Tax on additional income into joint account query

[MrChips]

Afternoon all,

Firstly let me state i'm in the middle of trying to find a decent local accountant in order to handle our tax return but hoping for a little initial advice from any knowledgeable people on here.

We've recently let our house out, with both myself and wife named as landlords, and the monthly rent going into an account which is in joint names. My wife has more headroom before she reaches a higher rate tax status, so can we simply declare all of this additional income via self assessment in her sole name, or is the fact that the account receiving payment is in joint names, leading us to needing to declare half of the income to each of us, i.e. 2 separate returns?

Under the current allowance for mortgage interest to be written off, I don't think either way will impact us financially, i'd like to keep things as simple as possible so ideally do all of it in her name.

Anyone know a decent accountant in Berkshire?!

[Countdown]

The joint account names don't matter. The key things from a HMRC point of view are who the income really belongs to and they will look at

whose name the house is in
Who the named landlord is

I have a few BTLs. Most are in my wife's name. There are two which are in joint names but I have made a beneficial declaration which says the income is 100% hers. All the tenancy agreements are in her name.

[Eric Mc]

Yes - you have to make sure the property is properly in the name of the person who declares the rental income. It's not just a question of having joint bank accounts or making declarations on tax returns.

You also have to be aware of the Capital Gains Tax implications of having properties in one person's name only.

[MrChips]

Ok thanks both, house is in joint names on land registry, as is the btl mortgage that we're putting through so it sounds like i definitely need to find an accountant sooner rather than later.

Will also ask again the CGT implications. We've lived in the house for 8yrs already so we have a fair bit of time before we're facing any cgt should we sell but as it's a long term plan to keep the house then we need to be aware of anything impactful.

Shame my mrs is so utterly st at doing any paperwork whatsoever!

[UpTheIron]

Putting one or two properties through your tax returns is pretty straightforward, not sure you really need an accountant tbh. What is worrying you?

[Eric Mc]

Putting income from a jointly owned property through the appropriate individual tax returns is not only easy, it is a legal obligation.

The tricky part is ensuring that the ownership of the property is properly documented and that the split for tax return purposes is in line with what the legal position shows.

[MrChips]

Nothing specific worrying me as such, just that I want to make sure i've know what/how to do it to ensure we make the best advantage of any tax relief that we can. I've never done a tax return at all, and been with the same company for 10yrs so not ever had to query anything to be honest. I guess the initial queries that i'd like to sit down and go through with someone more knowledgable would be:

- What can we claim back tax on (i have a rough idea from initial research), but for example, do we need to spend any outgoings/maintenance from the same account? And what proof will we be expected to show for example that stuff has been purchased and used for the rental property (e.g paint)
- Once the proposed changes come in from 2017, and certainly by the time it's fully implemented in 2020, then neither my wife or I will individually have room within the lower tax bracket to declare all income under one of our names so i'd like to look to plan for this.

If i'm understanding you both correctly at present, as the house, mortgage, and account is in joint names, then we'll both need to do a tax return, but who's to say that the income is 50/50? i.e. how would we go about doing the following:

Countdown said:

There are two which are in joint names but I have made a beneficial declaration which says the income is 100% hers. All the tenancy agreements are in her name.

I'm fine working out figures and form filling but a little bit of knowledge goes a long way when doing this stuff for the first time, so i'm happy to pay for some detailed advice from an accountant who's done this stuff before, even if I do the actual return myself.

[Countdown]

MrC - is this what you're looking for?

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/income-...

Will answer other questions tomorrow when not on iPad

Edited by Countdown on Saturday 5th September 22:55

[Eric Mc]

If in joint names, the assumption is that the split is indeed 50/50 and yes, both recipients of the rent MUST complete a Self Assessment tax return to cover their share of the rental profits.

[Countdown]

MrChips said:

- What can we claim back tax on (i have a rough idea from initial research),

Things such as
Mortgage interest
Letting agent fees
Repairs and maintenance
Gas safety certificates
Accountants fees
Insurance

MrChips said:

but for example, do we need to spend any outgoings/maintenance from the same account?

Nope (makes it easier for your accountant and HMRC if you DO but there's no requirement to pay from the same account. To give you an example, you might pay some of the costs by cash. How do you then prove whose cash it was?

MrChips said:

And what proof will we be expected to show for example that stuff has been purchased and used for the rental property (e.g paint)

Invoices, receipts, (corroborated by bank statements), copies of insurance documents, lettings agents statements.

[sumo69]

Anyone on here done the Form 17 route with a Declaration of Trust? This means the income split can differ from the beneficial ownership split, which is always assumed at 50:50 for a married couple??

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/manuals/tsemmanual/tsem9850...

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/income-...

I have used this a couple of times for clients when their other income dictates a large tax saving would result.

David

Edit: Added links for more info

Edited by sumo69 on Sunday 6th September 12:43