Car Exhaust Noise
Discussion
Monkey boy 1 said:
A bit more news on the verdict. Just been back to the court to ask them what the Absolute Discharge actually means. Their answer was ' No further action taken, no criminal record as there was no case to answer' I also asked if it would affect my insurance and they said that is wouldn't as there was no proper case to answer. The Monkey Boy is free.
Not according to the CPS website:Absolute discharge - no further action is taken, since either the offence was very minor, or the court considers that the experience has been enough of a deterrent. The offender will receive a criminal record.
http://www.cps.gov.uk/victims_witnesses/go...sente...
However as per Powers of Criminal Courts (Sentencing) Act 2000: http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2000/6/part/II
Subject to subsection (2) below, a conviction of an offence for which an order is made under section 12 above discharging the offender absolutely or conditionally shall be deemed not to be a conviction for any purpose other than the purposes of the proceedings in which the order is made and of any subsequent proceedings which may be taken against the offender under section 13 above.
This suggests for the purposes of applying for car insurance that it is not a conviction and thus does not need to be declared (sec 13 refers to conditional discharges so does not apply here).
Subject to subsection (2) below, a conviction of an offence for which an order is made under section 12 above discharging the offender absolutely or conditionally shall be deemed not to be a conviction for any purpose other than the purposes of the proceedings in which the order is made and of any subsequent proceedings which may be taken against the offender under section 13 above.
This suggests for the purposes of applying for car insurance that it is not a conviction and thus does not need to be declared (sec 13 refers to conditional discharges so does not apply here).
https://essex.police.uk/getmedia/5a4aaf2f-105f-419...
And the noise level limit is 80dB regardless of model.
Essex Police said:
3.1 Legislation
Operation of this procedure relies on the use of 2 offences:
? Silencer/ exhaust system altered to increase noise – Reg. 54(2) The Road
Vehicles (Construction & Use) Regulations 1986;
? Avoidance of excessive noise – Reg. 97 The Road Vehicles (Construction & Use)
Regulations 1986.
In summary, vehicle exhausts must not be altered or replaced in a manner which
increases the noise above that emitted by the type approved exhaust fitted by the
manufacturer.
In any case the sound emitted by an exhaust fitted to a standard car must not exceed
80dB. Some other vehicles, such as those with differing engine power e.g. HGVs,
PCVs, motorcycles, etc. have higher limits up to 89dB
Operation of this procedure relies on the use of 2 offences:
? Silencer/ exhaust system altered to increase noise – Reg. 54(2) The Road
Vehicles (Construction & Use) Regulations 1986;
? Avoidance of excessive noise – Reg. 97 The Road Vehicles (Construction & Use)
Regulations 1986.
In summary, vehicle exhausts must not be altered or replaced in a manner which
increases the noise above that emitted by the type approved exhaust fitted by the
manufacturer.
In any case the sound emitted by an exhaust fitted to a standard car must not exceed
80dB. Some other vehicles, such as those with differing engine power e.g. HGVs,
PCVs, motorcycles, etc. have higher limits up to 89dB
Essex Police said:
3.2 Identification of Offences
All new vehicles sold in this country comply with legal requirements in relation to
exhaust noise and you cannot purchase one which has an exhaust louder than
permitted. This includes cars which are traditionally marketed towards the ‘cruiser’
customer base such as ST, VXR and GT variations of popular models. However
some dealers will offer a dealer fit option subsequent to manufacture of an exhaust
which exceeds maximum levels there will be a clear disclaimer within the paperwork
of ‘for track use only’ or ‘not for use on public roads’ etc. in such circumstances.
So Essex police include aftermarket exhausts as a modification, not merely drilling holes yourself.All new vehicles sold in this country comply with legal requirements in relation to
exhaust noise and you cannot purchase one which has an exhaust louder than
permitted. This includes cars which are traditionally marketed towards the ‘cruiser’
customer base such as ST, VXR and GT variations of popular models. However
some dealers will offer a dealer fit option subsequent to manufacture of an exhaust
which exceeds maximum levels there will be a clear disclaimer within the paperwork
of ‘for track use only’ or ‘not for use on public roads’ etc. in such circumstances.
And the noise level limit is 80dB regardless of model.
Edited by faa77 on Sunday 18th August 19:08
ging84 said:
faa77 said:
So Essex police include aftermarket exhausts as a modification, not merely drilling holes yourself.
And the noise level limit is 80dB regardless of model.
80 is absurd, none of my cars pass that according to the v5s, yet they were type approved and given a registration.And the noise level limit is 80dB regardless of model.
Wow, Holy Thread revival.
The problem the Police have is not understanding the Construction & Use regulations.
The 80dB limit (I thought it was 82, but who knows), anyway the 80 something test is actually a 30mph drive by test with the microphones set 9m from the track centre line and Doplar radar thrown in to the equation.
The ISO5130 test which most Police use is a static procedure which doesn't actually have a resultant value for the test.
99dB is acceptable for an SVA vehicle. and is used for the base test for many track circuits tests.
When I went to court over a noisy exhaust (92dB I think it was) the Police tested it at the wrong RPM. If the car did not have a working rev counter then they check the car at tickover. Mine was 74dB.
If in doubt really question the Police on how they test the vehicle, where they test it and at what RPM.
Obviously if you are driving like a total plonker then you will no doubt get pulled.
The problem the Police have is not understanding the Construction & Use regulations.
The 80dB limit (I thought it was 82, but who knows), anyway the 80 something test is actually a 30mph drive by test with the microphones set 9m from the track centre line and Doplar radar thrown in to the equation.
The ISO5130 test which most Police use is a static procedure which doesn't actually have a resultant value for the test.
99dB is acceptable for an SVA vehicle. and is used for the base test for many track circuits tests.
When I went to court over a noisy exhaust (92dB I think it was) the Police tested it at the wrong RPM. If the car did not have a working rev counter then they check the car at tickover. Mine was 74dB.
If in doubt really question the Police on how they test the vehicle, where they test it and at what RPM.
Obviously if you are driving like a total plonker then you will no doubt get pulled.
faa77 said:
So Essex police include aftermarket exhausts as a modification, not merely drilling holes yourself.
And the noise level limit is 80dB regardless of model.
Faa77, please provide your reference for the 80dB claim, I cannot find anything in the regs.And the noise level limit is 80dB regardless of model.
Edited by faa77 on Sunday 18th August 19:08
Silencers
54.—(1) Every vehicle propelled by an internal combustion engine shall be fitted with an exhaust system including a silencer and the exhaust gases from the engine shall not escape into the atmosphere without first passing through the silencer.
(2) Every exhaust system and silencer shall be maintained in good and efficient working order and shall not be altered so as to increase the noise made by the escape of exhaust gases.
(3) Instead of complying with paragraph (1) a vehicle may comply with Community Directive 77/212, 81/334, 84/372 or 84/424 or, in the case of a motor cycle other than a moped, 78/1015.
(4) In this regulation “moped” has the meaning given to it in paragraph (5) of Schedule 9.
Avoidance of excessive noise
97. No motor vehicle shall be used on a road in such manner as to cause any excessive noise which could have been avoided by the exercise of reasonable care on the part of the driver.
No reference to a value, also no reference to a prohibition to change the standard exhaust for a louder exhaust..
97 refers to the manner of driving not standard noise levels.
KevinCamaroSS said:
Faa77, please provide your reference for the 80dB claim, I cannot find anything in the regs.
Silencers
54.—(1) Every vehicle propelled by an internal combustion engine shall be fitted with an exhaust system including a silencer and the exhaust gases from the engine shall not escape into the atmosphere without first passing through the silencer.
(2) Every exhaust system and silencer shall be maintained in good and efficient working order and shall not be altered so as to increase the noise made by the escape of exhaust gases.
(3) Instead of complying with paragraph (1) a vehicle may comply with Community Directive 77/212, 81/334, 84/372 or 84/424 or, in the case of a motor cycle other than a moped, 78/1015.
(4) In this regulation “moped” has the meaning given to it in paragraph (5) of Schedule 9.
Avoidance of excessive noise
97. No motor vehicle shall be used on a road in such manner as to cause any excessive noise which could have been avoided by the exercise of reasonable care on the part of the driver.
No reference to a value, also no reference to a prohibition to change the standard exhaust for a louder exhaust..
97 refers to the manner of driving not standard noise levels.
Hi Kevin,Silencers
54.—(1) Every vehicle propelled by an internal combustion engine shall be fitted with an exhaust system including a silencer and the exhaust gases from the engine shall not escape into the atmosphere without first passing through the silencer.
(2) Every exhaust system and silencer shall be maintained in good and efficient working order and shall not be altered so as to increase the noise made by the escape of exhaust gases.
(3) Instead of complying with paragraph (1) a vehicle may comply with Community Directive 77/212, 81/334, 84/372 or 84/424 or, in the case of a motor cycle other than a moped, 78/1015.
(4) In this regulation “moped” has the meaning given to it in paragraph (5) of Schedule 9.
Avoidance of excessive noise
97. No motor vehicle shall be used on a road in such manner as to cause any excessive noise which could have been avoided by the exercise of reasonable care on the part of the driver.
No reference to a value, also no reference to a prohibition to change the standard exhaust for a louder exhaust..
97 refers to the manner of driving not standard noise levels.
I included the URL right at the top of my post (with the quotes).
It's not the written law, I was just showing how, in this case, Essex police, are enforcing it. I'm aware the law is the law, but the problem is how the police interpret the written law at the time of the incident.
You can't whip out the written UK legislation on the spot as the police will just ignore that and tell you what their constabulary guidance notes (which I have posted here) advise.
Monkey boy 1 said:
Wow, Holy Thread revival.
The problem the Police have is not understanding the Construction & Use regulations.
The 80dB limit (I thought it was 82, but who knows), anyway the 80 something test is actually a 30mph drive by test with the microphones set 9m from the track centre line and Doplar radar thrown in to the equation.
The ISO5130 test which most Police use is a static procedure which doesn't actually have a resultant value for the test.
99dB is acceptable for an SVA vehicle. and is used for the base test for many track circuits tests.
When I went to court over a noisy exhaust (92dB I think it was) the Police tested it at the wrong RPM. If the car did not have a working rev counter then they check the car at tickover. Mine was 74dB.
If in doubt really question the Police on how they test the vehicle, where they test it and at what RPM.
Obviously if you are driving like a total plonker then you will no doubt get pulled.
What we take this to mean... Always a slippery slope. The problem the Police have is not understanding the Construction & Use regulations.
The 80dB limit (I thought it was 82, but who knows), anyway the 80 something test is actually a 30mph drive by test with the microphones set 9m from the track centre line and Doplar radar thrown in to the equation.
The ISO5130 test which most Police use is a static procedure which doesn't actually have a resultant value for the test.
99dB is acceptable for an SVA vehicle. and is used for the base test for many track circuits tests.
When I went to court over a noisy exhaust (92dB I think it was) the Police tested it at the wrong RPM. If the car did not have a working rev counter then they check the car at tickover. Mine was 74dB.
If in doubt really question the Police on how they test the vehicle, where they test it and at what RPM.
Obviously if you are driving like a total plonker then you will no doubt get pulled.
Where sound level meters are used for an assessment, the vehicles are tested against a set threshold noise level that is not bespoke to the specific vehicle (i.e. the threshold noise level does not refer to the type approval noise level specific to that make and model of the vehicle). This is consistent with approaches used worldwide
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/governmen...
WTF is the point of type approval then?
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/governmen...
WTF is the point of type approval then?
Red Devil said:
Where sound level meters are used for an assessment, the vehicles are tested against a set threshold noise level that is not bespoke to the specific vehicle (i.e. the threshold noise level does not refer to the type approval noise level specific to that make and model of the vehicle). This is consistent with approaches used worldwide
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/governmen...
WTF is the point of type approval then?
I think it depends on which bit you read, as always, clear as mud.https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/governmen...
WTF is the point of type approval then?
The proposed noise limits are based on the specific type approval levels for each make/model of car from its year of manufacture. This means that older vehicles should not be tested against more recent type approval levels for more recent models of the same vehicle.
Police forces who were already using objective means to establish if a vehicle was excessively noisy used a noise limit of 90 dB LAeq when conducting roadside stationary exhaust noise tests [24]. The study considered that this was appropriate since the majority of type approval levels reviewed during the study were below 85 dB LAmax [24].
And
Control on imported or low volume production vehicles
Individual Vehicle Approval
In 2009, the previous Single Vehicle Approval system was replaced by the Individual Vehicle Approval scheme. This is a pre-registration inspection for vehicles imported, assembled or manufactured in very small numbers or as individual vehicles. It covers passenger cars, buses coaches, light and heavy goods vehicles, trailers and some special purpose vehicles.
As part of the approval process, vehicles are subject to a stationary exhaust noise test and must have a measured sound level not exceeding 99 dB(A). Alternatively, evidence of compliance can be demonstrated by a comparison test, where the vehicle noise-related technical specification is compared against the result of a static test which must be verified by an authorised test laboratory.
faa77 said:
Hi Kevin,
I included the URL right at the top of my post (with the quotes).
It's not the written law, I was just showing how, in this case, Essex police, are enforcing it. I'm aware the law is the law, but the problem is how the police interpret the written law at the time of the incident.
You can't whip out the written UK legislation on the spot as the police will just ignore that and tell you what their constabulary guidance notes (which I have posted here) advise.
Any decent solicitor would have an absolute field day with that police 'procedure' because absolutely none of it has any legal standing whatsoever. The police cannot make up a law to suit themselves. The Construction and Use regulations are the law, they cannot change that. There is absolutely no mention of 80dB, no prohibition on changing exhausts in the regs.I included the URL right at the top of my post (with the quotes).
It's not the written law, I was just showing how, in this case, Essex police, are enforcing it. I'm aware the law is the law, but the problem is how the police interpret the written law at the time of the incident.
You can't whip out the written UK legislation on the spot as the police will just ignore that and tell you what their constabulary guidance notes (which I have posted here) advise.
TheRainMaker said:
Red Devil said:
Where sound level meters are used for an assessment, the vehicles are tested against a set threshold noise level that is not bespoke to the specific vehicle (i.e. the threshold noise level does not refer to the type approval noise level specific to that make and model of the vehicle). This is consistent with approaches used worldwide
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/governmen...
WTF is the point of type approval then?
I think it depends on which bit you read, as always, clear as mud.https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/governmen...
WTF is the point of type approval then?
The proposed noise limits are based on the specific type approval levels for each make/model of car from its year of manufacture. This means that older vehicles should not be tested against more recent type approval levels for more recent models of the same vehicle.
Police forces who were already using objective means to establish if a vehicle was excessively noisy used a noise limit of 90 dB LAeq when conducting roadside stationary exhaust noise tests [24]. The study considered that this was appropriate since the majority of type approval levels reviewed during the study were below 85 dB LAmax [24].
And
Control on imported or low volume production vehicles
Individual Vehicle Approval
In 2009, the previous Single Vehicle Approval system was replaced by the Individual Vehicle Approval scheme. This is a pre-registration inspection for vehicles imported, assembled or manufactured in very small numbers or as individual vehicles. It covers passenger cars, buses coaches, light and heavy goods vehicles, trailers and some special purpose vehicles.
As part of the approval process, vehicles are subject to a stationary exhaust noise test and must have a measured sound level not exceeding 99 dB(A). Alternatively, evidence of compliance can be demonstrated by a comparison test, where the vehicle noise-related technical specification is compared against the result of a static test which must be verified by an authorised test laboratory.
Based on is suitably vague. If the actual testing is being conducted using different criteria all bets are off.
It's what happens in the real world environment that matters for individual motorists.
It's like anything else to do with motoring: the cost of fighting 'the system' will be totally disproportionate.
KevinCamaroSS said:
faa77 said:
Hi Kevin,
I included the URL right at the top of my post (with the quotes).
It's not the written law, I was just showing how, in this case, Essex police, are enforcing it. I'm aware the law is the law, but the problem is how the police interpret the written law at the time of the incident.
You can't whip out the written UK legislation on the spot as the police will just ignore that and tell you what their constabulary guidance notes (which I have posted here) advise.
Any decent solicitor would have an absolute field day with that police 'procedure' because absolutely none of it has any legal standing whatsoever. The police cannot make up a law to suit themselves. The Construction and Use regulations are the law, they cannot change that. There is absolutely no mention of 80dB, no prohibition on changing exhausts in the regs.I included the URL right at the top of my post (with the quotes).
It's not the written law, I was just showing how, in this case, Essex police, are enforcing it. I'm aware the law is the law, but the problem is how the police interpret the written law at the time of the incident.
You can't whip out the written UK legislation on the spot as the police will just ignore that and tell you what their constabulary guidance notes (which I have posted here) advise.
Unlike a Directive, a Regulation is immediately binding on all member states. It does not require transposition into law by means of national legislation.
From the link I posted above
Regulation (EU) 540/2014 which repeals European Directive 70/157/EEC [4], outlines limits on the sound levels from road vehicle and gives more representative procedures for measuring sound levels from exhaust systems and silencers. These limits have been tightened through several amendments. Limit values for eight types of passenger and goods vehicles range from 72 dB(A) to 80 dB(A). These limits are expected to be again tightened over 10 years. By 2026 the limit for most new passenger cars is expected to be 68 dB(A) [5].
Whether their representative procedures pass muster is a different question.
Btw, 80dB for a TVR? Cue strangled laughter...
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