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Cheburator mk2
Original Poster
1,311 posts
68 months
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Good Morning PH,
May seem like an odd question at first glance. We have friends visiting from Europe for the long weekend and wanted to go somewhere close-buy outside of London. Our friends have thier 2yrs old with them, and we also have a 2yrs old daughter. My M5 Touring says it can carry 4 passengers + a driver. Would I be breaking the law if we have myself as a driver, another adult in the passenger seat, the two mothers and the two 2yr old babies on their mothers' laps in the back?
Many thanks in advance
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Andehh
835 posts
75 months
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You don't wanna do that mate, IIRC 2 years olds should be in special children's seats? - which would exacerbate your problem even more as you'll struggle to fit two child seats and a middle passenger in!
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hornetrider
40,790 posts
74 months
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Children have to be restrained, so yes that is highly unadvisable.
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ralphrj
886 posts
60 months
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Cheburator mk2 said: Would I be breaking the law if we have myself as a driver, another adult in the passenger seat, the two mothers and the two 2yr old babies on their mothers' laps in the back? Yes. http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/TravelAndTransport/Hig...Highway Code said: The driver MUST ensure that all children under 14 years of age in cars, vans and other goods vehicles wear seat belts or sit in an approved child restraint where required (see table above). If a child is under 1.35 metres (approx 4 feet 5 inches) tall, a baby seat, child seat, booster seat or booster cushion MUST be used suitable for the child’s weight and fitted to the manufacturer’s instructions.
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TPS
1,562 posts
82 months
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Cheburator mk2 said: Good Morning PH,
May seem like an odd question at first glance. We have friends visiting from Europe for the long weekend and wanted to go somewhere close-buy outside of London. Our friends have thier 2yrs old with them, and we also have a 2yrs old daughter. My M5 Touring says it can carry 4 passengers + a driver. Would I be breaking the law if we have myself as a driver, another adult in the passenger seat, the two mothers and the two 2yr old babies on their mothers' laps in the back?
Many thanks in advance No it does not seem like an odd question....it seems like a totally stupid question. One i quite frankly can not believe you even thought for a minute would be a good idea. In the event of an accident what do you think will happen to the children? Is it April fools day anyone?
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pitmansboots
1,058 posts
56 months
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Cheburator mk2 said: Good Morning PH,
May seem like an odd question at first glance. We have friends visiting from Europe for the long weekend and wanted to go somewhere close-buy outside of London. Our friends have thier 2yrs old with them, and we also have a 2yrs old daughter. My M5 Touring says it can carry 4 passengers + a driver. Would I be breaking the law if we have myself as a driver, another adult in the passenger seat, the two mothers and the two 2yr old babies on their mothers' laps in the back?
Many thanks in advance There's your sign! You have answered your own question. If you have trouble with numbers just think of teh '5' in 5-series as the number of people allowed in your vehicle. Whatever you do don't get a 7-series or that will just cause you trouble. I recommend hiring a people carrier that has room for 7 people.
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Cheburator mk2
Original Poster
1,311 posts
68 months
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TPS said: No it does not seem like an odd question....it seems like a totally stupid question.
One i quite frankly can not believe you even thought for a minute would be a good idea.
In the event of an accident what do you think will happen to the children?
Is it April fools day anyone? Jesus, I wonder how I managed to survive my childhood. Praise the Lord! It is a miracle. I presume I should have bought a Micra too, since every time my M5 goes over 70mph I should spotaneously combust. PistonHeads, being a smart arse matters! The reason I asked the question is that I got confused by the exemption which allows taxis to carry children without child seats. I did not realise it only applies to taxis and not private vehicles. Reading the Highway Code did not appear to be on my hobby list last time I checked. Thanks to those who provided informative answers. Those who thought were really smart, get a life. P.S. My little one travels in her own Recaro all the time, thus, yes, I am thinking about her safety...
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supersport
1,563 posts
96 months
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I accidentally saw a bit of one of those stupid Police driving squad camera action programmes the other day, and for once somebody actually got done for a crime, in fact the police man was livid at the complete stupidity of the driver, who co-incidentally was driving a BMW.
He had two mums in the back with toddlers on their laps no belts for the kids and he was driving in the snow. The halfwit driver said "well I knew it was dangerous so I drove slower and more carefully".
In the case of an accident where do you think the children would end up and in how many peaces would they be in once they went through the windscreen, possibly taking your head off in the process?
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kaf
323 posts
16 months
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Cheburator mk2 said: Jesus, I wonder how I managed to survive my childhood. Praise the Lord! It is a miracle. They used to send kids in chimneys as well, but someone seemed to think that was a bad idea as well.
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rohrl
3,725 posts
14 months
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Devil2575
4,425 posts
57 months
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Was this a serious question!?
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Cheburator mk2
Original Poster
1,311 posts
68 months
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rohrl said: I think I saw 13 people in Lada once... And no, there were not trying to set a record, just going drinking...
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Guyr
1,887 posts
151 months
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supersport said: He had two mums in the back with toddlers on their laps no belts for the kids and he was driving in the snow. The halfwit driver said "well I knew it was dangerous so I drove slower and more carefully".
In the case of an accident where do you think the children would end up and in how many peaces would they be in once they went through the windscreen, possibly taking your head off in the process? How would they go through a windscreen whilst travelling slowly in snow? Whereas if they had been travelling in a train/taxi/coach/minibus, they would have no seatbelts at all of course. I'm all for using belts for everyone, but the fact is also there are many situations where for reasons of practicality it doesn't happen and it just just a risk in life. I'm a firm believer that risks should be minimised, but cannot not eliminated, otherwise we all learn no responsibility and we'd have no cars/planes/bikes (people die from those), no alcohol, fags, red-meat, , kebabs, sweets (all very dangerous etc). Oh and electricity - that kills people as well and should be banned. And rivers......
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long time lurker
229 posts
19 months
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Guyr said: How would they go through a windscreen whilst travelling slowly in snow?
Whereas if they had been travelling in a train/taxi/coach/minibus, they would have no seatbelts at all of course. How fast do you need to go (or should I say stop) to hit a windscreen? More so an unbelted child.. and you have to wear seat belts where fitted by law, so with taxi's, coaches and minibuses you need to buckle up (I've never heard anyone get a fine but I guess it could happen? an following some coach crashes, the unbelted people are the one's who got injured most!).. and a train is unlikely to come to a quick enough stop to need them/ for them to work?
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TVR1
2,930 posts
94 months
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The OP, earlier........  
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Snowboy
3,221 posts
20 months
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Legally, you can’t do it.
I think there might be some law about mothers being allowed to hold a small baby, so long as it’s attached to mum with some sort of sling. But I might be getting confused with airline laws/rules.
If you have a carefree attitude to the law I suppose you could all fit in.
However, for the sake of safety it might be safer to put the extra adults in the estate boot.
All things considered it’s probably much safer for everyone to put an extra adult in the boot than overcrowd the back seats.
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TVR1
2,930 posts
94 months
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Snowboy said: All things considered it’s probably much safer for everyone to put an extra adult in the boot than overcrowd the back seats.  Indeed and to add, I always thought motor manufacturers have missed a trick with front and rear bumpers... Why not use the hollow cavities in them to fit auxiliary fuel tanks, just like they have in aeroplane wings? It would give so much extra space in the boot!
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Cheburator mk2
Original Poster
1,311 posts
68 months
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Snowboy said: Legally, you can’t do it.
I think there might be some law about mothers being allowed to hold a small baby, so long as it’s attached to mum with some sort of sling. But I might be getting confused with airline laws/rules.
If you have a carefree attitude to the law I suppose you could all fit in.
However, for the sake of safety it might be safer to put the extra adults in the estate boot.
All things considered it’s probably much safer for everyone to put an extra adult in the boot than overcrowd the back seats. Thanks for the informative response. I have ditched the idea since it is illegal in any of its variations, and while I think about H&S like a child of the 1970s, I am not completely insane. I think I would look into using the train instead. Mods, please lock this thread. I have been shown the error of my evil ways by the 'elf and safety brigade, thus there would not be any 2yrs olds flying through the windscreen of my Touring come the Diamond Jubilee weekend.
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StottyZr
4,087 posts
32 months
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Cheburator mk2 said: Mods, please lock this thread. I have been shown the error of my evil ways by the 'elf and safety brigade, thus there would not be any 2yrs olds flying through the windscreen of my Touring come the Diamond Jubilee weekend. To be fair, I'm not exactly a keen member of the health and safety brigade, and I thought your question was really stupid.
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pitmansboots
1,058 posts
56 months
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Cheburator mk2 said: Thanks for the informative response. I have ditched the idea since it is illegal in any of its variations, and while I think about H&S like a child of the 1970s, I am not completely insane. I think I would look into using the train instead.
Mods, please lock this thread. I have been shown the error of my evil ways by the 'elf and safety brigade, thus there would not be any 2yrs olds flying through the windscreen of my Touring come the Diamond Jubilee weekend. If you are getting the train, consider a people carrier hire when you get over there. I had one last year; flew easy jet and walked to the hire car place at the airport; no bother.
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