"What has happened to our police force?"
Discussion
Rovinghawk said:
I didn't realise the streets had become so lawless; I suppose it's what comes of living in a cul-de-sac. From your description I'm surprised that you didn't have SAS on call- you NEVER know what's going to happen and a sense of proportion could be catastrophic.
You're right about one thing - you never know what is going to happen.Your posts continue in the same vein - belittling police officers. (you know, the people who have actually been there, dealt with the incidents, picked up the pieces, etc. etc.).
Speaking as someone who has been there - and got the scars and debilitating injuries as a result, your posts disgust me.
People need to remember the unique way in which the police operate over here. We're pretty much the only country in the world that doesn't have routine arming of officers. This is very significant in a number of ways, but let's just consider the tactical significance. It means nearly all force has to be close contact rather than standing off and contain.
The result is the risk is transferred to the officer rather than the subject. Numbers reduce this risk and are the most effective way to control situations in the absence of devices such as Tasers and firearms
The result is the risk is transferred to the officer rather than the subject. Numbers reduce this risk and are the most effective way to control situations in the absence of devices such as Tasers and firearms
I posted a video on page 6 I think where a young man who was accused by a plain clothes officer of doing a handbrake turn eventually had 8/9 police officers called out to 'deal' with the ongoing incident.
The video may be cringeworthy but watching it makes me wonder why was back up required? I am obviously not a policeman but I cant see anything in that video that made the plain clothes officer require that many back up officers if at all any.
The driver didnt look/sound a threat, he just came across as someone who didnt like the police and knew a bit of the law. Surely this is not a crime.
The video may be cringeworthy but watching it makes me wonder why was back up required? I am obviously not a policeman but I cant see anything in that video that made the plain clothes officer require that many back up officers if at all any.
The driver didnt look/sound a threat, he just came across as someone who didnt like the police and knew a bit of the law. Surely this is not a crime.
t.Eclassy said:
She is just a disillusioned CRO. Law abidding citizens love the police and the way they operate.
Really! Have you tried calling the police lately?We used to have fantastic local police with a station very close and regular patrols. I can't recall when I last saw a policeman\woman on foot anwyere outside of the cities.
carinaman said:
From experience, are they avoiding the jobs you get involved with or avoiding you?
They are avoiding domestics like the plague.If an open shout comes uo for a DV job no one will volunteer, if its a burglary in progress there will be no end of people wanting to go to it.
Domestics are the least favoured jobs of all.
La Liga said:
People need to remember the unique way in which the police operate over here. We're pretty much the only country in the world that doesn't have routine arming of officers. This is very significant in a number of ways, but let's just consider the tactical significance. It means nearly all force has to be close contact rather than standing off and contain.
The result is the risk is transferred to the officer rather than the subject. Numbers reduce this risk and are the most effective way to control situations in the absence of devices such as Tasers and firearms
This supports my view, that it is the one or two officers dealing with the public who are subject to the greatest risks. In the other circumstances both calculated and by effect, most the risk is transferred to the suspect. The result is the risk is transferred to the officer rather than the subject. Numbers reduce this risk and are the most effective way to control situations in the absence of devices such as Tasers and firearms
On the wider point the Police services in my view and experience are preferable to 30 years ago.
ED209 said:
The police are probably more professional than ever however you simply cannot do more and more with less and less resources. I am talking about being the social/health service of last resort.
The governments anti police agenda and media spin hasn't helped either.
There is a lot of truth in that. I'm not blaming the police we have but there do not seem to be enough of them and I suspect that they are bogged down in paperwork.The governments anti police agenda and media spin hasn't helped either.
What I am saying is that 20 + years ago if I needed to call the police they turned up quickly and were usually able to sort the problem. Now all I get is a crime number and the offer of a victim support visit.
Greendubber said:
carinaman said:
From experience, are they avoiding the jobs you get involved with or avoiding you?
They are avoiding domestics like the plague.If an open shout comes uo for a DV job no one will volunteer, if its a burglary in progress there will be no end of people wanting to go to it.
Domestics are the least favoured jobs of all.
The types of incidents that people joined to police are so few and far between people need some sweet amongst the sour.
bad company said:
We used to have fantastic local police with a station very close and regular patrols. I can't recall when I last saw a policeman\woman on foot anwyere outside of the cities.
The problem is that in anything other than densely populated areas foot patrol simply isn't efficient. The change in technology over the past 15 years (mobile phones) increased police demand dramatically and the police have to be primarily in cars to attend the volume of incidents. La Liga said:
he problem is that in anything other than densely populated areas foot patrol simply isn't efficient. The change in technology over the past 15 years (mobile phones) increased police demand dramatically and the police have to be primarily in cars to attend the volume of incidents.
The result is that all I get is a crime number and the offer of a victim support visit. The police cuts have drastically reduced the service offered I would say to an unacceptable point. bad company said:
The result is that all I get is a crime number and the offer of a victim support visit. The police cuts have drastically reduced the service offered I would say to an unacceptable point.
People have no comprehension of the damage that has been done. My force has had to close 31 out of 40 stations. Vast swathes of our important back room technical staff have gone. The typists who used to transcribe our interviews have gone. (We now spend hours having to do it ourselves). Our vehicles and equipment are worn out. We've now found out that a further £32 million has to be cut next year. There is no meat left on the bone. No fat, no gristle, no marrow. But it's ok, frontline services are apparently unaffected. May and Cameron say so. La Liga said:
he problem is that in anything other than densely populated areas foot patrol simply isn't efficient. The change in technology over the past 15 years (mobile phones) increased police demand dramatically and the police have to be primarily in cars to attend the volume of incidents.
I'd disagree with the term efficient there. Perhaps it would be better to say that the police cannot afford to patrol in most places.I think the best way of gaining information and getting the public onside is to patrol. I think the best way of finding out what the public wants from the police is for someone to go out on foot in uniform and to interact. It was expensive in the past but not impossible. But as I say, the past.
I used to be the ID officer for my force and we used to get all sorts as volunteers. They used to put information our way. Not much, but often important. When I ran a shift in Brighton, we had a two-man unit to deal with the vagrants. When the body of a murder victim was found my lads got the name of the offender before the incident room had been set up.
But as you say, the massive increase in calls, the demands of PACE - all unfunded, which even the most paranoid of anti-police ranters must admit, to themselves if not on here, as very efficient - and the plethora of new laws has all meant that patrol is a thing of the past. Shame. One of the most rewarding parts of the job.
Mk3Spitfire]ooli said:
I see the evidence, but it's not backed up with the people I know.
So you would only accept the evidence as evidence...if it was from a survey of people you knew?What I said was, the results of that survey doesn't match the views of people I know. Or indeed my own views.
FWIW I think the police have got a LOT better than they were 15-20 years ago, but they'd gone a long way downhill to get where they were & it's still a long way back up to a decent level of service.
Elroy Blue said:
We've now found out that a further £32 million has to be cut next year. There is no meat left on the bone. No fat, no gristle, no marrow.
We can apparently fund trips to Portugal supervising a dig, though. Is it 6 detectives over there currently?All this for a crime committed abroad many years ago.
Rovinghawk said:
We can apparently fund trips to Portugal supervising a dig, though. Is it 6 detectives over there currently?
All this for a crime committed abroad many years ago.
I agree with you on must things you say about the police and I am as anti-police as they come but you can not tell me you do not find it disturbing that the police budget is being cut, officers reduced and police stations closed at a time when the population is ever increasing.All this for a crime committed abroad many years ago.
If that was my daughter that was missing, God forbid, I would want the police to do as much as they can to find her, dead or alive. Do you remember the Torso in the River? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adam_%28murder_victim... I was fresh of the boat then and still marvelled at the way the UK police worked. Then, I had so much respect and trust in them and I was pleasnatly suprised at how no stone was left unturned in getting to the bottom of that case.
I can remember thinking of even becoming a Special back then. How times have changed. To show you how much I dislike anything police, I recently left a cinema 10 minutes into a movie (Ride Along) when I found out the main actor (Ice Cube from the NWA fame) was playing the part of a policeman.
Edited by Eclassy on Wednesday 4th June 14:38
Eclassy said:
I agree with you on must things you say about the police and I am as anti-police as they come but you can not tell me you do not find it disturbing that the police budget is being cut, officers reduced and police stations closed at a time when the population is ever increasing.
I'm actually in favour of decent police budgets. However, I question some of their spending priorities.Eclassy said:
If that was my daughter that was mising, God forbid, I would want the police to do as much as they can to find her, dead or alive.
It happened abroad, years ago. If the parents were less articulate & PR-savvy they would have been pilloried for their actions.There are many kids going missing in this country- why does this one rate higher priority than others?
Rovinghawk said:
I'm actually in favour of decent police budgets. However, I question some of their spending priorities
.Rovinghawk said:
It happened abroad, years ago. If the parents were less articulate & PR-savvy they would have been pilloried for their actions.
There are many kids going missing in this country- why does this one rate higher priority than others?
Point taken and understoodThere are many kids going missing in this country- why does this one rate higher priority than others?
Cheers
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