"What has happened to our police force?"
Discussion
I was making the point about quiet nights and every police officer in town arriving without realising a 'domestic' had been mentioned earlier in the thread.
It's something a Fireman has told me about too, as well as witnessing it for myself.
I was chatting to someone in retail last year. Seems two officers had arrived to deal with a shoplifter without either of them having the Restorative Justice paperwork on them or in the police vehicle so they'd gone off to the police station to get the paperwork and to return. While I was chatting to them they said they weren't impressed with the police and cited an incident in their street one early evening where they said 17 police vehicles were there. That could be an exaggeration on their part about the number of vehicles and they seemed to have a common beef about the police having to have such nice new vehicles. That may tally with them quoting 17 police vehicles in the street.
I've seen about half a dozen vehicles at a scene that was far from World War 3. It was a bit like teacher pupil ratios but was about half a dozen police for each ne'erdowell, but as you know each situation is different and who can tell how serious a situation is before they get there.
It's something a Fireman has told me about too, as well as witnessing it for myself.
I was chatting to someone in retail last year. Seems two officers had arrived to deal with a shoplifter without either of them having the Restorative Justice paperwork on them or in the police vehicle so they'd gone off to the police station to get the paperwork and to return. While I was chatting to them they said they weren't impressed with the police and cited an incident in their street one early evening where they said 17 police vehicles were there. That could be an exaggeration on their part about the number of vehicles and they seemed to have a common beef about the police having to have such nice new vehicles. That may tally with them quoting 17 police vehicles in the street.
I've seen about half a dozen vehicles at a scene that was far from World War 3. It was a bit like teacher pupil ratios but was about half a dozen police for each ne'erdowell, but as you know each situation is different and who can tell how serious a situation is before they get there.
carinaman said:
I was making the point about quiet nights and every police officer in town arriving without realising a 'domestic' had been mentioned earlier in the thread.
If you are going to make general points about situations which are nothing to do with what is being discussed and which are not actually relevant then it might be worth pointing that out to avoid any confusion (especially when your posts are usually so succinct and germane). Cat
I'll ask the Met to re-label the graph next time.
davepoth said:
I think he's referring to the police officers who are tasked to sit in the mobile camera van all day eating pasties. There are perhaps more pressing jobs they could be attending to, such as walking through town and interacting with the population in a non confrontational manner?
I think they're all civilian posts now. I have read through this thread with interests as the police and police work interests me as it was my other career option before I joined the army and I often wonder what if!
I have no real knowledge of the police beside what is shown on tv and in other media which obviously has some bias but it seems to me that the problem is no with the police, besides some funding issues, it is with what happens after the police work has been done and the villain is in the hands of the cps and prison service. It seems to me that there is no real incentive not to be caught and punished for crimes and therefore there is no reason for them to not commit crime again.
I was discussing this with a couple of friends at work and we used the example of cutting down the numbers to a group of 100 people representing the population and , using made up figures , you had two in that group who were constantly stealing, 4 or 5 who spent there time bullying others and several who liked to damage other peoples things, in a small group they would not be able to stay in the group so that is the incentive not to do it, being removed from the group is worse than being in the group.
I don't really know what the answer is as in this day and age you cannot have a prison like a medieval prison for example but there seems to be a failure in preventing people seeing crime as a suitable career.
I apologise if this doesn't really make sense! Also when I say prison service I'm not referring to the people working in prisons but the system as a whole
I have no real knowledge of the police beside what is shown on tv and in other media which obviously has some bias but it seems to me that the problem is no with the police, besides some funding issues, it is with what happens after the police work has been done and the villain is in the hands of the cps and prison service. It seems to me that there is no real incentive not to be caught and punished for crimes and therefore there is no reason for them to not commit crime again.
I was discussing this with a couple of friends at work and we used the example of cutting down the numbers to a group of 100 people representing the population and , using made up figures , you had two in that group who were constantly stealing, 4 or 5 who spent there time bullying others and several who liked to damage other peoples things, in a small group they would not be able to stay in the group so that is the incentive not to do it, being removed from the group is worse than being in the group.
I don't really know what the answer is as in this day and age you cannot have a prison like a medieval prison for example but there seems to be a failure in preventing people seeing crime as a suitable career.
I apologise if this doesn't really make sense! Also when I say prison service I'm not referring to the people working in prisons but the system as a whole
Greendubber said:
Cat said:
Clearly. If you did then you would not pose the question as to whether the officers were bored and attending because a domestic is exciting.
Cat
They do all they can to avoid going where I am, quiet night or not!Cat
Rovinghawk said:
La Liga said:
The data and indications don't change because the reader doesn't know what the labels mean.
If you're going to present information, it's your responsibility for its meaning to be clear.The military teach that, I'm surprised that the police don't.
t. XCP said:
On the other hand, if someone who knows what they are talking about, tells you something, why don't you accept it for what it is. Just because you do not know what an acronym means, does not reduce the validity of the illustration. You didn't say 'I don't know what this means', you just claimed it was wrong. It isn't. You were.
The statement was that it indicated national information. The quote was that it was representative of London, where it was sampled.The contradiction is the poster's responsibility to explain, not the reader's to decrypt.
Rovinghawk said:
The quote was that it was representative of London, where it was sampled.
The quote was to answer this question and explain the methodology:Hooli said:
I see the evidence, but it's not backed up with the people I know. I wonder how they picked who to ask?
It explains exactly how people are asked, therefore answering the question. You then decided to cross-reference the irrelevant part as you couldn't resist to try and pick holes when there was no need. It's like moaning the referee didn't explain the offside rule to distract people from seeing you lost the match.
La Liga said:
t explains exactly how people are asked, therefore answering the question. You then decided to cross-reference the irrelevant part as you couldn't resist to try and pick holes when there was no need.
It's like moaning the referee didn't explain the offside rule to distract people from seeing you lost the match.
If you provide evidence to support your position, don't complain when contradictions within your evidence are pointed out. It's what debates are all about.It's like moaning the referee didn't explain the offside rule to distract people from seeing you lost the match.
Let's move on.
carinaman said:
While I was chatting to them they said they weren't impressed with the police and cited an incident in their street one early evening where they said 17 police vehicles were there. That could be an exaggeration on their part about the number of vehicles and they seemed to have a common beef about the police having to have such nice new vehicles. That may tally with them quoting 17 police vehicles in the street.
I've seen about half a dozen vehicles at a scene that was far from World War 3. It was a bit like teacher pupil ratios but was about half a dozen police for each ne'erdowell, but as you know each situation is different and who can tell how serious a situation is before they get there.
17 vehicles. I believe it. And shoplifters being critical of the police. Good.I've seen about half a dozen vehicles at a scene that was far from World War 3. It was a bit like teacher pupil ratios but was about half a dozen police for each ne'erdowell, but as you know each situation is different and who can tell how serious a situation is before they get there.
the comment about six vehicle turning up and the incident not being WW3: you were not, I assume, privy to the content of the original call. Further, there are many situations where an excess of officers is the only reason that number of officers could be deemed an excess. If one officer responds to an incident where three are required and all sort of problems can occur.
We had CCTV in Brighton town centre and it allowed the control room to resource incidents correctly. A 'big fight' could well be handbags at dawn, an incident that could be dealt with by one officer on foot, or equally a big fight where the total shift might not be enough. Often the informant is making off so there is no way of gauging the proper response. So you have to send a double-crewed unit (ah! those days), move another mobile nearer to the incident location just in case, and then inform a third unit - if you have one - of the possibility of an urgent call.
Also, most officers want to work. If there is a call that might, just might, require back-up then they'll make their way in that general direction just in case. And then, as they are nearby, they might as well attend. Whilst it is poor use of resources, it is hard to slap down keen officers.
Greendubber said:
Mk3Spitfire said:
I wasn't condescending. I was speaking from experience, and am aware you are unable to.
You can ridicule as much as you like. You carry on living in your nice little culdesac, naive to what some people are like.
Did they not let one or two drift off when it was established there was no need for them? Can you answer that?
Wasting your time.You can ridicule as much as you like. You carry on living in your nice little culdesac, naive to what some people are like.
Did they not let one or two drift off when it was established there was no need for them? Can you answer that?
Forget offering operational experience on these pages, you'll always be wrong in the eyes of some.
Too many is better than too few.
Our tactics lend towards preventing issues rather than using force. Sometimes a 'show of strength' is appropriate. I'd have thought the public would be happy officers are quite willing and happy to all travel to incidents if they are free.
Derek makes an important point. The content of the information received can be drastically different to what is occurring. It's probably hard to imagine until you experience just how different the two can be on occasions for whatever the reasons are. Language barriers can aggravate this even more so.
We had a call to an area of 15 fighting with weapons. It was a group of 6-10 year olds play-fighting with sticks. Several police cars probably looked silly to the casual observer (although most were cancelled prior to arrival), but you get the point.
Our tactics lend towards preventing issues rather than using force. Sometimes a 'show of strength' is appropriate. I'd have thought the public would be happy officers are quite willing and happy to all travel to incidents if they are free.
Derek makes an important point. The content of the information received can be drastically different to what is occurring. It's probably hard to imagine until you experience just how different the two can be on occasions for whatever the reasons are. Language barriers can aggravate this even more so.
We had a call to an area of 15 fighting with weapons. It was a group of 6-10 year olds play-fighting with sticks. Several police cars probably looked silly to the casual observer (although most were cancelled prior to arrival), but you get the point.
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