HADECS 3 cameras on the M25

[vonhosen]

cmaguire said:

vonhosen said:

As I said drink drive isn't the problem it was & the current powers are adequate to deal with it.

They absolutely aren't.
I could drive to the pub every night and have 7 (lucky number) or more pints. The only way I get grief is if I'm grassed up and the Police bother to respond, or if I crash and the same applies.
I don't do the pub now but plenty do. How worried are they likely to be about that 5 or 10 minute trip home?

That's nothing to do with the powers of Police or lack of.
If a Police officer had stopped you they'd need no new additional powers to have dealt with you & the current powers would not have held them back.

[cmaguire]

vonhosen said:

Point is it's played out again & again, not just you.
There are far more speeding events than drink drive events. Drink drive is far less socially acceptable than it was decades ago.

The way things are at the moment the authorities can have absolutely no idea how much drink or drug driving is occuring.

[cmaguire]

vonhosen said:

That's nothing to do with the powers of Police or lack of.
If a Police officer had stopped you they'd need no new additional powers to have dealt with you & the current powers would not have held them back.

The Police are irrelevant, you rarely ever see any bar city centres or sat on Motorways at 70/75 with a queue behind them.
Cameras is where it's at now. Lazy and lame.

[vonhosen]

cmaguire said:

vonhosen said:

That's nothing to do with the powers of Police or lack of.
If a Police officer had stopped you they'd need no new additional powers to have dealt with you & the current powers would not have held them back.

The Police are irrelevant, you rarely ever see any bar city centres or sat on Motorways at 70/75 with a queue behind them.
Cameras is where it's at now. Lazy and lame.

Yeah Police are irrelevant, just busy filling prisons.

[mybrainhurts]

vonhosen said:

cmaguire said:

vonhosen said:

That's nothing to do with the powers of Police or lack of.
If a Police officer had stopped you they'd need no new additional powers to have dealt with you & the current powers would not have held them back.

The Police are irrelevant, you rarely ever see any bar city centres or sat on Motorways at 70/75 with a queue behind them.
Cameras is where it's at now. Lazy and lame.

Yeah Police are irrelevant, just busy filling prisons.

Aye, that's cameras for you, coming over here and stealing all your jobs.

[vonhosen]

mybrainhurts said:

vonhosen said:

cmaguire said:

vonhosen said:

That's nothing to do with the powers of Police or lack of.
If a Police officer had stopped you they'd need no new additional powers to have dealt with you & the current powers would not have held them back.

The Police are irrelevant, you rarely ever see any bar city centres or sat on Motorways at 70/75 with a queue behind them.
Cameras is where it's at now. Lazy and lame.

Yeah Police are irrelevant, just busy filling prisons.

Aye, that's cameras for you, coming over here and stealing all your jobs.

They aren't stealing jobs.

They are a separate entity.

[cmaguire]

vonhosen said:

Yeah Police are irrelevant, just busy filling prisons.

An open goal, do you feel better?
The Police as regards traffic management are currently for the most part irrelevant.

[vonhosen]

cmaguire said:

vonhosen said:

Yeah Police are irrelevant, just busy filling prisons.

An open goal, do you feel better?
The Police as regards traffic management are currently for the most part irrelevant.

Traffic Police numbers have reduced, that's to do with public finances & Policing plan priorities.
I'd rather Police be dealing with rapists, robbers & thieves than traffic offences personally.
Local councils have taken on a lot of traffic enforcement, HATOs introduced on trunk roads etc, reduced Police responsibilities = fewer Roads Policing officers.

[mybrainhurts]

vonhosen said:

mybrainhurts said:

vonhosen said:

cmaguire said:

vonhosen said:

That's nothing to do with the powers of Police or lack of.
If a Police officer had stopped you they'd need no new additional powers to have dealt with you & the current powers would not have held them back.

The Police are irrelevant, you rarely ever see any bar city centres or sat on Motorways at 70/75 with a queue behind them.
Cameras is where it's at now. Lazy and lame.

Yeah Police are irrelevant, just busy filling prisons.

Aye, that's cameras for you, coming over here and stealing all your jobs.

They aren't stealing jobs.

They are a separate entity.

Oh, you missed the moaning about traffic departments being reduced because cameras are doing their job, did you? I seem to remember one traffic department being shut down when Blair blessed us with the marvel of the Gatso.

[cmaguire]

The politicization of the Police in recent years has undermined my respect for them, I see them as puppets of the State now.
A difficult job for those that care nowadays I expect.

[vonhosen]

mybrainhurts said:

vonhosen said:

mybrainhurts said:

vonhosen said:

cmaguire said:

vonhosen said:

That's nothing to do with the powers of Police or lack of.
If a Police officer had stopped you they'd need no new additional powers to have dealt with you & the current powers would not have held them back.

The Police are irrelevant, you rarely ever see any bar city centres or sat on Motorways at 70/75 with a queue behind them.
Cameras is where it's at now. Lazy and lame.

Yeah Police are irrelevant, just busy filling prisons.

Aye, that's cameras for you, coming over here and stealing all your jobs.

They aren't stealing jobs.

They are a separate entity.

Oh, you missed the moaning about traffic departments being reduced because cameras are doing their job, did you? I seem to remember one traffic department being shut down when Blair blessed us with the marvel of the Gatso.

Roads Policing numbers have been reduced because of budget cuts & Policing plan priorities, not cameras.

[vonhosen]

cmaguire said:

The politicization of the Police in recent years has undermined my respect for them, I see them as puppets of the State now.
A difficult job for those that care nowadays I expect.

The whole worlds more political now, changes in information, media & public accountability see to that.
It's any public service, military, the lot.

[cmaguire]

vonhosen said:

Roads Policing numbers have been reduced because of budget cuts & Policing plan priorities, not cameras.

Those cameras are a public relations disaster for the Police

[vonhosen]

cmaguire said:

vonhosen said:

Roads Policing numbers have been reduced because of budget cuts & Policing plan priorities, not cameras.

Those cameras are a public relations disaster for the Police

So you say, is that what the approval/satisfaction data shows?

[cmaguire]

vonhosen said:

So you say, is that what the approval/satisfaction data shows?

I'm surprised you would argue that point. I hear plenty of anti-Police comments regarding the cameras, whereas the support for cameras (which usually revolves around urban areas) rarely generates any reference to the Police at all.

[mybrainhurts]

vonhosen said:

cmaguire said:

vonhosen said:

Roads Policing numbers have been reduced because of budget cuts & Policing plan priorities, not cameras.

Those cameras are a public relations disaster for the Police

So you say, is that what the approval/satisfaction data shows?

You mean those dishonest rigged questionnaires put out by the speed camera partnerships?

As in..

Q...Do you think speed cameras make drivers obey the speed limit?

Unavoidable answer...Yes

PR release...The public agrees with speed cameras.

This disgraceful, underhand spin has been a tool for a long time.

[vonhosen]

mybrainhurts said:

vonhosen said:

cmaguire said:

vonhosen said:

Roads Policing numbers have been reduced because of budget cuts & Policing plan priorities, not cameras.

Those cameras are a public relations disaster for the Police

So you say, is that what the approval/satisfaction data shows?

You mean those dishonest rigged questionnaires put out by the speed camera partnerships?

As in..

Q...Do you think speed cameras make drivers obey the speed limit?

Unavoidable answer...Yes

PR release...The public agrees with speed cameras.

This disgraceful, underhand spin has been a tool for a long time.

No as in Police approval/satisfaction (no mention of cameras).
If the association is a PR disaster it will have an effect on approval outside of that.

[cmaguire]

vonhosen said:

No as in Police approval/satisfaction (no mention of cameras).
If the association is a PR disaster it will have an effect on approval outside of that.

Is Police approval/satisfaction high? That sounds unlikely, unless measured against some real low point a few years back. Most people I speak to that have had dealings with the Police are leaning towards the negative.
I would have thought approval was way higher 30 years ago.

[mybrainhurts]

vonhosen said:

No as in Police approval/satisfaction (no mention of cameras).
If the association is a PR disaster it will have an effect on approval outside of that.

Interesting. Tell us more about these approval/satisfaction things. How are they conducted and what are the results?

Have to say, you lads try to do a magnificent job, but you seem to be too few in number and concentrating too much on stuff that counsellors should be doing.

We even beat you in tracing a hit and run car that wrote off one of ours. When we located it and blocked it in a car park, we were half a mile from the police station and they couln't find anybody to attend at 4pm.

Not very impressed with that.

[The Mad Monk]

mybrainhurts said:

vonhosen said:

mybrainhurts said:

Remind me, how many few motorway casualties are caused by excessive speed?

In part because we have enforced limits encouraging compliance?

You mean the limits that cause bunching that results in accidents through bunching?

It's people driving closely together that causes bunching.

A speed limit is an inanimate abstract concept.

Edited by The Mad Monk on Sunday 4th December 10:59