Medical air lift

[George111]

The initial message was deleted from this topic on 10 January 2016 at 14:11

[ikarl]

Wow, I can't help but I hope everything works out ok!

A normal answer on here would be to get onto Twitter and fight your case/cause through social media and shame them into doing something.

Good luck

[mikees]

fk me. What a nightmare. Good luck fella. Carpet bomb social media. Do axa have a Pre existing illness to repudiate ?

[numtumfutunch]

Nightmare!

Sorry I have no rec's myself but Im sure that there is somebody who has posted on PH before who is involved with this kind of thing

Are you sure that she'd need 2 specialists though?
Unless she is on intensive care and on a ventilator?

If shes stable and breathing on her own the repat would probably involve a couple of seats on a scheduled flight with a jobbing dogsbody escort not a private jet with fully fitted out life support, so if your paying yourself Im struggling to see how its going to cost £20k upwards

I know the above from a pal who as a junior doctor used to do ad hoc work for insurance companies bringing sick people back home and some of his stories were a bit scary in terms of equipment!

Finally - how can your claim be kicked back, is it relating to a pre-existing conditions clause or having had an op there?

Best of luck

[craig1912]

http://www.cegagroup.com/medical-assistance/

They work with most insurers and are excellent.

..........oh and most insurers don't try and wriggle out of paying a claim- don't Axa use an assistance company anyway?

Edited by craig1912 on Saturday 5th September 12:19

[anonymous-user]

craig1912 said:

..........oh and most insurers don't try and wriggle out of paying a claim-

And in today's news http://dailym.ai/1M1e5r4
Does the possibility of a day or 2 out in the past really make a difference just as it crossed an arbitrary day ?
Although we may not have the full facts,
It certainly looks like a wriggle

[williredale]

craig1912 said:

http://www.cegagroup.com/medical-assistance/

They work with most insurers and are excellent.

..........oh and most insurers don't try and wriggle out of paying a claim- don't Axa use an assistance company anyway?

Edited by craig1912 on Saturday 5th September 12:19

+ for Cega.

[craig1912]

speedyguy said:

And in today's news http://dailym.ai/1M1e5r4
Does the possibility of a day or 2 out in the past really make a difference just as it crossed an arbitrary day ?
Although we may not have the full facts,
It certainly looks like a wriggle

a) it's the Daily Fail
b) yes a day can make all the difference depending on when he took out the policy.

Lesson- when applying for a policy be sure to declare everything and make sure you get your facts correct.

Feel for the OP though as a terrible situation to be in

[rk176]

Going through something similar my self. My mother is hospitalised in southern Italy.
We are dealing with a clams handler and at times it's like banging you head against a brick wall
You just have to keep at them that you want her home to get better medical care. Keep phoning and following it up with an email so there is a trace.
We have to wait till Monday So the consultant can talk to the insurance medical team about the next step. Hopefully to bring her home. As the consultant is sat in an air conditioning office at 20 dog and the ward must be well in to the 30. Causing extreme discomfort for her.
Hope everything works out for you. Keep strong

[Biglips]

Try Wings Medical Group. I know a few anaesthetists who have worked for them in the past and they seem to have positive feedback although I have no direct experience of them myself. With regard to the transfer you will need an anaesthetist, preferably one with ITU background. A surgeon is usually unnecessary although I don't know the details of your case. They are not going to open up the abdomen in flight even in extremis. Ask about the anaesthetists experience and ensure they have the requesite experience in aviation medicine and repatriation. They will be keeping you loved one alive and like all walks of life there are huge variations in skill sets and experience. IMPORTANTLY make sure the transfer in UK is to a decent sized unit with experience in complex GI surgery and management of intestinal failure if the expectation is that she needs further surgery or prolonged intravenous nutrition. This may not necessarily be your local DGH. Good luck. Feel free to PM me if you need any assistance

Edited by Biglips on Monday 7th September 09:51

[Bill]

Are they trying to repudiate the claim, or just avoid what they see as unnecessary medevac? Insurers would rather wait until the patient needs less care to reduce the flight costs, there's also an argument that the risks of a flight are far higher than the risks involved in staying in a Bulgarian hospital.

ETA and when you say "class c low level flight" is that to reduce the risk of gas expansion bursting your GF's bowel?

[dgb00]

George111 said:

Thanks - she's on a stretcher and can't sit up, even in icu where she is now. Needs to be a low level flight class c with surgeon, that's what hospital have recommended. She needs oxygen, drains and pain relief administered by a qualified person such as a consultant.

Not a pre existing condition but Axa like most insurance companies will wriggle like the best to get out of paying for something, even when she was near to death in the medical centre, intestine ruptured and spilling blood into her abdomen, Axa still insisted on me faxing a copy of the ticket to them which obviously I couldn't do. Seriously unhelpful and even now are still refusing to confirm payment until they have full medical history to check to see if there is any previous history of this issue- which there isn't.

I'll post up my experience and recommendations once she's back home, just having insurance isn't good enough if you need to claim !

Sorry, have only just seen this. My declaration of interest is that I am an anaesthetist/intensivist who flies with Airmed every now and then on these type of flights.

This kind of case isn't unusual. I highly recommend Airmed. They are the only EURAMI and CAMTS certified operator in Europe (ICU specialist accreditation). Their chief nurse (David Quayle) and medical director (Jon Warwick, a consultant anaesthetist, ex-RAF and also a commercial pilot) are used to assessing these cases and advising. Website is www.airmed.co.uk.

Generally, sea level cabins aren't necessary. The books say that they are, but in reality it is very rare to need one. Sea level cabins impact massively on range and fuel consumption of the aircraft, and you end up bumping around in the weather. The Airmed guys have literally written text books on this, and will happily advise. Also, you generally don't need a surgeon. We aren't doing surgery in the air, and they are not used to dealing with pressure changes and ICU equipment. Generally, Airmed would send an intensivist or an anaesthetist, both of whom are happy with this kind of stuff. About 10% of Airmed's flights are full intensive care patients (asleep and on life support systems) so anything is possible. I wouldn't take the advice of the hospital; I would discuss with experts used to these problems.

I have heard good things about CEGA. There are other companies (e.g. REGA in Switzerland) who are well thought of. I have not heard good things about Wings. That may be biased (see declaration above). Commercial aircraft won't touch her with ongoing surgical issues or post-ICU. Lufthansa is often the most open minded, and work quite closely with medical repatriation companies.

Also bear in mind that although it might seem great to get your fiancee home at all costs, there is a definite risk from moving her from a place of safety to another place of safety through a potentially risky air transfer. Airmed would be happy to advise. There may be a window when it is more suitable to move her. Again, they work a lot with assistance companies so may be able to help from that end also.

Be aware that none of this is cheap. I would guesstimate that a jet out to Bulgaria and back to UK would be roughly £15-20k, maybe a bit less. At Airmed we would normally specify a Learjet as that would allow a single sector mission and result in a quicker transfer. I would advise against turboprops. They would have to do it in two hops because of the range.

Best of luck, and I hope everything works out. I am sure it is very scary being stuck so far away! PM me if I can help at all.

Doug

[JumboBeef]

George111 said:

Needs to be a low level flight class c with surgeon, that's what hospital have recommended.

This doesn't compute. Why a surgeon? What is he/she doing to do in the air? Of all the helpful people to have around, I can't (in this situation) seeing a surgeon being one.

Makes me wonder how much of the rest of the "essentials" you've been told you need that you actually need.....

Hope it all works out....

Edit: just seen reply above, saying pretty much the same this (but much more eloquently )

[dgb00]

George111 said:

Thanks for the comments, much appreciated. She came back using Airmed with Jules and Sarah - I believe Jules is an ICU consultant from Oxford and Sarah is a theatre nurse. She said they were absolutely fantastic - professional and determined to get her back once they saw where she was and the condition she was in, despite this being the best private hospital in the area. They stabilised her and once delivered to the NHS hospital here her blood pressure and heart rate were stable and normal. We can't praise Airmed highly enough - they were brilliant with the people and equipment and the Learjet to get the job done quickly and safely. Will carry their details with me on all trips now.

Glad to hear she is back! And nice to hear good things about Airmed too...

Best of luck with everything in the UK.