the main door nightlatch lock, or to any other type of main door lock, informing the landlord of having done the same, loss of keys being one excuse I can think of for the OP having to do the same.

It may be in the contract but it does not affect the statutory rights of the OP to "live in quiet enjoyment".

Permission may be requested 24 hours in advance but need not be given.

[Wings]

dazco said:

Wings said:

dazco said:

He has no right to go in your home without your permission if you are still under contract.

“Permit the Landlord to enter the Premises at alPermit the Landlord to enter the Premises at all reasonable hours upon 24 hours written notice, to inspect the premises, furniture and effects therein, to carry out any repairs or maintenance to the Premises or elsewhere which the Landlord may consider necessary and for the purpose of allowing prospective tenants or purchasers to view the premises.” end.

It may be in the contract but it does not affect the statutory rights of the OP to "live in quiet enjoyment".

With respect the tenant/OP has already given permission/agreed by engrossing the Tenancy Agreement containing a similar worded clause to this “Permit the Landlord to enter the Premises at all reasonable hours upon 24 hours written notice”. However, the landlord also has to comply to that clause, the same which does not include/allow what the OP is trying to prevent, and that is the landlord moving furniture and effects into the rented/occupied premises.

The Tenancy Agreement/tenancy is not terminated and brought to an end, until the keys of the premises are handed over by the tenant to the landlord, and as I posted earlier, if the tenant/OP has any misgivings in the landlord not breaching the Tenancy, by entering the premises then the tenant is legally within his rights to change the cylinder, and or lock/s.


Permission may be requested 24 hours in advance but need not be given.

[dazco]

Wings said:

dazco said:

Wings said:

dazco said:

He has no right to go in your home without your permission if you are still under contract.

“Permit the Landlord to enter the Premises at alPermit the Landlord to enter the Premises at all reasonable hours upon 24 hours written notice, to inspect the premises, furniture and effects therein, to carry out any repairs or maintenance to the Premises or elsewhere which the Landlord may consider necessary and for the purpose of allowing prospective tenants or purchasers to view the premises.” end.

It may be in the contract but it does not affect the statutory rights of the OP to "live in quiet enjoyment".

With respect the tenant/OP has already given permission/agreed by engrossing the Tenancy Agreement containing a similar worded clause to this “Permit the Landlord to enter the Premises at all reasonable hours upon 24 hours written notice”. However, the landlord also has to comply to that clause, the same which does not include/allow what the OP is trying to prevent, and that is the landlord moving furniture and effects into the rented/occupied premises.

The Tenancy Agreement/tenancy is not terminated and brought to an end, until the keys of the premises are handed over by the tenant to the landlord, and as I posted earlier, if the tenant/OP has any misgivings in the landlord not breaching the Tenancy, by entering the premises then the tenant is legally within his rights to change the cylinder, and or lock/s.


Permission may be requested 24 hours in advance but need not be given.

Any words written into a contract do not make it right.

OP has every right to refuse permission unless it is an emergency.

Think about it..

A landlord could just shove a 24hr notice through the door every day, and go in every day. No no.

It is the OP's house until the contract ends.

If the landlord wrote into the contract "I shall be allowed to through bricks through your window, and you shall fix them at your own expense", would it make it right?

Anything written on ANY contract is superseded by the law of the land, and the law says the tennant should be left in peace.

[Wings]

I once again repeat, a tenant by engrossing a Tenancy Agreement containing a similar worded clause to this “Permit the Landlord to enter the Premises at all reasonable hours upon 24 hours written notice”, has agreed, accepted that upon 24 hours written notice the landlord may enter the premises.

Now any Agreement is not just subject to the wording of the Agreement, but also the spirit of all parties entering into that Agreement. Most landlords and Letting Agents require from time to time access into their tenanted properties, not just for the inspection of the property, but also to show potential tenants around a property where a sitting tenant has given Notice.

I fail to see where a 24 hours written notice of a landlord inspecting their property, at an agreeable and reasonable time for the tenant is breaching “the tennant should be left in peace.”

Would you dazco, if you were a landlord, want to carry out occasional inspection of your property?

[dazco]

Wings said:

I once again repeat, a tenant by engrossing a Tenancy Agreement containing a similar worded clause to this “Permit the Landlord to enter the Premises at all reasonable hours upon 24 hours written notice”, has agreed, accepted that upon 24 hours written notice the landlord may enter the premises.

Now any Agreement is not just subject to the wording of the Agreement, but also the spirit of all parties entering into that Agreement. Most landlords and Letting Agents require from time to time access into their tenanted properties, not just for the inspection of the property, but also to show potential tenants around a property where a sitting tenant has given Notice.

I fail to see where a 24 hours written notice of a landlord inspecting their property, at an agreeable and reasonable time for the tenant is breaching “the tennant should be left in peace.”

Would you dazco, if you were a landlord, want to carry out occasional inspection of your property?

Once again, I repeat.

If it contradicts statuatory law it ain't worth st.

I do not care whether I would want to or not, the law says I can't and that is that.

And the landlord going into their home, 24 hours notice or not, is disturbing their peace. For christ's sake, how would you like it if you sat down every night after work and the landlord came in EVERY SINGLE NIGHT, because that is what you are saying he is entitled to do.

And as for showing new punters round. NO, wait till they have gone. You have no right.

[jdw1234]

Ask him what deductions for maintenance he has been filing or intends to with the inland revenue.

[m3sye]

I basically told him in no uncertain terms that he is not moving in when I am moving out and if he wants to take it further I will pass my solicitors details on for him to call.

He saw sense then...

[m3sye]

I basically told him in no uncertain terms that he is not moving in when I am moving out and if he wants to take it further I will pass my solicitors details on for him to call.

He saw sense then...

[Wings]

dazco said:

Wings said:

I once again repeat, a tenant by engrossing a Tenancy Agreement containing a similar worded clause to this “Permit the Landlord to enter the Premises at all reasonable hours upon 24 hours written notice”, has agreed, accepted that upon 24 hours written notice the landlord may enter the premises.

Now any Agreement is not just subject to the wording of the Agreement, but also the spirit of all parties entering into that Agreement. Most landlords and Letting Agents require from time to time access into their tenanted properties, not just for the inspection of the property, but also to show potential tenants around a property where a sitting tenant has given Notice.

Dazco, please do not take things to the extreme, it is not about landlords entering premises every other day, it is about landlords who might need to carry out periodic checks on their property, or to show potential tenants the property.

This is more about the landlord giving 24 hours notice, not the landlord saying to the tenant “I will enter the premises after 24 hours”, it is the landlord saying to the tenant “Is it okay if I pop round tomorrow at 3 ish, for X, Y, Z”, “No it is not convenient, so when will it be convenient to you” “The following day at 6 ish, OK look foreword to seeing you”.

I have been a landlord for over 15 years, dealing with many differing types of tenants, from the person on housing benefit, to the professional person/couple, in that time I have never breached on a tenant’s privacy, and yet every tenant has always openly invited either myself or my wife to enter the premises when they, the tenant/s are not there.

To conclude, the OP’s landlord is wrong in the action he intended to take, and the OP is therefore right in the stance he has taken.


I fail to see where a 24 hours written notice of a landlord inspecting their property, at an agreeable and reasonable time for the tenant is breaching “the tennant should be left in peace.”

Would you dazco, if you were a landlord, want to carry out occasional inspection of your property?

Once again, I repeat.

If it contradicts statuatory law it ain't worth st.

I do not care whether I would want to or not, the law says I can't and that is that.

And the landlord going into their home, 24 hours notice or not, is disturbing their peace. For christ's sake, how would you like it if you sat down every night after work and the landlord came in EVERY SINGLE NIGHT, because that is what you are saying he is entitled to do.

And as for showing new punters round. NO, wait till they have gone. You have no right.

[dazco]

Tell Wings, show me where it says it in law. I can show you where it doesn't. The tennant does not have to let you inspect the property at all, but we can all assume that if the tennant does refuse he will be out when the next contract is due.

Very very surprised you do not know this.

[paintman]

You may find this of interest. Section 4.3 talks about rights of entry.
http://www.communities.gov.uk/documents/housing/pd...
Also linked from the same site is a similar sheet for landlords which under 'Rights' advises that if a tenant refuses to allow access then the landlord should seek redress in law.
Much seems skewed in favour of the tenant & the landlord is advised to go to law in the event of any disputes/eviction.

Edited by paintman on Friday 6th November 09:11

[Wings]

dazco said:

Tell Wings, show me where it says it in law. I can show you where it doesn't. The tennant does not have to let you inspect the property at all, but we can all assume that if the tennant does refuse he will be out when the next contract is due.

Very very surprised you do not know this.

As with any dispute, the dispute can be subject to Law, and where a clause within an
Agreement/Contract was deemed by a Court to be reasonable, then the Court would side with the Claimant/Landlord, and not the Defendant/Tenant.

I repeat in 15 years I have never been refused access to a property, if I had been, then the above legal option would have been open to me to explore, although subject to circumstances I doubt it is a route I would have taken any way. If a tenant ever said refused me access, then no way would I ever enter a property with either the tenant in
or not in attendance.

As with any Agreement/Contract it is for each party entering into the Agreement/Contract to at the outset, prior to signing and exchanging the Agreement/Contract to read, understand and accept the terms/clauses, or to ask for either clarification or the rewording or the complete deletion of a particular clause, that is not acceptable to one of the parties entering into the Agreement/Contract.

The giving of 24 hours Notice, is in Law a “point of evidence”, and if a Landlord had reasonable reason for requiring access, and had followed the contractual agreement of giving the tenant 24 hours Notice, then I am certain the Courts would find for the Landlord.

[dazco]

Wings said:

dazco said:

Tell Wings, show me where it says it in law. I can show you where it doesn't. The tennant does not have to let you inspect the property at all, but we can all assume that if the tennant does refuse he will be out when the next contract is due.

Very very surprised you do not know this.

As with any dispute, the dispute can be subject to Law, and where a clause within an
Agreement/Contract was deemed by a Court to be reasonable, then the Court would side with the Claimant/Landlord, and not the Defendant/Tenant.

I repeat in 15 years I have never been refused access to a property, if I had been, then the above legal option would have been open to me to explore, although subject to circumstances I doubt it is a route I would have taken any way. If a tenant ever said refused me access, then no way would I ever enter a property with either the tenant in
or not in attendance.

As with any Agreement/Contract it is for each party entering into the Agreement/Contract to at the outset, prior to signing and exchanging the Agreement/Contract to read, understand and accept the terms/clauses, or to ask for either clarification or the rewording or the complete deletion of a particular clause, that is not acceptable to one of the parties entering into the Agreement/Contract.

The giving of 24 hours Notice, is in Law a “point of evidence”, and if a Landlord had reasonable reason for requiring access, and had followed the contractual agreement of giving the tenant 24 hours Notice, then I am certain the Courts would find for the Landlord.

Why are you certain. There is nothing in law saying the landlord can go in except for emergency purposes or to do maintainance.

We are not talking common sense here, nor what is right and wrong, we are just talking about the law. And the law say you cannot go in without permission.

It is the tennants house when you rent it to them. Sorry, those are the stone cold harsh facts.

http://www.propertyinvestmentproject.co.uk/blog/la...

http://www.propertyinvestmentproject.co.uk/blog/te...

http://www.contractsandagreements.co.uk/illegal-an...

http://www.privatehousinginformation.co.uk/site/14...

Edited by dazco on Friday 6th November 18:47

Edited by dazco on Friday 6th November 18:50

[paintman]

The links you quote are very clear that the landlord or his agent does have the legal right to enter his premises to carry out repairs or to inspect subject to 24 hours notice at a reasonable time.
The tenant can refuse to allow access, but again your links point out that the tenant will likely be in breach of the tenancy agreement and the landlord can seek a court order.

Edited by paintman on Sunday 8th November 01:16