Why can't we buy mainstream games online ?
Discussion
Having just played a demo of a game that came on a CD, I thought "hmm, this isn't bad, think I'll buy it".
I went to see if I could downloaded it there and then from their official site, however, like most (all ?) mainstream games, I can't .... I've now got to trudge off to my nearest PC World or whatever, and physically buy the damn thing.
Why aren't games manufacturers cottoning on to the fact that lots of people have BB now a days, and waiting an hour or so (or whatever) to download 600mb is no big deal ? Burn it to CD, put the manual in PDF format ... sorted !
The cost saving of not having to manufacture and ship the packaging can be passed on to the punter and/or put into huge download servers.
Just wondering / musing ....
I went to see if I could downloaded it there and then from their official site, however, like most (all ?) mainstream games, I can't .... I've now got to trudge off to my nearest PC World or whatever, and physically buy the damn thing.
Why aren't games manufacturers cottoning on to the fact that lots of people have BB now a days, and waiting an hour or so (or whatever) to download 600mb is no big deal ? Burn it to CD, put the manual in PDF format ... sorted !
The cost saving of not having to manufacture and ship the packaging can be passed on to the punter and/or put into huge download servers.
Just wondering / musing ....
Downloadable games was part of the hype when Xbox was launched. BUT,
1. The xbox only has an 8Gb hardisk, which would mean about 1 or 2 games saved at a time.
2. The xbox DVD's are 8Gb discs (i think). On a standard 512k broadband connection that would still take about 83 days to download!
Connections will have to become really fast before full games are downloaded.
1. The xbox only has an 8Gb hardisk, which would mean about 1 or 2 games saved at a time.
2. The xbox DVD's are 8Gb discs (i think). On a standard 512k broadband connection that would still take about 83 days to download!
Connections will have to become really fast before full games are downloaded.
Hi all,
I work as a games developer and I can see 2 real issues with this.
First one is piracy, a game thats downloadable can't have any of the usual CD copy protection built in. This protection won't deter anyone serious of course, but publishers won't be happy about releasing software without it as they'll perceive a hit in sales (rightly or wrongly). You can get round this by using a product key type system, where the key is tied to your account and gets verified each time you play the game, but there is an ongoing cost to run the servers. Massively Multiplayer games make use of such a system and some of them are available to pay to download, they are subscription based so can afford the extra cost.
The second one is the shear number of different parties involved in getting a game out of the door, the people developing the game are often a completely different company from those publishing and so both of those will want their cut. If you're releasing a console game then you'll have to pay a set fee to the console manufacturer too. You'd have to get them to agree to a downloadable version and convince the publisher to pay for it! The actual cost of manufacture isn't that high, so the game probably wouldn't end up any cheaper if you download it than if you buy it from a decent online store especially as demand for a download will still be relatively light.
The other problem is simply that nobody has tried it yet, with games costing the amount they do to develop these days I don't think anyone wants to take the risk of doing it first. I guess thats the reason why we see PC games shipping on 2+ CDs instead of DVD too.
jsr, I think your maths might be a bit wonky as I think its between 1 and 2 days to download 8 gig
I work as a games developer and I can see 2 real issues with this.
First one is piracy, a game thats downloadable can't have any of the usual CD copy protection built in. This protection won't deter anyone serious of course, but publishers won't be happy about releasing software without it as they'll perceive a hit in sales (rightly or wrongly). You can get round this by using a product key type system, where the key is tied to your account and gets verified each time you play the game, but there is an ongoing cost to run the servers. Massively Multiplayer games make use of such a system and some of them are available to pay to download, they are subscription based so can afford the extra cost.
The second one is the shear number of different parties involved in getting a game out of the door, the people developing the game are often a completely different company from those publishing and so both of those will want their cut. If you're releasing a console game then you'll have to pay a set fee to the console manufacturer too. You'd have to get them to agree to a downloadable version and convince the publisher to pay for it! The actual cost of manufacture isn't that high, so the game probably wouldn't end up any cheaper if you download it than if you buy it from a decent online store especially as demand for a download will still be relatively light.
The other problem is simply that nobody has tried it yet, with games costing the amount they do to develop these days I don't think anyone wants to take the risk of doing it first. I guess thats the reason why we see PC games shipping on 2+ CDs instead of DVD too.
jsr, I think your maths might be a bit wonky as I think its between 1 and 2 days to download 8 gig
Good point about the piracy aspect, but lets face it the current "security" doesn't appear to be all that strong either, as you say.
Regarding the cost aspect, okay I guess it's naive to think that they'd actually release it cheaper However I'd have thought that the extra costs involved in doing a downloadable version would be offset by the fact that the software manufacturer would be able to charge the same as the high street store charges, thus pocketing the % that is normally consumed by the physical production, shipping, and of course the shop's own profit (out of interest, any idea how much of the total % a shop gets ? guess, 15-20% ?)
But like you say, it's probably cos no-one wants to be first ... I guess mass BB has only really just started to be around, so the market has only just opened up ... fingers x'd for the future ...
Regarding the cost aspect, okay I guess it's naive to think that they'd actually release it cheaper
However I'd have thought that the extra costs involved in doing a downloadable version would be offset by the fact that the software manufacturer would be able to charge the same as the high street store charges, thus pocketing the % that is normally consumed by the physical production, shipping, and of course the shop's own profit (out of interest, any idea how much of the total % a shop gets ? guess, 15-20% ?) But like you say, it's probably cos no-one wants to be first ... I guess mass BB has only really just started to be around, so the market has only just opened up ... fingers x'd for the future ...
I think Half-Life 2 is going to be downloadable.
I'm not at all keen on the idea for a number of reasons although I have used it once to download additioanl tracks for an ole racing game called eracer and that worked well, small file really, no documentation needed and dirt cheap (fiver)
1. A 650 mb CD might take between 3 and 8 hours on a half-meg connection depending on server load. (Compared to a 5 minute drive to DH World.)
2. Then if u want a hard copy you have to burn it yourself. (OK no big deal really)
3. Manuals etc would have to be printed off yourself and then you end up with a bunch of A4 sheets instead of a nice little manual.
Now it just seems far easier to order mail order and get all the sh1t in one nice box almost as quick as doing the above.
Could work for a limited number of games/expansion packs tho.
If you're really keen on downloading head over to www.neo-modus.com and get DC+......you can have all the games you want
I'm not at all keen on the idea for a number of reasons although I have used it once to download additioanl tracks for an ole racing game called eracer and that worked well, small file really, no documentation needed and dirt cheap (fiver)
1. A 650 mb CD might take between 3 and 8 hours on a half-meg connection depending on server load. (Compared to a 5 minute drive to DH World.)
2. Then if u want a hard copy you have to burn it yourself. (OK no big deal really)
3. Manuals etc would have to be printed off yourself and then you end up with a bunch of A4 sheets instead of a nice little manual.
Now it just seems far easier to order mail order and get all the sh1t in one nice box almost as quick as doing the above.
Could work for a limited number of games/expansion packs tho.
If you're really keen on downloading head over to www.neo-modus.com and get DC+......you can have all the games you want
I'm not sure how much the game retailers make, I'm just a programmer so pretty much all of this is an educated guess I'd say its more than 20%, just look at the discounts some of the online places can offer.
Of course the retailers might not be too happy about people making games available for download, which could hurt you long term when your next game comes out.
Half-Life 2 could well be available for download, Steam gives them a way to distribute it and secure their software.
I'd say its more than 20%, just look at the discounts some of the online places can offer. Of course the retailers might not be too happy about people making games available for download, which could hurt you long term when your next game comes out.
Half-Life 2 could well be available for download, Steam gives them a way to distribute it and secure their software.
1.LOL yes I sometimes take for granted that I live close to 2 big retail parks
3. If I buy something it's usually like a flightsim or something like Medieval Total War which comes with a superb manual.
4. Agree Kazaa is garbage, try direct connect from that link, it's the bomb but you have to share stuff as well the more you share the better hubs you can connect to.
3. If I buy something it's usually like a flightsim or something like Medieval Total War which comes with a superb manual.
4. Agree Kazaa is garbage, try direct connect from that link, it's the bomb but you have to share stuff as well the more you share the better hubs you can connect to.
d-man said:
I'm not sure how much the game retailers make, I'm just a programmer so pretty much all of this is an educated guess
Of course the retailers might not be too happy about people making games available for download, which could hurt you long term when your next game comes out.
Half-Life 2 could well be available for download, Steam gives them a way to distribute it and secure their software.
Steam is about as secure as a pros undewear.
outlaw said:
I'm not sure how much the game retailers make, I'm just a programmer so pretty much all of this is an educated guess
Of course the retailers might not be too happy about people making games available for download, which could hurt you long term when your next game comes out.
Half-Life 2 could well be available for download, Steam gives them a way to distribute it and secure their software.
Steam is about as secure as a pros undewear.
So about as secure as most other copy protection then?
I use BitTorrent for all my downloading needs btw - http://bitconjurer.org/BitTorrent/
yep bittorant is prity good.
but I get most of my stuff via FTP its much faster.
ps dont bother with the offichal bittoran client
theres much beter ones
http://home.quicknet.nl/qn/prive/romeria/howto.htm
plus the best place to get lateds torants is on IRC
>> Edited by outlaw on Thursday 6th November 06:54
but I get most of my stuff via FTP its much faster.
ps dont bother with the offichal bittoran client
theres much beter ones
http://home.quicknet.nl/qn/prive/romeria/howto.htm
plus the best place to get lateds torants is on IRC
>> Edited by outlaw on Thursday 6th November 06:54
d-man said:
Hi all,
I work as a games developer and I can see 2 real issues with this.
First one is piracy, a game thats downloadable can't have any of the usual CD copy protection built in.
Well, yes, but then there are situations like the frustrating week that I've just spent trying to find the game disk for Neverwinter Nights. I had it 10 days ago, I have the other two disks, box and manual, but I can't run the bloody game. The only alternative seems to be buying another copy.
Musicmatch has a successful activation code system, couldn't that work when applied to games?
Guys,
I actually comerciall launched a system in the UK to do this (when I used to work for a global rental company doing games & movies). It failed simply because even we were unable to finalise all of the very very very complex commercial & rights issues.
But the problem is not (any longer) technology or bandwidth - but one of pure momentum for current business models. Put simply there are lot of distribution & management businesses that would be out if the customer could get the content directly.
Trust me I fully support the independant (of developer) content aggregator model (even though I'm now in an entirely different digital industry) - if nothing else than how else would you know where to find a game? (and don't say google as the model doesn't work for trusted digital content locators). But the sheer fact is (much like PVR & VOD Vs TV advertising) that the commercial model is currently designed for this. Yes you will 100% see many more 'episodic' download games but for very different reasons than customer demand The reasons for download content are pure commercial business - e.g. less capital outlay until revenue returns (including less risk of duff games wasting developer resource), and longer hook in of the customer with more regular revenues.
There are companies pushing this but momentum (currently) is still in the physical space - too much squabbling in boardrooms trying to preserve high margins rather than going for new revenue streams (music industry???).
Rant over
I actually comerciall launched a system in the UK to do this (when I used to work for a global rental company doing games & movies). It failed simply because even we were unable to finalise all of the very very very complex commercial & rights issues.
But the problem is not (any longer) technology or bandwidth - but one of pure momentum for current business models. Put simply there are lot of distribution & management businesses that would be out if the customer could get the content directly.
Trust me I fully support the independant (of developer) content aggregator model (even though I'm now in an entirely different digital industry) - if nothing else than how else would you know where to find a game? (and don't say google as the model doesn't work for trusted digital content locators). But the sheer fact is (much like PVR & VOD Vs TV advertising) that the commercial model is currently designed for this. Yes you will 100% see many more 'episodic' download games but for very different reasons than customer demand
The reasons for download content are pure commercial business - e.g. less capital outlay until revenue returns (including less risk of duff games wasting developer resource), and longer hook in of the customer with more regular revenues. There are companies pushing this but momentum (currently) is still in the physical space - too much squabbling in boardrooms trying to preserve high margins rather than going for new revenue streams (music industry???).
Rant over
whoozit said:
Hi all,
I work as a games developer and I can see 2 real issues with this.
First one is piracy, a game thats downloadable can't have any of the usual CD copy protection built in.
Well, yes, but then there are situations like the frustrating week that I've just spent trying to find the game disk for Neverwinter Nights. I had it 10 days ago, I have the other two disks, box and manual, but I can't run the bloody game. The only alternative seems to be buying another copy.
Musicmatch has a successful activation code system, couldn't that work when applied to games?
go to games copy world and download the no cd patched exe and your problem will be sovled
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