Trailer towing:- B and B+E licence rules explained

Trailer towing:- B and B+E licence rules explained

Author
Discussion

BullyB

2,344 posts

246 months

Friday 14th February 2014
quotequote all
I found this thread helpful when deciding what to do myself so thought I would share my experiance.

I just did a B+E driving course which was two days training and the test first thing on the third day.
I actually really enjoyed myself and by the end of the two days was really comfortable driving everywhere. I think the course has not only showed me how to tow but improved my driving in general.

The test was just over an hour and I drove for about 50 minutes around town, villages, country lanes and dual carriageways.
I just chatted to the examiner all the time.

I highly recomend doing it if you have the time.

R0G

Original Poster:

4,984 posts

154 months

Friday 14th February 2014
quotequote all
BullyB said:
I found this thread helpful when deciding what to do myself so thought I would share my experiance.

I just did a B+E driving course which was two days training and the test first thing on the third day.
I actually really enjoyed myself and by the end of the two days was really comfortable driving everywhere. I think the course has not only showed me how to tow but improved my driving in general.

The test was just over an hour and I drove for about 50 minutes around town, villages, country lanes and dual carriageways.
I just chatted to the examiner all the time.

I highly recomend doing it if you have the time.
Did you notice/feel the 600 kgs of sand bags or the 1 x 1000 litre water IBC loaded in the trailer?

BullyB

2,344 posts

246 months

Friday 14th February 2014
quotequote all
Apparently the trailer had bags of sand in it to bring the total weight up to 2000Kg.
To be honest, the Nissan Nivarna pulled it no problem. I only felt it a couple of times when braking sharp and when driving over a really bumpy/pothole track. I did wheel spin a few times when pulling off.

mattydoh

796 posts

177 months

Thursday 20th March 2014
quotequote all
Can someone just check my maths for me - I am looking at towing a 205 GTI race car (Approx 750kg) on a braked single axle trailer plated for 1000kg load capacity and 1300kg gross weight on the back of a VW Bora 1.9TDI (130bhp + 1400kg kerbweight) with a braked towing limit of 1400kg and a gross vehicle weight of 1850kg.

I am on a category B licence and by my reckoning it should be ok - gross weight of 3150kg maximum and the trailer is under the cars towing limit (and should be at ~75% kerbweight assuming the trailer weighs 300kg). Can anyone just give this a check over?



Edited by mattydoh on Thursday 20th March 22:51

Zoobeef

6,004 posts

157 months

Thursday 20th March 2014
quotequote all
The 75% has nothing to do with it. You are under 3500kg so you are fine.

R0G

Original Poster:

4,984 posts

154 months

Friday 21st March 2014
quotequote all
mattydoh said:
Can someone just check my maths for me - I am looking at towing a 205 GTI race car (Approx 750kg) on a braked single axle trailer plated for 1000kg load capacity and 1300kg gross weight on the back of a VW Bora 1.9TDI (130bhp + 1400kg kerbweight) with a braked towing limit of 1400kg and a gross vehicle weight of 1850kg.

I am on a category B licence and by my reckoning it should be ok - gross weight of 3150kg maximum and the trailer is under the cars towing limit (and should be at ~75% kerbweight assuming the trailer weighs 300kg). Can anyone just give this a check over?
The important figures are 1850 GVW and 1300 plated MAM = 3150 and that is under the 3500 max for B towing so ok

Percentage weights are advice for caravans only due to their design

Nebby

268 posts

215 months

Wednesday 16th April 2014
quotequote all
This has been asked many times & i should be able to work it out from the info stated which is very informative, but need to double check.

Firstly i have a car license from 1987, if i had a Transit t330 rwd swb low roof van, gtw of 5300, gvw of 3300, ( payload of 1376 is possible but no where near that when i would be trailering ) kerb weight of 1924. Trailer would be something like a ( not yet purchased ) ifor williams lm146 beavertail gw 3500, unladen 725, what would be the most weight i could put on the trailer.

Also could i deliver cars/plant machinery & be paid or does it need a tacho & if i did need a tacho is it possible to fit.

Many thanks

R0G

Original Poster:

4,984 posts

154 months

Wednesday 16th April 2014
quotequote all
Nebby said:
This has been asked many times & i should be able to work it out from the info stated which is very informative, but need to double check.

Firstly i have a car license from 1987, if i had a Transit t330 rwd swb low roof van, gtw of 5300, gvw of 3300, ( payload of 1376 is possible but no where near that when i would be trailering ) kerb weight of 1924. Trailer would be something like a ( not yet purchased ) ifor williams lm146 beavertail gw 3500, unladen 725, what would be the most weight i could put on the trailer.

Also could i deliver cars/plant machinery & be paid or does it need a tacho & if i did need a tacho is it possible to fit.

Many thanks
You have a B+E licence
You have a vehicle with a GTW of 5300 and most probably a max listed towing capacity of 2000 (5300-3300=2000)
you have a trailer with a MAM of 3500
The lower figure between 3500 and 2000 is used as the maximum actual weight that can be used so that would be 2000
The trailer weighs 725 empty so that leaves a payload for the trailer of 1275 (2000-725=1275)

Needs a tacho if being used commercially with trailer and they can be fitted but quite costly to do


I suggest a visit to http://fordtransit.org/forum/index.php?sid=3f7a562... as those guys have been there and done it

Nebby

268 posts

215 months

Wednesday 16th April 2014
quotequote all
Thanks for that, so to be able to tow more would I need to look at a vehicle with a higher gtw but lower gvw, i.e something like a discovery & would I still need a tacho on that aswell being as it's a car?

Also is there a website that I can go on to check gvw & gtw weights for different vehicles.

Many thanks

Edited by Nebby on Wednesday 16th April 18:25

Super Slo Mo

5,368 posts

197 months

Wednesday 16th April 2014
quotequote all
You need a tacho as soon as your overall weight exceeds 3,500 kg's, and you're using the vehicle for commercial purposes, broadly speaking. There are a few exemptions from tacho rules, but they're very unlikely to apply to you.

R0G

Original Poster:

4,984 posts

154 months

Thursday 17th April 2014
quotequote all
Nebby said:
Thanks for that, so to be able to tow more would I need to look at a vehicle with a higher gtw but lower gvw, i.e something like a discovery & would I still need a tacho on that aswell being as it's a car?

Also is there a website that I can go on to check gvw & gtw weights for different vehicles.

Many thanks

Edited by Nebby on Wednesday 16th April 18:25
No website for that but google individual vehicles such as ..... ford mondeo kgs gvw towing capacity

Unless an exemption applies the total of the GVW plus trailer MAM being over 3500 invokes the tacho rules and not the actual weight
there is one exception - where the vehicle plated GTW is not more than 3500 because it is deemed that no matter what the total of the GVW/MAMs are the 3500 cannot be legally exceeded

Nebby

268 posts

215 months

Thursday 17th April 2014
quotequote all
So just to clarify i would need a tacho for a Discovery aswell which leads me to my earlier question can a tacho be fitted to any vehicle & is it worth it?, which would lead me to beleive is there any work out involving moving vehicles around the country as an independent using a trailer which is why most of them hitchhike?

Edited by Nebby on Thursday 17th April 11:47

R0G

Original Poster:

4,984 posts

154 months

Thursday 17th April 2014
quotequote all
Nebby said:
So just to clarify i would need a tacho for a Discovery aswell which leads me to my earlier question can a tacho be fitted to any vehicle & is it worth it?, which would lead me to beleive is there any work out involving moving vehicles around the country as an independent using a trailer which is why most of them hitchhike?

Edited by Nebby on Thursday 17th April 11:47
Do not know about that industry

If the vehicle GVW added to the trailer plated MAM total more than 3500 kgs and an exemption does not apply then it comes under tacho rules for commercial use

Nebby

268 posts

215 months

Thursday 17th April 2014
quotequote all
Which makes no sense really, I could drive a range rover with a trailer, combined weight of say 5-6000 kgs & drive as long as I like for personal reasons, bring in the fact that somebody's being paid for doing exactly the same & it's a different law, bonkers.

Super Slo Mo

5,368 posts

197 months

Thursday 17th April 2014
quotequote all
You're unlikely to want to drive for 9-10 hours per day, every day, as a private user. It's also quite fatiguing, day after day, which is why the rules are there.

There is an argument for making the rules the same for private individuals, but as virtually no one will drive for 9 hours per day privately (not taking breaks etc into account), towing a trailer or not, then there are no limits, although in practice, if you were to be involved in an accident and it was found that you'd driven for, say, 12 hours without much rest, you'd be at increased risk of prosecution (I would imagine something like driving without due consideration etc).

R0G

Original Poster:

4,984 posts

154 months

Thursday 17th April 2014
quotequote all
Nebby said:
Which makes no sense really, I could drive a range rover with a trailer, combined weight of say 5-6000 kgs & drive as long as I like for personal reasons, bring in the fact that somebody's being paid for doing exactly the same & it's a different law, bonkers.
Same for driving other things such as a 7.5 tonne LGV
Privately used as a personal horsebox = tacho exempt
Use it to deliver horses as part of a business = under tacho regs

It makes perfect sense to put the driver under regs when in a commercial situation but not to when doing things privately

adamfraser

567 posts

202 months

Sunday 27th April 2014
quotequote all
R0G - Can you have a look over this just to make sure I have this right..

Sitting B+E In the next month or so (Got my licence after cutoff) - so I can tow my track car to events etc.

Taken from the V5 - Audi A6 3.0TDI Le Mans Quattro

Maximum braked towing weight - 1900kg

Trailer - Ifor Williams CT136TA weight 495kg (taken from the site - haven't purchased yet)

Track car weighs around 1200kg.

On the V5, Max permissible mass of Audi 2,325kg and mass in service of 1820kg.

So is this the case, that even if I had total weight of trailer and car of 1700kg there or there abouts, I would still have weight in the vehicle for a small toolbox/maybe a set of wheels/tyres etc?

New to this and it's a bit of a minefield, any advice appreciated.


R0G

Original Poster:

4,984 posts

154 months

Sunday 27th April 2014
quotequote all
adamfraser said:
R0G - Can you have a look over this just to make sure I have this right..

Sitting B+E In the next month or so (Got my licence after cutoff) - so I can tow my track car to events etc.

Taken from the V5 - Audi A6 3.0TDI Le Mans Quattro

Maximum braked towing weight - 1900kg

Trailer - Ifor Williams CT136TA weight 495kg (taken from the site - haven't purchased yet)

Track car weighs around 1200kg.

On the V5, Max permissible mass of Audi 2,325kg and mass in service of 1820kg.

So is this the case, that even if I had total weight of trailer and car of 1700kg there or there abouts, I would still have weight in the vehicle for a small toolbox/maybe a set of wheels/tyres etc?

New to this and it's a bit of a minefield, any advice appreciated.
With a B+E licence ....
Max towing capacity = 1900
Trailer max MAM = 2000
Empty trailer 500 + load 1200 = 1700
200 within limit
Max you can load on trailer = 1400

The weight you put in the trailer has nothing to do with the weight you put in the car
The car has its own max weight = 2325
The trailer has its own max weight = 1900 due to max towing capacity of vehicle

Edited by R0G on Sunday 27th April 19:14

adamfraser

567 posts

202 months

Sunday 27th April 2014
quotequote all
Thank you very much - good to know i'm on the legal side smile

gigybeast

10 posts

141 months

Tuesday 13th May 2014
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Hi All.

I am on a B licence I pass my test in February 2011, I race a legend, if no one know what one looks like here is a picture of my car



They way around 500kg, is it possible for me to tow that on a trailer? of some sort, it will only be a trailer that can tow that car and nothing other.

Many thanks

Harry-Lee Wills