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rpguk

Original Poster:

3,794 posts

167 months

[news] 
Thursday 11th October 2012 quote quote all
I was shocked to read this in the local paper

Ham and High said:
A distraught dog owner cradled her beloved pet as it died in her arms after being stabbed 23 times in a brutal attack.

American bulldog Tyson had been scrapping with another pet dog in a secluded walkway between Belsize and Hampstead on Friday when he was set upon by a man wielding five knives.

After the fighting dogs were separated, the enraged owner of the other pet left the scene in Woodland Walk only to return moments later with two 10inch knives and three other blades.

In a flurry of savage swipes the man is alleged to have knifed Tyson 23 times as the animal cowered blood-soaked in owner Daisy Jenkins’ arms.

A blood-stained knife recovered from the scene was bent at a right angle, apparently by the force of the attack.

The heartbroken mother-of-three, 41, whose hip was cut during the frenzy, said: “We were just clinging together right up against the fence trying to keep away from the knives.

“I could feel bleeding but I just held him tightly. I thought if I pretended to be dead he would leave us alone.

“After that I just kept saying to Tyson: ‘Hang on, please hang on. Pull through’.

“I really thought he was going to. He was the best dog ever.”

Witness Allison Havey was on her way home from a meeting in central London when she saw a crowd of people running from the scene.

The freelance photographer, from Agincourt Road in Hampstead, said: “She (Ms Jenkins) was covered in blood and hysterical.

“It was a blood bath, just terrible with this beautiful, sad woman covered in blood.

“She just said to me: ‘Please help.

“Help me make my dog live’.”

A vet was called to try to save Tyson, but the 42kg bulldog died on the footpath.

The vet, from the Village Vet in Belsize Terrace, said he had never seen such horrific injuries.

“There were a total of 23 stab wounds and there were enough deeply penetrating the abdomen – any of which could have hit a major vessel and killed him,” he said.

A 41-year-old man was arrested on suspicion of causing criminal damage and bailed to return to a police station at a later date.

A police spokeswoman said; “It is criminal damage as the dog is classed as property – there are other offences which it could come under but this is the most substantial crime.”

But Ms Jenkins has called for the law to be changed so that those who harm animals face tougher penalties.

“A dog or pet is part of your family, it’s not a commodity,” said Ms Jenkins, of Aspern Grove in Belsize Park.

“It’s not criminal damage, it’s murder.”

Ms Jenkins, who had owned Tyson for three years, has built a shrine in Woodland Walk, with a bunch of roses and a poem tied to the railings. In a message to her beloved pet she wrote: “Mr.T. You are my irreplaceable one and only true love xxxx”

http://www.hamhigh.co.uk/news/court-crime/beloved_...
The bit that concerns me the most was that he was only charged with criminal damage. I can almost understand that in relation to the killing itself. But the police spokesman says that criminal damage is "the most substantial crime". Surely he should be charged with possession of an offensive weapon? He appears to have injured the owner too so that should attract something stronger than criminal damage? Is there a reason they could only charge him with the one crime?

The ferociousness of the attack is deeply worrying. I'm surprised he was even bailed. Surely this is not the actions of someone who should be roaming the streets.

It's a terrible sign that this has only made the local papers frown


Edited by rpguk on Thursday 11th October 23:26

sugerbear

925 posts

41 months

[news] 
Thursday 11th October 2012 quote quote all
Maybe hearing the other side of the story would be good. American bulldog is a big powerful dog so what was the other dog, something smaller, maybe the owner of the other dog had previous with this dog and his own dog had come off badly? If it was the kind of dog that enjoyed a fight why wasn't it on a lead and muzzled.

Just playing devils advocate here.

DeolTheBeast

277 posts

29 months

[news] 
Thursday 11th October 2012 quote quote all
Felt ill reading that - don't want to imagine it at all.

Johnnytheboy

10,062 posts

69 months

[news] 
Thursday 11th October 2012 quote quote all
Surely there's some kind of animal cruelty offence here?

Ki3r

2,547 posts

42 months

[news] 
Thursday 11th October 2012 quote quote all
My cat was stabbed and killed a few years ago, it was crimed as criminal damage too.
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Red 4

2,311 posts

70 months

[news] 
Thursday 11th October 2012 quote quote all
Yes, it's crim dam.

Hopefully a long custodial awaits (although I doubt it)

Sickening.




icetea

846 posts

25 months

[news] 
Thursday 11th October 2012 quote quote all
Well nobody knows what happened... if that wasn't the first time the dog has attacked the other guys dog I can see how it came to be stabbed up and dead.

I don't think this story is as monstrous as someone just going out, finding a random pet dog and maliciously killing - there is clearly more to it than that.

Brother D

1,241 posts

59 months

[news] 
Thursday 11th October 2012 quote quote all
I'd wait passing judgement until the facts come out. Sad for the dog, but it may have been this fighting breed of dog attacked and injured the other dog, resulting in that owner taking action (albeit a rather over-reaction). If her dog had been muzzled then it would still be alive.



Jasandjules

50,383 posts

112 months

[news] 
Thursday 11th October 2012 quote quote all
Brother D said:
I'd wait passing judgement until the facts come out. Sad for the dog, but it may have been this fighting breed of dog attacked and injured the other dog, resulting in that owner taking action (albeit a rather over-reaction). If her dog had been muzzled then it would still be alive.
Oh I didn't realise we were allowed to go and get large carving knives these days and just stab dogs. And people.


icetea

846 posts

25 months

[news] 
Thursday 11th October 2012 quote quote all
Jasandjules said:
Oh I didn't realise we were allowed to go and get large carving knives these days and just stab dogs. And people.
The person was cut - you've no idea if the other guy stabbed them, they could have been cut from one of the dogs. I would presume thats the case otherwise he would have been charged with assault or worse.

If the dog in question has attacked multiple dogs in the past then its probably a good thing its dead now... its not the route that should have been taken but I can see why it might have happened. If a dog attacked my dog more than once I'd have killed it too... not in that manner though.

MrBrightSi

1,307 posts

53 months

[news] 
Thursday 11th October 2012 quote quote all
I refuse to make judgement on this. I can see my own reaction to someones dog trying to harm mine being pretty harsh, not 5 knives harsh however.

The full story is miles away from this article, it just doesn't sit right in my mind, i can imagine a dog like that to be a right bd to other dogs. The whole bit about the owner leaving after seperation to return and knife the dog is a bit suspect, to be honest having read things on kids being mauled by dogs and people having to retreat and grab whatever they can springs to mind here.

Boosted LS1

13,596 posts

143 months

[news] 
Thursday 11th October 2012 quote quote all
Brother D said:
I'd wait passing judgement until the facts come out. Sad for the dog, but it may have been this fighting breed of dog attacked and injured the other dog, resulting in that owner taking action (albeit a rather over-reaction). If her dog had been muzzled then it would still be alive.
It's an american bulldog and not a pit bull. That might be significant. As far as I'm aware american bulldogs aren't a fighting breed but they can look pretty frightening. The ones I've come across have been very well mannered. Maybe the attacker assumed it was a pit bull type, hence his reaction?

Somebody will correct me if I'm wrong about the dangerous dogs stuff.

simoid

12,500 posts

41 months

[news] 
Thursday 11th October 2012 quote quote all
How does one "wield 5 knives"? confused

Regiment

2,104 posts

42 months

[news] 
Thursday 11th October 2012 quote quote all
Jasandjules said:
Oh I didn't realise we were allowed to go and get large carving knives these days and just stab dogs. And people.
Not knowing the background or what's happened from both sides, it could be a distraught dog owner grabbing a weapon to protect a member of their family from a vicious dog attack. If one of my cats or dogs was set upon by a dog in a vicious attack, all bets are off I'm afraid and I'm going to either grab a weapon or kick as hard as I can to its most vulnerable parts, even if it means killing/maiming the dog.

wizzbilly

955 posts

76 months

[news] 
Thursday 11th October 2012 quote quote all
criminal damage the knife man wants to meet someone down a dark ally one night and recive the same treatment .

yes there maybe 2 sides to every story but am a big beliver dogs are only as good as they are fetched up .

i have 2 german shepards and they look the part but as soft as a brush even with pepole they dont no but others seam a little worried when see them as i would be if i see other dogs you never no how they have been fetched up .

i thought if you injured a police dog it was classed as a officer and carried same punishment could be wrong though ?

you look how many idiots own staffis as think protection etc and this for giving them a bad name i no of a few and all they are is soft as a brush but still always on gaurd

ajstephe

1,209 posts

88 months

[news] 
Thursday 11th October 2012 quote quote all
rpguk said:
The bit that concerns me the most was that he was only charged with criminal damage.
He hasn't been charged yet. The investigation is still ongoing and he may be charged with other offences

Murder requires a human being to be killed. Animals are classed as property

rpguk

Original Poster:

3,794 posts

167 months

[news] 
Thursday 11th October 2012 quote quote all
Some interesting points here in that he may have been trying to fight off the dog. I could certainly see that if the dog was on the attack one could well be forgiven for running to get a knife - it's size alone would make it dangerous when angry even if it was generally placid.

However, the article does state that it happened after the dogs were separated. If this man did this out of anger or spite or any other reason then to stop an attack in progress then I revert to my original stance and he should face a custodial sentence.

ajstephe said:
rpguk said:
The bit that concerns me the most was that he was only charged with criminal damage.
He hasn't been charged yet. The investigation is still ongoing and he may be charged with other offences

Murder requires a human being to be killed. Animals are classed as property
Yeah, wasn't expecting him to be charged with murder - just seemed that the police were indicating that criminal damage was the most they could get him on when I would have thought there would be other legislation that could cover the incident.

ajstephe

1,209 posts

88 months

[news] 
Thursday 11th October 2012 quote quote all
rpguk said:
Yeah, wasn't expecting him to be charged with murder - just seemed that the police were indicating that criminal damage was the most they could get him on when I would have thought there would be other legislation that could cover the incident.
I was referring to the bit where the owner of the dead dog was talking about murder.

I'm pretty sure there's other stuff that the police have on him but they have to gather all the evidence first (witness statements etc) before bringing charges

rpguk

Original Poster:

3,794 posts

167 months

[news] 
Friday 12th October 2012 quote quote all
Ah, so they only need one 'safe' offence to give grounds for arrest but that can be expanded on when it comes to charge?

7db

5,947 posts

113 months

[news] 
Friday 12th October 2012 quote quote all
Criminal damage carries a maximum 10 year sentence (if not racially aggravated), but has to be damage over £5,000 to get into the Crown Court. Otherwise it's a maximum of 3 months.

Possession of a knife in dangerous circumstances and using it to create fear would seem to be a better bet.

Shame he wasn't wearing an offensive t-shirt or posting on facebook. That gets you serious time.
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