I've been given a postcodeless number plate. Is this OK?
Discussion
GC8 said:
This, surely, is an issue for the supplier and not the person who owns the car. They need to have a compliant registration plate, and the supplier needs to mark it with their details.
I dont believe though, that a vehicles owner commits any offence by having an otherwise legal compliance-marked plate, which does not carry the suppliers name and postcode.
Yes it is indeed an issue for the supplier as I have already pointed out. Supply and use are dealt with by entirely different regulations. Whether it is one for the owner depends on whether he/she is also the driver and/or RK. The user normally in the frame is the driver but the RK can also be done. See The Road Vehicles (Display of Registration Marks) Regulations 2001 - Section 19(1).I dont believe though, that a vehicles owner commits any offence by having an otherwise legal compliance-marked plate, which does not carry the suppliers name and postcode.
jshell said:
WTF? You think that if it's legally spaced and correct font that you'll still get a 'tug' for no postcode.
Most probably not, but that entirely misses the point. The 'tug' is far more likely to be for something else. If plod is determined to find something with which to stick you on, an illegal number plate is manna from heaven. Provided by you and no effort on their part is required.agtlaw said:
the law is contained in The Road Vehicles (Display of Registration Marks) Regulations 2001. schedule 2 sets out the requirements for registration plates. http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2001/561/conten...
if the vehicle is registered and new registration plates fitted on or after 1.9.2001 then "the plate must comply with ... BS AU 145d". a like provision exists for vehicles registered on or after 1.1.73 and before 1.9.2001.
BS AU 145d:1998 is available from the BSI at a cost of £92! so, I don't have it but i found this:
The British Standard requires that a number plate must be marked with the following information: -
- The British Standard Number (currently BS AU 145d)
- The name, trade mark, or other means of identification of the manufacturer or component supplier. (The company who actually make the number plate.)
- The name and postcode of the supplying outlet. (The 'supplying outlet' is taken to mean a company whose business consists wholly or partly of selling number plates.)
- A non-reflective border and the Euro-symbol with the national identification letters are optional additions.
- There shall be no other markings or material contained on the number plate.
http://www.bnma.org/bsaua45d.htm
^^This^^if the vehicle is registered and new registration plates fitted on or after 1.9.2001 then "the plate must comply with ... BS AU 145d". a like provision exists for vehicles registered on or after 1.1.73 and before 1.9.2001.
BS AU 145d:1998 is available from the BSI at a cost of £92! so, I don't have it but i found this:
The British Standard requires that a number plate must be marked with the following information: -
- The British Standard Number (currently BS AU 145d)
- The name, trade mark, or other means of identification of the manufacturer or component supplier. (The company who actually make the number plate.)
- The name and postcode of the supplying outlet. (The 'supplying outlet' is taken to mean a company whose business consists wholly or partly of selling number plates.)
- A non-reflective border and the Euro-symbol with the national identification letters are optional additions.
- There shall be no other markings or material contained on the number plate.
http://www.bnma.org/bsaua45d.htm
The OP has already been given the link to that site but still isn't convinced. I think the only thing that will is if he buys a copy of the British Standard.
roachcoach said:
Fabulous. And if it shuts down, what then? Do you need to go get another plate?!
Yes. The need for a compliant plate remains either way. The supplier going belly up is irrelevant. You have no recourse and will have to stump up the cost of new ones. Life's a 
mrmr96 said:
Because obviously all the companies making 'show plates' will put their postcode on, won't they.
Now you're being silly. Show plates are not for road use so do not come within the display of registration marks regs. This was part of the extensive consultations that occurred when the regs were being drafted. 
Red Devil said:
mrmr96 said:
Because obviously all the companies making 'show plates' will put their postcode on, won't they.
Now you're being silly. Show plates are not for road use so do not come within the display of registration marks regs. This was part of the extensive consultations that occurred when the regs were being drafted. The idea of the postcode was to help put an end to "false plates".
OK, the theory.
In theory, if you wish to supply plates in the UK the plate must conform to various standards and include both a BSU number and the postcode of the supplier at the bottom.
Also the supplier has to make various checks to confirm the identity of the person requesting the plate - so the V5 and driving license should be shown (copies can be taken).
So, in theory every single plate supplier knows for certain the identity of the person buying the plate, has confirmed the person has the V5 for the vehicle in question and the final plate will display the postcode of the supplier.
As people have said - those that don't bother following the code of practice and/or supply "****** plates" won't bother putting their postcode on the plate.
No biggie, but it can be an MOT failure and could get you a tug.
OK, the theory.
In theory, if you wish to supply plates in the UK the plate must conform to various standards and include both a BSU number and the postcode of the supplier at the bottom.
Also the supplier has to make various checks to confirm the identity of the person requesting the plate - so the V5 and driving license should be shown (copies can be taken).
So, in theory every single plate supplier knows for certain the identity of the person buying the plate, has confirmed the person has the V5 for the vehicle in question and the final plate will display the postcode of the supplier.
As people have said - those that don't bother following the code of practice and/or supply "****** plates" won't bother putting their postcode on the plate.
No biggie, but it can be an MOT failure and could get you a tug.
I know for a fact that people get pulled for no postcode, cops were happily handing out FP's like smarties to people on a spot check.
People were also being told they had to prove the plate was 'pre regulations' for those that genuinely were.
I can't remember where it was but was posted on the SXOC forum.
People were also being told they had to prove the plate was 'pre regulations' for those that genuinely were.
I can't remember where it was but was posted on the SXOC forum.
stemll said:
Red Devil said:
mrmr96 said:
Because obviously all the companies making 'show plates' will put their postcode on, won't they.
Now you're being silly. Show plates are not for road use so do not come within the display of registration marks regs. This was part of the extensive consultations that occurred when the regs were being drafted. The above notwithstanding, why should the supplier be concerned as the plate will be sold with the disclaimer that it is not for road use (and often has that wording on the reverse). The supplier has not breached the relevant regulations. It is not their responsibility to police an end user's decision to disregard a different S.I.
There really isn't much to debate. There never will be a perfect answer but the present 'rules of engagement' are clear enough.
Bloody hell... I didn't expect this to start such a heated debate 
In the end I never got any official word one way or the other, because my main reason for doing that would have been to persuade a recalcitrant repairer to fix their work. As it was, there was no problem, and it was very unexciting. They gave me a new number plate, no questions asked. So I'd like to apologise to posterity, but for my money the road vehicles regulations are pretty convincing.
<-- this turned out to be unnecessary
The daft thing is, the writing is so tiny, and in so splindly a font, that you don't have to be that far away before it's hard to see whether it's even there. Still, I don't mind; as mcflurry, so do I not want my car advertising every last business it's ever patronised.
However, I can now sleep soundly at night, knowing if the Stasi come and cart me off to Guantanamo Bay, it won't be because of an illegal numberplate.
In the end I never got any official word one way or the other, because my main reason for doing that would have been to persuade a recalcitrant repairer to fix their work. As it was, there was no problem, and it was very unexciting. They gave me a new number plate, no questions asked. So I'd like to apologise to posterity, but for my money the road vehicles regulations are pretty convincing.
<-- this turned out to be unnecessaryThe daft thing is, the writing is so tiny, and in so splindly a font, that you don't have to be that far away before it's hard to see whether it's even there. Still, I don't mind; as mcflurry, so do I not want my car advertising every last business it's ever patronised.
However, I can now sleep soundly at night, knowing if the Stasi come and cart me off to Guantanamo Bay, it won't be because of an illegal numberplate.
Edited by to3m on Tuesday 30th August 16:05
to3m said:
Bloody hell... I didn't expect this to start such a heated debate
Why not? After all, this is PH.to3m said:
In the end I never got any official word one way or the other, because my main reason for doing that would have been to persuade a recalcitrant repairer to fix their work. As it was, there was no problem, and it was very unexciting. They gave me a new number plate, no questions asked.
I would have been surprised if there had been. They and/or their supplier have far too much to lose.to3m said:
So I'd like to apologise to posterity, but for my money the road vehicles regulations are pretty convincing.
No apology required. Virtually every thread on here expands beyond the original question. I don't know about convincing, but the regs are clear enough.This one isn't as straightforward as it looks from BS AU 145. That defines a complete and comprehensive standard for registration plates including materials, reflective properties, and what additional information (supplier's details etc) are required to meet the BS standard, as correctly referred to above.
BUT the regulations concerning what you fit to your car ( http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2001/561/conten... ) still don't require full compliance with the Standard. The only requirement is that it complies with the material and retro-reflective elements of the standard contained in section BS AU 145(d).
So technically, the garage os right that the lack of postcode isn't a problem. Of course, like most badly drafted laws, the chance of successfully arguing that point to plod, or a magistrate, is probably quite low without spending more in representation than a set of fully BS compliant plates from Halfrauds would cost (or nagging the garage to do so)
BUT the regulations concerning what you fit to your car ( http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2001/561/conten... ) still don't require full compliance with the Standard. The only requirement is that it complies with the material and retro-reflective elements of the standard contained in section BS AU 145(d).
So technically, the garage os right that the lack of postcode isn't a problem. Of course, like most badly drafted laws, the chance of successfully arguing that point to plod, or a magistrate, is probably quite low without spending more in representation than a set of fully BS compliant plates from Halfrauds would cost (or nagging the garage to do so)
Variomatic said:
This one isn't as straightforward as it looks from BS AU 145. That defines a complete and comprehensive standard for registration plates including materials, reflective properties, and what additional information (supplier's details etc) are required to meet the BS standard, as correctly referred to above.
BUT the regulations concerning what you fit to your car ( http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2001/561/conten... ) still don't require full compliance with the Standard. The only requirement is that it complies with the material and retro-reflective elements of the standard contained in section BS AU 145(d).
So technically, the garage os right that the lack of postcode isn't a problem. Of course, like most badly drafted laws, the chance of successfully arguing that point to plod, or a magistrate, is probably quite low without spending more in representation than a set of fully BS compliant plates from Halfrauds would cost (or nagging the garage to do so)
Having had another look, it appears that you are correct, the supplier identification is not required by the 2001 S.I. However, as well as the material and reflective specs, the display of the BS identifier (BS AU145d or BS AU 145a for the 1973-2001 optional specification) is also mandatory.BUT the regulations concerning what you fit to your car ( http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2001/561/conten... ) still don't require full compliance with the Standard. The only requirement is that it complies with the material and retro-reflective elements of the standard contained in section BS AU 145(d).
So technically, the garage os right that the lack of postcode isn't a problem. Of course, like most badly drafted laws, the chance of successfully arguing that point to plod, or a magistrate, is probably quite low without spending more in representation than a set of fully BS compliant plates from Halfrauds would cost (or nagging the garage to do so)
I wouldn't pay Halfrauds prices for legal plates though. I get mine from my local motor factors. Made up on the spot, so no taking a day off to await the postman or risk the misdelivery of a parcel.
Surely if the supplier of the plates isn't UK based, then they cannot have a £2500 fine enforced upon them? (I am thinking here of fancyplates.com, who are based in Eire and will make plates to lots of specifications, including UK ones - other suppliers are available).
What if the supplier doesn't have a postcode for this reason?
I think as long as they are the right size, right spacing and right font then there's no reason to worry - just chipping this in to ask what people think.
What if the supplier doesn't have a postcode for this reason?
I think as long as they are the right size, right spacing and right font then there's no reason to worry - just chipping this in to ask what people think.
Fish said:
Fancyplates supply a UK compliant plate with their postcode and name on including the BS number. They are FULLY compliant with UK law they just avoid the law on ID, hence they are very convenient for replacement plates.
Interesting, since I got a set of plates from them about 7 years ago with only the actual plate reg on it (no other text of any sort).I wonder if they've changed since then - or perhaps both are options? -
- "standard plates" versus
- "custom plates with standard font, standard spacing, standard size, etc"
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