Stab a dog, criminal damage?
Discussion
RUSSELLM said:
The latest of the varying reports, seems to indicate that the smaller dog was being attacked & that neither owner could stop the attack.
One owner has had time to go back to his home & get a weapon to put a stop to it all.
Killing one dog, to save the other.
Is that not the case ?
"When she did finally turn up five minutes later all she did was stroke her dog. I was kicking and punching it but it wouldn’t budge so I went into the kitchen and got three knives."One owner has had time to go back to his home & get a weapon to put a stop to it all.
Killing one dog, to save the other.
Is that not the case ?
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2216806/Mo...
According to her - and it is rather more logical - she was tending to her dog after they had been fighting.
James Cameron said:
According to her - and it is rather more logical - she was tending to her dog after they had been fighting.
No, that doesn't sound logical.I'm sorry, but if she's attending her dog after the fight has ended & he comes up & starts stabbing it, you, I & everybody else knows, that he's got a charge to answer.
The logical explanation is that his dog is being throttled, he's had time to kick feck out of the offending dog to no avail, go back to his property, hunt about in his kitchen, walk back & find his own dog still being pinned down... Hence not being charged with anything. As somebody who doesn't know either side, that sounds a lot more logical.
Had a similar situation (sort of) a few years ago. A 'friend' killed my cat (and then dumped the body), got charged with criminal damage... suspended sentence etc.
Only strange bit is that we were told that the charge would have been different if it had been a dog, rather than a cat... which seems to not be the case here.
Only strange bit is that we were told that the charge would have been different if it had been a dog, rather than a cat... which seems to not be the case here.
To be fair the first impression i got was that there was the initial fight where he managed to extricate his dog having wounded her dog in the process, returned home, armed himself with bigger knives, returned to the scene and in a fit of rage continued to knife the animal whilst in the arms of its owner.
How close to the actual events that is I have no idea . . . at first glance pretty shocking.
How close to the actual events that is I have no idea . . . at first glance pretty shocking.
There is one issue I have. You regularly hear of stories where large, vicious dogs literally rip smaller, defenceless handbag items to shreds... if this bloke had enough time to walk away from his dog in the process of being attacked in an alley, go back home, fish through his kitchen knives, run back, and the large dog still has the little one locked in his massive jaws (5 minutes later in his own words), how come his hound is currently alive and well with a few scrapes rather than distributed evenly across the borough in large, bite size chunks?
Or perhaps they might have had a little scuffle (perhaps not for the first time), exchanged a few nips as dogs do, and the bloke has gone utterly mental and gone back to make sure it doesn't happen again.
Actually there are two issues I have; stabbed 23 times. 23. Just count it up in your head. That doesn't strike me as a normal response, even when adrenaline fuelled. Surely the dog must have dropped after a couple, even ten, so why would any normal person carry on?
Or perhaps they might have had a little scuffle (perhaps not for the first time), exchanged a few nips as dogs do, and the bloke has gone utterly mental and gone back to make sure it doesn't happen again.
Actually there are two issues I have; stabbed 23 times. 23. Just count it up in your head. That doesn't strike me as a normal response, even when adrenaline fuelled. Surely the dog must have dropped after a couple, even ten, so why would any normal person carry on?
Edited by The Wookie on Tuesday 16th October 17:19
Not to say much, but a dog that is bred to go up against bulls is not really something that is going to go and back off after a kick and a punch.
If he was guilty of criminal damage they would have charged him.
Sufficient evidence has been shown that he is not guilty, so saying its over the top stabbing XX times, well the police didnt think so, therefore there is a little more to it than has been placed in the article.
If he was guilty of criminal damage they would have charged him.
Sufficient evidence has been shown that he is not guilty, so saying its over the top stabbing XX times, well the police didnt think so, therefore there is a little more to it than has been placed in the article.
The Wookie said:
Actually there are two issues I have; stabbed 23 times. 23. Just count it up in your head. That doesn't strike me as a normal response, even when adrenaline fuelled. Surely the dog must have dropped after a couple, even ten, so why would any normal person carry on?
On the flip side of that, how long has he been chasing that dog around the park to stab it 23 times ?The lack of charge makes me think, he's kicked the s
t out of it, it still wouldn't let go, then some Five minutes later, when the owner has plenty of time to drag her dog away, it's still there most likely with it's chops firmly locked on to the smaller dog's throat.Sounds like the canine version of that unarmed cannibal in the US recently. The one that the Police shot dead for not letting go of the fella he was eating.
Edited by RUSSELLM on Tuesday 16th October 22:15
First thing I thought when it said secluded walkway is she might of had him off the leash. Second he's an american bull dog he should be muzzled shouldn't he? I walk up Hampstead a lot and notice a lot of people don't bother with leashes. Every week a unleashed dog comes up to my dog on a leash, my dog barks at it and the owner usually gets angry with me.
James Cameron said:
If people want to believe that while the 2 dogs were fighting he was hitting and kicking Tyson while she was stroking him..
Next -
My mobile phone has been blocked.
If you have some "inside information" then please, share it with the rest of the class. If not, would you stop implying that you have.Next -
My mobile phone has been blocked.
I could say a lot more. If you take the issue that the dogs had been seperated, rather than going into detail, I'm leaving that to her and sticking to what can be ascertained from the statement of the guy. It may have been "Freud" on his part, but they are both in agreement that the dogs had been seperated.
Sticking to what is in the public domain, examine this photo:
http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://www.h...
You can see a Union Jack, a lead and a nozzle which goes over the mouth. It is fair to point out that when walking in the street, Tyson would be on the lead and the nozzle which you can see in the photo would be over his mouth. That stopped him from pulling.
It is also fair to point out that Tyson had escaped from a wooded area in a gated enclosure where he had been having a run. It appears that either Daisy had forgotten to bolt the gate or someone else had opened the gate.
Irrespective of whether Daisy had unfortunately forgotten to bolt the gate or someone else had opened the gate, we know from the guy's statement that the dog fight had been over.
As of yet we have not heard whether his dog was taken to the vet. We have not heard from the vet about injury to his dog. As far as I am aware, he did not mention any injury to his dog. Whether his dog was badly injured and he didn't mention it, or the papers did not report it..
(The phone started working later. Perhaps someone listening had pressed the wrong button)
Sticking to what is in the public domain, examine this photo:
http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://www.h...
You can see a Union Jack, a lead and a nozzle which goes over the mouth. It is fair to point out that when walking in the street, Tyson would be on the lead and the nozzle which you can see in the photo would be over his mouth. That stopped him from pulling.
It is also fair to point out that Tyson had escaped from a wooded area in a gated enclosure where he had been having a run. It appears that either Daisy had forgotten to bolt the gate or someone else had opened the gate.
Irrespective of whether Daisy had unfortunately forgotten to bolt the gate or someone else had opened the gate, we know from the guy's statement that the dog fight had been over.
As of yet we have not heard whether his dog was taken to the vet. We have not heard from the vet about injury to his dog. As far as I am aware, he did not mention any injury to his dog. Whether his dog was badly injured and he didn't mention it, or the papers did not report it..
(The phone started working later. Perhaps someone listening had pressed the wrong button)
so you really have nothing to say then?
The man has not been charged and been released.
Other people on the estate say Tyson is a menace and does go for people and other dogs.
You still keep saying you can say so much more, but so far have quoted 2 articles and thats it.
If you know more then please do say so, but so far you havent said anything of any real evidence.
They were separated, Tyson was off a lead, apparently was muzzled (according to you), Tyson escaped and had a go at another dog, Tyson owner did nothing about the attack on the other dog, Tyson got killed as a result.
All you can say is show me the bite marks, which the owner will no doubt have already shown the police.
The man has not been charged and been released.
Other people on the estate say Tyson is a menace and does go for people and other dogs.
You still keep saying you can say so much more, but so far have quoted 2 articles and thats it.
If you know more then please do say so, but so far you havent said anything of any real evidence.
They were separated, Tyson was off a lead, apparently was muzzled (according to you), Tyson escaped and had a go at another dog, Tyson owner did nothing about the attack on the other dog, Tyson got killed as a result.
All you can say is show me the bite marks, which the owner will no doubt have already shown the police.
James Cameron said:
I could say a lot more.
You couldn't say much less.James Cameron said:
If you take the issue that the dogs had been seperated...they are both in agreement that the dogs had been seperated....we know from the guy's statement that the dog fight had been over.
Do we?Wayne Stearman in the Telegraph said:
"I’d just stepped out my house and the dog went for Monty,” he said. “It wasn’t on a lead. It locked its jaw on to Monty’s head. It was like a lion on top of a gazelle. I was screaming for help and the owner was nowhere to be seen. When she did finally turn up five minutes later all she did was stroke her dog. I was kicking and punching it but it wouldn’t budge so I went into the kitchen and got three knives. I’m not proud of what I’ve done, but what was I supposed to do? Stand there and let it kill my dog?"
Anyway, let's see what he gets charged with.James Cameron said:
I could say a lot more. If you take the issue that the dogs had been seperated, rather than going into detail, I'm leaving that to her and sticking to what can be ascertained from the statement of the guy. It may have been "Freud" on his part, but they are both in agreement that the dogs had been seperated.
Sticking to what is in the public domain, examine this photo:
http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://www.h...
You can see a Union Jack, a lead and a nozzle which goes over the mouth. It is fair to point out that when walking in the street, Tyson would be on the lead and the nozzle which you can see in the photo would be over his mouth. That stopped him from pulling.
It is also fair to point out that Tyson had escaped from a wooded area in a gated enclosure where he had been having a run. It appears that either Daisy had forgotten to bolt the gate or someone else had opened the gate.
Irrespective of whether Daisy had unfortunately forgotten to bolt the gate or someone else had opened the gate, we know from the guy's statement that the dog fight had been over.
As of yet we have not heard whether his dog was taken to the vet. We have not heard from the vet about injury to his dog. As far as I am aware, he did not mention any injury to his dog. Whether his dog was badly injured and he didn't mention it, or the papers did not report it..
(The phone started working later. Perhaps someone listening had pressed the wrong button)
There is no "Nozzle" i see a lead but really that proves nothing, also a nozzle stops a dog from pulling not from being able to open its mouth and attack!Sticking to what is in the public domain, examine this photo:
http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://www.h...
You can see a Union Jack, a lead and a nozzle which goes over the mouth. It is fair to point out that when walking in the street, Tyson would be on the lead and the nozzle which you can see in the photo would be over his mouth. That stopped him from pulling.
It is also fair to point out that Tyson had escaped from a wooded area in a gated enclosure where he had been having a run. It appears that either Daisy had forgotten to bolt the gate or someone else had opened the gate.
Irrespective of whether Daisy had unfortunately forgotten to bolt the gate or someone else had opened the gate, we know from the guy's statement that the dog fight had been over.
As of yet we have not heard whether his dog was taken to the vet. We have not heard from the vet about injury to his dog. As far as I am aware, he did not mention any injury to his dog. Whether his dog was badly injured and he didn't mention it, or the papers did not report it..
(The phone started working later. Perhaps someone listening had pressed the wrong button)
You seem keen to see what you want to see and hear i am going with the masses on this, if it had been my dog i would have done the same.
James Cameron said:
. It may have been "Freud" on his part, but they are both in agreement that the dogs had been seperated.
we know from the guy's statement that the dog fight had been over.
I've seen the various links on here, where the guy said he his dog was clamped down for 5 minutes, but I haven't seen the quote yet where he said the "Fight was over"...we know from the guy's statement that the dog fight had been over.
Have you got a link for that one please ?
James Cameron said:
Its a bit strange: Some nights ago I heard the presenter on a radio talk show refer to the guy as Alan McFinnian.
I know Im going to regret this, but I dont understand what you are on about? But you have come up with stranger.Can you make a paragraph of just facts for the people on here of what you know, not about if the dog has seen a vet or newspaper links, some actual facts and not here-say (that would be something you have not seen first hand), then just tell us.
Hell, I will settle for a coherent sentence of facts.
Can you do that for us?
RUSSELLM said:
I've seen the various links on here, where the guy said he his dog was clamped down for 5 minutes, but I haven't seen the quote yet where he said the "Fight was over"...
Have you got a link for that one please ?
"When she did finally turn up five minutes later all she did was stroke her dog. I was kicking and punching it but it wouldn’t budge so I went into the kitchen and got three knives."Have you got a link for that one please ?
You'd need to be a mug to think she was stroking (tending to) her dog while they were fighting. Furthermore, she told me before his statement.
According to her, after the fight she did not closely examine the other dog but did not notice any injury to the other other dog. Also, she had noticed his dog (he had returned with his dog) looked horrified when he was stabbing Tyson.
Du1point8 said:
I know Im going to regret this, but I dont understand what you are on about? But you have come up with stranger.
Can you make a paragraph of just facts for the people on here of what you know, not about if the dog has seen a vet or newspaper links, some actual facts and not here-say (that would be something you have not seen first hand), then just tell us.
Hell, I will settle for a coherent sentence of facts.
Can you do that for us?
Tell you what Dullpoint, its a coherent statement of fact that we do not know whether his dog saw the vet that night. Can you make a paragraph of just facts for the people on here of what you know, not about if the dog has seen a vet or newspaper links, some actual facts and not here-say (that would be something you have not seen first hand), then just tell us.
Hell, I will settle for a coherent sentence of facts.
Can you do that for us?
Gassing Station | Speed, Plod & the Law | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff