Is truck "elephant racing" against the law?

[CommanderJameson]

R0G said:

CommanderJameson said:

That's hardly fair.

If you can't make your overtake stick in a reasonable time, surely it's up to you to abandon it and return to lane 1?

Not according to the highway code - see my earlier post

I always think of that being "don't baulk another driver who's making an otherwise reasonable attempt to pass"; I don't think that passing another vehicle at a differential of <5mph is "reasonable".

[DIW35]

When I've seen two trucks alongside each other for miles, I always wonder why the guy being overtaken doesn't just lift off the throttle for a few seconds. In the overall scheme of things, it's not going to affect his journey to any great extent, but it will allow the overtaking truck to complete his maneouvre more easily and help to prevent a long queue of frustrated car drivers.

[onesickpuppy]

davepoth said:

It's a real shame they can't have some kind of "push to pass" option to legally defeat the governor and get past quickly, with the number of times it's pressed logged in the tacho to ensure people aren't naughty with it.

It's called 'pulling the fuse' .

Not legal, but certainly logged on the tacho I think?

[ferdyg]

KevinA3DSG32 said:

I thought in Germany the no LGVs in the overtaking lane is only where signed though?

The signs that you see say no HGV's overtaking between 6.00am and 8.00pm typically on dual carriageways to remind drivers of the law, 3 lane motorway is the same as here with no HGV' allowed in the 3rd lane.

Very few HGV's actually travel overnight in Germany.

R0G said:

That only works if all the LGVs can do the same rough speed but what about if just one can only manage a very slow sped due to a hill and all the others can manage the posted limit???

Better to have a time related law - say 1 minute to complete it - along with a law that states the one on the inside MUST give way

I thought that most HGV's are limited by speed limiter because they can easily exceed the 56mph speed limit even when fully laden and especially down hill?

Works fine in Germany, the law is the law and HGV's seem to abide by it, even British registered ones!!

Its a right pain when you cross back into the Netherlands from Germany as the lorries are then free to block both lanes on a dual carriageway for miles as one tries to overtake another.

[R0G]

ferdyg said:

I thought that most HGV's are limited by speed limiter because they can easily exceed the 56mph speed limit even when fully laden and especially down hill?

UPHILL - one doing 30 and the rest can do 50+ - are you saying they should all do 30? - or perhaps 20 if that is the speed of the slowest??

[HD Adam]

The simplest answer would be to remove the ridiculous 56mph limiters from HGV's.

I drive a lot in the USA where trucks are not limited and you never get held up like over here even though a lot of the Interstates are effectively dual carriageways.

You don't see any more accidents than in the UK and if a truck crashes at 56 or 70mph, it's carrying so much kinetic energy, the outcome is virtually the same.

[long time lurker]

If all trucks kept in the inside lane then nobody would be able to join or leave the motorway (trucks have it bad enoguh with cars darting inbetween them!)

[jmorgan]

HD Adam said:

The simplest answer would be to remove the ridiculous 56mph limiters from HGV's.

I drive a lot in the USA where trucks are not limited and you never get held up like over here even though a lot of the Interstates are effectively dual carriageways.

You don't see any more accidents than in the UK and if a truck crashes at 56 or 70mph, it's carrying so much kinetic energy, the outcome is virtually the same.

Never happen even if you did, cost of fuel and all that.

The US is a bit bigger than the UK as well with all that implies.

[Tyre Tread]

Whole problem inclding MLM's easily solved.

Travelling in inside lane free
Travelling in lane 2 free for 1 mile then 1p per mile therafter
Travelling in lane 3 or 4 free for half a mile then 10p per mile therafter

The mileage limit resets each time you move back into lane 1

Better still LGV's and LGV's as above with cars free in lane 2 but chargeable in lane 3

Downside is the tracking and its the thin end of the wedge for road pricing.

[jazzyjeff]

long time lurker said:

If all trucks kept in the inside lane then nobody would be able to join or leave the motorway (trucks have it bad enoguh with cars darting inbetween them!)

Sorry, don't understand that logic?!

[jmorgan]

They all bunch up.

[GC8]

In a minute, someone will state that all HGVs should be kept off the roads during the day, and only allowed out during the small hours, when theyre in bed; because theyre more important etc...

[HD Adam]

jmorgan said:

HD Adam said:

The simplest answer would be to remove the ridiculous 56mph limiters from HGV's.

I drive a lot in the USA where trucks are not limited and you never get held up like over here even though a lot of the Interstates are effectively dual carriageways.

You don't see any more accidents than in the UK and if a truck crashes at 56 or 70mph, it's carrying so much kinetic energy, the outcome is virtually the same.

Never happen even if you did, cost of fuel and all that.

The US is a bit bigger than the UK as well with all that implies.

Have to disagree on some of this.

If the limit was raised to 70mph, how many HGV's do you think you would find still doing 56 on the flat?

The size of the US comparatively makes little difference. 3 hours on the A14 from Harwich to the M6 is no different from 3 hours on the I-10 from Houston to Lafayette.
I get held up plenty on the A14 with elephant racing but never on the I-10 because trucks can do the speed limit.

I do agree with you that it will never happen because Euro legislation has us all in "won't somebody think of the children/Polar Bears/Speed Kills" mode.

[4keymonsta]

The problem is that there are now too many steering wheel attendants rather than actual drivers in charge of these things. It used to be that if another lorry made a move to overtake you, you would let off of the pedal for half a second. Everyone gave eachover space, let other artics out at junctions and held back if you saw someone struggling to get out on a roundabout. Now there is a st load of driver hire monkeys out there who are far from proffesional and drive like they are in a car at rush hour doing the school run, noone gets any space. If you see an elephant race it is the one on the left that is at fault, throw stuff at them when you eventually pass. Also it is not just lorry drivers, I moved to overtake a car on a DC today travelling atleast 5mph faster than them and just as they bacame level with my back wheels they must have thought 'oh a lorrys overtaking me, I must be driving too slow I'll speed up' and matched my speed.. for 2 miles with a line of cars behind me.. until i just got bored of them, indicated and nearly took their nose off as I cut across them.

[ferdyg]

R0G said:

ferdyg said:

I thought that most HGV's are limited by speed limiter because they can easily exceed the 56mph speed limit even when fully laden and especially down hill?

UPHILL - one doing 30 and the rest can do 50+ - are you saying they should all do 30? - or perhaps 20 if that is the speed of the slowest??

when was the last time you were behind a HGV struggling to do 30mph uphill on a dual carriageway?

and I'm not being funny but if they cannot manage 56mph going up a uphill stretch of dual carriageway then maybe they should not be on a dual carriageway?

Abnormally wide or heavy loads are normally escorted and in these circumstances and this is a different situation entirely.

My point was that it works in Germany so how come it cannot work over here? British HGV's abide with the law over there.

[GC8]

4keymonsta said:

The problem is that there are now too many steering wheel attendants rather than actual drivers in charge of these things.

Certainly - and when you factor in that this is doubly the case with car/van drivers, consider the associated crap that they have to deal with and the greatly increased pressure from most operators (as well as Brussels), even the better drivers can become bloody-minded.

I do, of course, realise that there is no room for anyone speaking sense on threads like this, so will desist...

[SVTRick]

Adam The Trucker

As owner of some big HGV / Equipment I think the HGV limit should be graduated according to size & weight considering the legal max speed is 60mph
Coaches are limited to 62 WTF is that about !!

Artics 54
Any HGV towing either draw bar or upto 3.5 ton trailer 54
Rigid up to 7.5 ton MGVW 60
Rigid up to 20 ton MGVW 58
Rigid up to 32 ton MGVW 56

All commercial vans & pickups over 2.5 ton MGVW limited to 60
And banned from outside lane of motorways three lanes or more.

Busses & Coaches all limited regardless of size to 60

This may go some way in reducing the prolonged over taking time for larger vehicles.

Inconsiderate drivers who hog the middle lane or speed up when a truck attempts to pass, pull in
causing a truck to take avoiding action should have their arses reamed with the bleached working end of a traditional bristle bog brush.....

[jmorgan]

HD Adam said:

Have to disagree on some of this.

If the limit was raised to 70mph, how many HGV's do you think you would find still doing 56 on the flat?

The size of the US comparatively makes little difference. 3 hours on the A14 from Harwich to the M6 is no different from 3 hours on the I-10 from Houston to Lafayette.
I get held up plenty on the A14 with elephant racing but never on the I-10 because trucks can do the speed limit.

I do agree with you that it will never happen because Euro legislation has us all in "won't somebody think of the children/Polar Bears/Speed Kills" mode.

The owners would limit it, as they are doing now in some cases.

The US is bigger (obviously, not meaning to teach granny to suck eggs), bigger roads, less chances of bunching up as we have in the UK on a small road network in comparison. I would think? I do not know what the US is like for deliveries but we tend to live on just in time.

[Panda76]

ferdyg said:

R0G said:

ferdyg said:

I thought that most HGV's are limited by speed limiter because they can easily exceed the 56mph speed limit even when fully laden and especially down hill?

UPHILL - one doing 30 and the rest can do 50+ - are you saying they should all do 30? - or perhaps 20 if that is the speed of the slowest??

when was the last time you were behind a HGV struggling to do 30mph uphill on a dual carriageway?

and I'm not being funny but if they cannot manage 56mph going up a uphill stretch of dual carriageway then maybe they should not be on a dual carriageway?

Abnormally wide or heavy loads are normally escorted and in these circumstances and this is a different situation entirely.

My point was that it works in Germany so how come it cannot work over here? British HGV's abide with the law over there.

Follow me N/B up the ridgeway when I,m pulling a gross 44t after loading at Alton brewery.Even with a 500 bhp unit I will be lucky to stay above 30-35 mph.
Don't be so naive as to say if they can't do 56 mph then they shouldn't be on a dual.They are breaking the law anyway heres why:

As it is no-one has spotted the blatantly obvious including Rog which surprises me.
The speed limit for a HGV on a dual is 50 mph.If they all ran to 50 mph they wouldn't be having elephant races.If an HGV was to creep up on another then they could use the extra 6mph to slip past create some distance and then drop back down to 50mph.
Unless the police are willing to strictly enforce the 50 mph then this problem will carry on.It carries on beacause some HGV drivers are pig thick and attempt overtakes they can barely carry out.It saves them no time at all.There is nothing in it.If the trucks are elephant racing it's because they are sitting on the limiter (obviously)
It would be a help if the driver in lane 1 would lift a little and aid the overtaker but a lot don't because they are also pig thick and ignorant.

As it is it's better for the driver in lane 1 to lift and get rid of them.The sight of some moron on the motorway in my mirror crawling like a snail up my trailer gets on my tits.They are also distracting as I have to keep more of an eye on them to see if they can actually drive in a straight line and not wander into me more than I do whats going on up front.

It's no wonder folk call lorry drivers wkers,thats because the majority are.

Edited by Panda76 on Thursday 23 February 18:14

[shambolic]

Was stuck behind a post office large trailer yesterday on the M8 in the 3rd lane for 3 miles yesterday. Is this not illegal?