Farmers shooting dogs !
Discussion
wildcat45 said:
And who the hell are you to dispense justice without discussion?
I think you have just backed up my point that a lot of people out in the country with guns really ought not to be allowed them.
Put what you said into another context. A bloke living in London or Birmingham. An attitude to guns like that could rightly lead you to your maker at the hands of Police.
Jesus with that attitude, I should get in my car, cruise the local estate and go picking off or at least beating up the chavs who my wifes friend has CCTV of nicking her new Fiat 500 last week.
Having seen the footage, I reckon after a day or two I could find and ID them.
Hows about a bit of justice without discussion there?
Its silly people like you who give farmers the largely undeserved "Get orf moy laand" reputation a lot of city folk buy in to.
I wrote this on the assumption you weren't writing tongue in cheek so to speak. If not, I really think someone should look at your suitability to hold a firarms license,
Dogs are not equal to people, but otherwise, great argument I think you have just backed up my point that a lot of people out in the country with guns really ought not to be allowed them.
Put what you said into another context. A bloke living in London or Birmingham. An attitude to guns like that could rightly lead you to your maker at the hands of Police.
Jesus with that attitude, I should get in my car, cruise the local estate and go picking off or at least beating up the chavs who my wifes friend has CCTV of nicking her new Fiat 500 last week.
Having seen the footage, I reckon after a day or two I could find and ID them.
Hows about a bit of justice without discussion there?
Its silly people like you who give farmers the largely undeserved "Get orf moy laand" reputation a lot of city folk buy in to.
I wrote this on the assumption you weren't writing tongue in cheek so to speak. If not, I really think someone should look at your suitability to hold a firarms license,
Edited by wildcat45 on Saturday 6th October 05:12
wildcat45 said:
Very unpleasant business all round.
Ultimately it shouldn't happen, and dogs should be kept under contol. But to farmers, its a business loss. How much is a sheep worth? You kill them in the end when you've had use from them. Nothing wrong with that.
Farming is just a business.
There is a fault with the law here. Dogs should be kept under control, and if dangerous, destroyed Destroyed by a vet with an overdose of Ketamine, rather than some angry bumpkin with a 12 bore.
^^^agree, upon request i paid the farmer £200, i have since been told the market price for the sheep was about £40. Although that day i lost a loveable pet, i don't consider my dog to be dangerous, she acted on instint, almost a game, that she had no self control over. I know that on the day, had i had a gun, then i would have shot my dog, in order to try to save the sheep.Ultimately it shouldn't happen, and dogs should be kept under contol. But to farmers, its a business loss. How much is a sheep worth? You kill them in the end when you've had use from them. Nothing wrong with that.
Farming is just a business.
There is a fault with the law here. Dogs should be kept under control, and if dangerous, destroyed Destroyed by a vet with an overdose of Ketamine, rather than some angry bumpkin with a 12 bore.
Edited by wildcat45 on Saturday 6th October 02:40
We weren't there and don't know the facts, so all we say is speculation and guessing on what we would do in the same situation.
But in fairness to the farmer at what point does he shoot? you have 2 dogs running loose near you livestock, do you wait for them to kill one before you shoot? or 2? or 3? phoning the rspca is all well and good but what do you expect him to do? wait until the dogs have killed/maimed half the flock before shooting the dogs?
I doubt he shot them for fun.
But in fairness to the farmer at what point does he shoot? you have 2 dogs running loose near you livestock, do you wait for them to kill one before you shoot? or 2? or 3? phoning the rspca is all well and good but what do you expect him to do? wait until the dogs have killed/maimed half the flock before shooting the dogs?
I doubt he shot them for fun.
LiveSTOCK
A business.
No one but the Mafia should be resorting to guns to protect their business. (They shouldn't either but I aint going to be the one to stop them)
Its only momey in the end.
The t
t of a farmer who killed your dog got a good deal, and fair play to you for your self control.
A business.
No one but the Mafia should be resorting to guns to protect their business. (They shouldn't either but I aint going to be the one to stop them)
Its only momey in the end.
The t
t of a farmer who killed your dog got a good deal, and fair play to you for your self control. Wings said:
Never in my wildest thoughts would i have ever thought that my GSD would have harmed another animal
Really? Of all the stupid things I've ever read on here, and there's been a lot of them, that one's near the top of the pile.wildcat45 said:
There is a fault with the law here. Dogs should be kept under control, and if dangerous, destroyed Destroyed by a vet with an overdose of Ketamine, rather than some angry bumpkin with a 12 bore.
That's a nice idea, but how many sheep could the dog/s in question have killed in the time it takes the vet to get to the scene? Imagine we're talking about a hill farm in deepest Wales or Scotland on a Sunday evening - it could be two hours before the dog could be put down, and in the meantime the farmer could have lost a massive amount of livestock.I'm a dog owner, but to me if the person responsible for a dog fails in their duty and allows it to get itself into a field and attack livestock then the farmer should have the right to defend his animals.
Question for the dog owners - put yourself in the farmer's boots but imagine that it was your dog that was being savaged - would you stand by and watch, or would you shoot the other dog? I know what I'd do.
It may be different in Scotland with the right to roam.
Farmers should if grazing animals in enclised fields take steps to make those fields secure. Post warnings about the condquences of dog worrying. Can they get insurance?
Farm animals are not pets. If another dog was savinging my dog then yes I would be angry. My motivation to remedy the situation would not be impending financial loss. That is the farmer's motivation.
We are not in some 3rd world state. If problems were sorted with guns we'd be in a terrible place.
For one my FIL's back garden woud be littered with dead Herons foxes and moggies.
Farmers should if grazing animals in enclised fields take steps to make those fields secure. Post warnings about the condquences of dog worrying. Can they get insurance?
Farm animals are not pets. If another dog was savinging my dog then yes I would be angry. My motivation to remedy the situation would not be impending financial loss. That is the farmer's motivation.
We are not in some 3rd world state. If problems were sorted with guns we'd be in a terrible place.
For one my FIL's back garden woud be littered with dead Herons foxes and moggies.
Rouleur said:
Question for the dog owners - put yourself in the farmer's boots but imagine that it was your dog that was being savaged - would you stand by and watch, or would you shoot the other dog? I know what I'd do.
I don't have the right to shoot a dog attacking my dogs. Nor would I do so. I would separate the dogs. I would not pay for the vet treatment to the other dog though.......I think everyone is missing one very valid point if your dog is on a lead it won't get shot. To all those who say farmers shouldn't be allowed to shoot dogs it is equal that those dogs should not be out of control near livestock. As for keeping livestock in secure fields that's hilarious we would see the countryside filled with 10 foot high walls and how would the animals get in there in the first place as a gate would be too easy to open or climb over!
Edited by guns80 on Saturday 6th October 11:25
eldar said:
You keep sheep in your garden?
We were going to have one or two but there were too many regulations to bother with. Had to pay a guy to strim the lawn instead.....ETA: She also wants chickens... So livestock.
BUT as another poster has said, what other business can shoot a dog on their land?
jatopack said:
It is a well known law and fact - "if dogs worry livestock" - if caught = "dead dog".... every dog owner would say "never mine" - and that is why justice is dispensed without discussion.
A very odd and troubling choice of words. You have a statutory defence against prosecution for shooting the dog if you do so to protect your animals. You do not have a right to dispense summary "justice" upon the owner or the animal.otolith said:
A very odd and troubling choice of words. You have a statutory defence against prosecution for shooting the dog if you do so to protect your animals. You do not have a right to dispense summary "justice" upon the owner or the animal.
Thats why I worry that this guy has access to fire arms. wildcat45 said:
Farmers should if grazing animals in enclised fields take steps to make those fields secure. Post warnings about the condquences of dog worrying. Can they get insurance?
Farm animals are not pets.
It is quite easy to keep farm animals in with 2 strands of (decent) electric fencing. Taking into account how many farm animals grazing in fields, the number that end up where they are not supposed to is very small. I put it to the jury, that most instances of animals not being where they should involve horses and incompetent horsey people. Farm animals are not pets.
The owners of animals are supposed to fence their animals in, which is fair enough. I'm not sure of an obligation to fence your dog out. That would be like people with houses backing onto grazing land being responsible for keeping the farm animals out of their gardens.
Farm animals are not pets, you are right and a lot end up getting killed. But the object of the exercise of keeping livestock for slaughter is to have them born alive, rear them until they are the correct weight and condition for the market, then sending them to slaughter to be killed humanely. Not to have the poor buggers chased around a field until the are exhausted, upsetting the whole flock/herd, then killing a few and half eating one.
It is quite easy to avoid having your dog shot, just stick to the foot paths and keep Fido on a lead. You get a walk, so does Fido and flossy and her friends can eat their grass in peace. Everyone is happy.
It is very unfortunate for the dogs in the OP to have escaped and been shot. The owners did the right thing by having them in a kennels, but the kennels didn't do their job properly and the owners should take it up with them, not the farmer.
BTW, hello spelling police, have I made any mistakes?
so farmer lets dog kill 20 sheep, at £40 for example, then calls police, police come out, farmer has to prove that dog killed the sheep, that the owner owns the dog, then has to chase the owner through the courts to get £800, which may take a considerable amount of time to be heard and depending on the type of person it is, a considerable amount of time to pay back. Or shoot the dog. I know which one I would chose.
likewise If I saw someone going to key my car etc, I'd weigh up scaring them away/defending myself and the associated risks vs trying to get the police to find the person once they ran off, then be out of pocket to the insurance.
likewise If I saw someone going to key my car etc, I'd weigh up scaring them away/defending myself and the associated risks vs trying to get the police to find the person once they ran off, then be out of pocket to the insurance.
never really got this business where a farmer can blow someones dog to bits, because its worrying cattle worth ££££'s. I own greyhounds, some of which are worth tens of thousands of pounds, if a dog comes onto my land and starts "worrying" one of the greyhounds, I have no legal right to shoot the dog, even though my financial loss would be far in excess of the farmers.
Why do farmers have special dispensation?
You'd not use a gun to scare a car vandal off.
If the dog is at fault then yes, persue tem through the courts, take them for what they owe you plus compensation.
We do live in a civilised world. Resorting to guns to speed up the process is the world of gangsters and is simply not acceptable.
If the dog is at fault then yes, persue tem through the courts, take them for what they owe you plus compensation.
We do live in a civilised world. Resorting to guns to speed up the process is the world of gangsters and is simply not acceptable.
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