woman killed in rta with hired R8
Discussion
KFC said:
Sure, d
heads are always going to drive like dheads. But letting them get behind the wheel of a powerful sports car that they've hired for a day just seems to be vastly increasing the risk of something nasty happening.
Why not have some sort of restrictions on what cars people can drive? No hiring anything like this until you've held a driving license for 10 years. Maybe let people own them after they've had one for 5 years (I'm assuming people will be more careful with their own rather than a 24 hour hire). I'd ban people from driving with more than 1 passenger in the first year after passing their test. And I'd probably ban them from driving late at night unless they were going to/from work. And put restrictions on power/speed etc until they've had their license a few years.
But the Audi in question had restrictions already on it for driver's who could rent it, min age 28, the guy driving was 24 at the time and it wasn't him who hired it out, but was still driving.heads are always going to drive like dheads. But letting them get behind the wheel of a powerful sports car that they've hired for a day just seems to be vastly increasing the risk of something nasty happening. Why not have some sort of restrictions on what cars people can drive? No hiring anything like this until you've held a driving license for 10 years. Maybe let people own them after they've had one for 5 years (I'm assuming people will be more careful with their own rather than a 24 hour hire). I'd ban people from driving with more than 1 passenger in the first year after passing their test. And I'd probably ban them from driving late at night unless they were going to/from work. And put restrictions on power/speed etc until they've had their license a few years.
You can't easily limit those who get behind the wheel, look at those who get repeated bans for drink driving no insurance etc etc and who still get behind the wheel, route cause is the punishment they receive when caught is laughable and no deterrent, the six year's for causing a death in this case, and likely out much earlier is a case in point.
otolith said:
The evidence-based observation that a particular criminal or antisocial activity is associated with a particular ethnic subculture is not in itself racist. Taking that into account when trying to come up with a strategy to deal with it is not racist. Assuming that an individual of that ethnicity behaves in that way *is* racist, as is assuming that the behaviour is typical of people of that ethnicity. Ignoring the activity altogether because of a fear of appearing to be racist is Rotherham Syndrome - and perhaps, to a lesser extent, so is denying the evidence of the association.
Had to read that a couple of times to get my head round what you're saying and I agree completelyrigga said:
But the Audi in question had restrictions already on it for driver's who could rent it, min age 28, the guy driving was 24 at the time and it wasn't him who hired it out, but was still driving.
I'm not talking about hire company rules. I'm talking about actual new laws.rigga said:
You can't easily limit those who get behind the wheel, look at those who get repeated bans for drink driving no insurance etc etc and who still get behind the wheel, route cause is the punishment they receive when caught is laughable and no deterrent, the six year's for causing a death in this case, and likely out much earlier is a case in point.
Thats completely different. Sure, you can't stop some idiot with multiple bans and convictions already from getting behind the wheel again. But your average generally law abiding 18 year old, even although he might drive like a total cock, isn't going to go out and buy a Focus RS knowing full well he can't legally insure it or drive it, is he?rigga said:
KFC said:
Sure, dheads are always going to drive like dheads. But letting them get behind the wheel of a powerful sports car that they've hired for a day just seems to be vastly increasing the risk of something nasty happening.
Why not have some sort of restrictions on what cars people can drive? No hiring anything like this until you've held a driving license for 10 years. Maybe let people own them after they've had one for 5 years (I'm assuming people will be more careful with their own rather than a 24 hour hire). I'd ban people from driving with more than 1 passenger in the first year after passing their test. And I'd probably ban them from driving late at night unless they were going to/from work. And put restrictions on power/speed etc until they've had their license a few years.
But the Audi in question had restrictions already on it for driver's who could rent it, min age 28, the guy driving was 24 at the time and it wasn't him who hired it out, but was still driving.heads are always going to drive like dheads. But letting them get behind the wheel of a powerful sports car that they've hired for a day just seems to be vastly increasing the risk of something nasty happening. Why not have some sort of restrictions on what cars people can drive? No hiring anything like this until you've held a driving license for 10 years. Maybe let people own them after they've had one for 5 years (I'm assuming people will be more careful with their own rather than a 24 hour hire). I'd ban people from driving with more than 1 passenger in the first year after passing their test. And I'd probably ban them from driving late at night unless they were going to/from work. And put restrictions on power/speed etc until they've had their license a few years.
You can't easily limit those who get behind the wheel, look at those who get repeated bans for drink driving no insurance etc etc and who still get behind the wheel, route cause is the punishment they receive when caught is laughable and no deterrent, the six year's for causing a death in this case, and likely out much earlier is a case in point.
The problem is that to get many of these lower level rental companies to be profitable they need that 'prom night' market etc.
DonkeyApple said:
The problem is that to get many of these lower level rental companies to be profitable they need that 'prom night' market etc.
If they're only able to stay in business by renting to anti social idiots or people who're likely to cause crashes or facilitate driving with no insurance, then law changes that force them out of business would appear to be a good thing.KFC said:
I'm not talking about hire company rules. I'm talking about actual new laws.
But you also saidKFC said:
Why not have some sort of restrictions on what cars people can drive? No hiring anything like this until you've held a driving license for 10 years.
So mixed messages ...and a law abiding 18 year old probably wouldn't be driving like a tard regardless if it was a focus rs Audi r8 or a micra, you still can't stop idiot's whether you try to legislate them off the road or not, they simply don't care about rules. KarlMac said:
A common practice round here is to use them for money laundering. Your dirty readies get paid to your mate who owns the hire business, who the spends them on 'detailing/servicing/misc costs' back to the hirer, money's now clean.
Certainly what was happening in sheffield a while back. Couldn't get through Darnall (virtually a slum) without seeing at least three gallardo/bentley/r8's.
That's bCertainly what was happening in sheffield a while back. Couldn't get through Darnall (virtually a slum) without seeing at least three gallardo/bentley/r8's.
ks. It's no cleaner than when it started. It needs to go through recognised financial institutions a few times to be clean. What you've described is about as useful as swapping it with a mate in the pub. rigga said:
So mixed messages ...and a law abiding 18 year old probably wouldn't be driving like a tard regardless if it was a focus rs Audi r8 or a micra, you still can't stop idiot's whether you try to legislate them off the road or not, they simply don't care about rules.
Its not mixed messages. What I'm saying is that if you had laws and someone didn't abide by them, then there are far more serious consequences to that than just ignoring some companies terms and conditions. That audi driver could then have been treated as driving without a valid license, and dealt with accordingly.18 year olds do drive like idiots though. I done exactly the same, and I'm sure a large percentage of people reading this done likewise. I wrecked one car in my first month... it was only a Fiesta and no real harm. If I'd had money/it was legal I'd likely have wrecked something far bigger, almost certainly seriously injured myself or worse, and potentially done a few other people in the process too.
imo there is a major difference between an 18 year old just getting carried away and driving like a clown (like I done), and planning to do something idiotic. There is absolutely no way I'd have went and bought a car that I wouldn't have been allowed to drive legally. What I did do was go buy a car with an MOT etc, insure it in my name. All legit. Then just get a bit carried away and run out of talent and wreck it.
jagracer said:
While it's no get out for the Audi driver it looks like the woman who pulled out got the rabbit in the headlights syndrome and stopped in front of the oncoming car.
Yeah but, even so, that behavior is a direct consequence of an audi R8 suddenly appearing because he was going too bloody fast. 76 mph they reckon, he was probably doing more than that before slamming on the anchors.LoonR1 said:
KarlMac said:
A common practice round here is to use them for money laundering. Your dirty readies get paid to your mate who owns the hire business, who the spends them on 'detailing/servicing/misc costs' back to the hirer, money's now clean.
Certainly what was happening in sheffield a while back. Couldn't get through Darnall (virtually a slum) without seeing at least three gallardo/bentley/r8's.
That's bCertainly what was happening in sheffield a while back. Couldn't get through Darnall (virtually a slum) without seeing at least three gallardo/bentley/r8's.
ks. It's no cleaner than when it started. It needs to go through recognised financial institutions a few times to be clean. What you've described is about as useful as swapping it with a mate in the pub. Money gets legitimately paid into the bank so that the takings match the invoices.
Your dirty money is now in the bank looking clean.
KFC said:
Why not have some sort of restrictions on what cars people can drive? No hiring anything like this until you've held a driving license for 10 years. Maybe let people own them after they've had one for 5 years (I'm assuming people will be more careful with their own rather than a 24 hour hire). I'd ban people from driving with more than 1 passenger in the first year after passing their test. And I'd probably ban them from driving late at night unless they were going to/from work. And put restrictions on power/speed etc until they've had their license a few years.
DonkeyApple said:
I bet you could limit the risk if it was further restricted to: People with a recognisable job, able to speak English properly and clearly (taking into account regional accents but categorically ruling out text speak etc) and with a Council Tax statement in their name and above a minimum band.
You could bring all sorts of laws into being but they would continue to be flouted; what we see already is the result of illegal activity. The interesting question (for me, at least) is why do some chunks of society seem to care so little for their fellow countryman? They will persistently deal drugs/run 'cash-for-crash' scams/rape vulnerable schoolgirls/hire and sub-hire supercars and kill people in them. These are all behaviours that are more prevalent (although not exclusively so) among certain bits of the UK population. Why do they feel the need to behave like this?
Before the liberals jump in - please don't bother.
Oli.
zcacogp said:
KFC said:
Why not have some sort of restrictions on what cars people can drive? No hiring anything like this until you've held a driving license for 10 years. Maybe let people own them after they've had one for 5 years (I'm assuming people will be more careful with their own rather than a 24 hour hire). I'd ban people from driving with more than 1 passenger in the first year after passing their test. And I'd probably ban them from driving late at night unless they were going to/from work. And put restrictions on power/speed etc until they've had their license a few years.
DonkeyApple said:
I bet you could limit the risk if it was further restricted to: People with a recognisable job, able to speak English properly and clearly (taking into account regional accents but categorically ruling out text speak etc) and with a Council Tax statement in their name and above a minimum band.
You could bring all sorts of laws into being but they would continue to be flouted; what we see already is the result of illegal activity. The interesting question (for me, at least) is why do some chunks of society seem to care so little for their fellow countryman? They will persistently deal drugs/run 'cash-for-crash' scams/rape vulnerable schoolgirls/hire and sub-hire supercars and kill people in them. These are all behaviours that are more prevalent (although not exclusively so) among certain bits of the UK population. Why do they feel the need to behave like this?
Before the liberals jump in - please don't bother.
Oli.
Well, if one has come out of this, it's reading the comments on the Mails paper. Talk about complete clap trap. None of them seem to understand anything. Nearly all the negative comments are just ill informed, made up 'facts'. And now PH'ers realise why stupid motoring laws get passed. People with this level with an IQ of <10 become councillors !!!!
I'm a (small l) liberal and I don't think that it is racist to observe that certain types of bad behaviour are prevalent in some ethnic and cultural groups, but this is the result of culture, not of innate attributes. Comments above about the ethnicity of the driver look to me to be simply assuming that this crime reflects ethnicity rather than youth, arrogance and selfishness of a kind that is well distributed across ethnic and cultural groups.
zcacogp said:
You could bring all sorts of laws into being but they would continue to be flouted; what we see already is the result of illegal activity.
The interesting question (for me, at least) is why do some chunks of society seem to care so little for their fellow countryman? They will persistently deal drugs/run 'cash-for-crash' scams/rape vulnerable schoolgirls/hire and sub-hire supercars and kill people in them. These are all behaviours that are more prevalent (although not exclusively so) among certain bits of the UK population. Why do they feel the need to behave like this?
Before the liberals jump in - please don't bother.
Oli.
I couldn't agree more. The level of depravity and lack of care for their fellow white Christian is becoming almost ridiculous. The interesting question (for me, at least) is why do some chunks of society seem to care so little for their fellow countryman? They will persistently deal drugs/run 'cash-for-crash' scams/rape vulnerable schoolgirls/hire and sub-hire supercars and kill people in them. These are all behaviours that are more prevalent (although not exclusively so) among certain bits of the UK population. Why do they feel the need to behave like this?
Before the liberals jump in - please don't bother.
Oli.
Breadvan72 said:
I'm a (small l) liberal and I don't think that it is racist to observe that certain types of bad behaviour are prevalent in some ethnic and cultural groups, but this is the result of culture, not of innate attributes. Comments above about the ethnicity of the driver look to me to be simply assuming that this crime reflects ethnicity rather than youth, arrogance and selfishness of a kind that is well distributed across ethnic and cultural groups.
That's a balanced point of view there BV, and one I would subscribe to myself. However given that by far the largest proportion of such incidents seem to involve people (young men) from a certain demographic I'm not surprised to learn that it was committed by a young man with an Asian name. You are right in pointing out that a balance needs to be struck, and it's wrong to say that all such crimes are committed Asians - and it's equally wrong to say that all Asians commit such crimes.
Oli.
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