Discussion
I agree that weighing time/effort is up to you.
I think they've left you in a worse situation than you were in before the oil change; they failed to do all of the work you specified and who's now to say the mechanic changed the oil/filter correctly (used the right oil, filter, gasket etc). It isn't that they merely did the oil change. They've actually left you in a position that requires you to have what they've done checked and the only way to do that is to do the work all over again to be confident the car is in safe working condition.
It suggests the mechanic hadn't been told in advance, if he had, he should certainly have informed you he couldn't sort the light out before he started. They may owe you more than the cost of the oil change, they need to prove they didn't damage to your car.
I think they've left you in a worse situation than you were in before the oil change; they failed to do all of the work you specified and who's now to say the mechanic changed the oil/filter correctly (used the right oil, filter, gasket etc). It isn't that they merely did the oil change. They've actually left you in a position that requires you to have what they've done checked and the only way to do that is to do the work all over again to be confident the car is in safe working condition.
It suggests the mechanic hadn't been told in advance, if he had, he should certainly have informed you he couldn't sort the light out before he started. They may owe you more than the cost of the oil change, they need to prove they didn't damage to your car.
Mr Snap said:
I agree that weighing time/effort is up to you.
I think they've left you in a worse situation than you were in before the oil change; they failed to do all of the work you specified and who's now to say the mechanic changed the oil/filter correctly (used the right oil, filter, gasket etc). It isn't that they merely did the oil change. They've actually left you in a position that requires you to have what they've done checked and the only way to do that is to do the work all over again to be confident the car is in safe working condition.
It suggests the mechanic hadn't been told in advance, if he had, he should certainly have informed you he couldn't sort the light out before he started. They may owe you more than the cost of the oil change, they need to prove they didn't damage to your car.
Sorry, but without any supporting evidence, this is rubbish.I think they've left you in a worse situation than you were in before the oil change; they failed to do all of the work you specified and who's now to say the mechanic changed the oil/filter correctly (used the right oil, filter, gasket etc). It isn't that they merely did the oil change. They've actually left you in a position that requires you to have what they've done checked and the only way to do that is to do the work all over again to be confident the car is in safe working condition.
It suggests the mechanic hadn't been told in advance, if he had, he should certainly have informed you he couldn't sort the light out before he started. They may owe you more than the cost of the oil change, they need to prove they didn't damage to your car.
They were contracted to do an oil change and reset the service computer. They did the oil change. They couldn't do the computer. Aside from a partial refund being owed, there is no consequence to this other than the OP having to find someone to do it. Damages are likely to be in the order of what that omitted piece was worth as part of the contracted job, i.e. significantly less than £90.
Failure to do that piece doesn't mean they damaged the car, doesn't mean it has to be checked, and leaves the OP in a better position than he originally was in by virtue of having new oil.
Edited by trashbat on Monday 16th June 13:20
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz said:
If you haven't done so already, write to them outlining your position and what you'd like them to do about it, and, importantly, give them a period of time to respond (14 days or so would be reasonable), after which you will initiate the claim if you haven't heard anything.
Bear in mind that the company have done the body of the work, so you perhaps ought not feel entitled to the full cost of the work. I would have thought it sensible to get a couple of quotes from garages to reset the light and suggest this as the compromise figure.
OP - YOU MUST DO THIS BEFORE YOU GO TO MONEY CLAIM ONLINEBear in mind that the company have done the body of the work, so you perhaps ought not feel entitled to the full cost of the work. I would have thought it sensible to get a couple of quotes from garages to reset the light and suggest this as the compromise figure.
Otherwise, if it went to court, which it wouldn't, but, you probably wouldn't end up with your court costs paid for by them. Also, the court will want to see how you've tried to settle things before court. My advice:
Firstly, find your email from them agreeing to the service indicator change - reply, explaining it's not been done. Give them the option of coming back to do it, or for them to refund the amount for AR to do it - explaining to them they will only do it if they change the oil, thus the cost will be X.
Only if that doesn't work consider escalating things.
The reason why that will work is that you are planting back on the desk of the person who advised you. They will reinforce that they are correct by sorting it for you, or, they have to admit they got it wrong, and have to refund you.
Game theory in action.
trashbat said:
Failure to do that piece doesn't mean they damaged the car, doesn't mean it has to be checked, and leaves the OP in a better position than he originally was in by virtue of having new oil.
In law, possibly. However, from a process point of view, it does make sense.Google the legend of Van Halen and what would happen if on their tour rider they found the brown M&Ms weren't taken out of the M&M bowl!
it's ok zzz and justin, have already sent an e-mail to them advising of "notice before action" and all that jazz. gave them 28 days to respond, to which they have ignored.
There had been quite a long e-mail chain in which they repeatedly refused to do anything, not phone as I realised I should keep it documented.
There had been quite a long e-mail chain in which they repeatedly refused to do anything, not phone as I realised I should keep it documented.
castex said:
Unless you're looking to sell just get it done next time after 10,000 miles or whatever. Those lights are not for the benefit of people like us - you know the car's been treated right. Going after this company is not going to be worth the hassle, IMHO.
I have OCD and would not drive the car with warning light on even if its fine. MY mate had a conversion done and de-cat his system, and the EML is on constantly. OCD OCD OCDEfbe said:
it's ok zzz and justin, have already sent an e-mail to them advising of "notice before action" and all that jazz. gave them 28 days to respond, to which they have ignored.
There had been quite a long e-mail chain in which they repeatedly refused to do anything, not phone as I realised I should keep it documented.
Are you sure they got the notice?There had been quite a long e-mail chain in which they repeatedly refused to do anything, not phone as I realised I should keep it documented.
Service by email is a bit of a grey area. Not least because it is seen less formal, and easier to claim 'Didn't get it, Sir...' at which point eyes are on you to show you warned them.
That said, my pet hate are people/companies who essentially ignore the issue with the knowledge that the ratio of people who complain and actually follow through with legal action is about 97% to 3%.
Have they got a head office or MD to write to? Service on a Ltd Co should be to the Registered Office.
mikesalt said:
Pick up an adapter for less than £10, and reset it yourself.
I would need the £50 version of the software, and even then it wouldn't be guaranteed not to balls up the car.It is quite annoying how hard this is to do, but that's where i'm at!
How long are you going to keep this car? How long are you going to keep owning Fiat Group cars? How many more times are you going to do servicing from random non-specialists?
If that adds up to enough, then buy the tool FFS. Even if you managed to claw all your service money back, you still don't have anyone to do the job.
If that adds up to enough, then buy the tool FFS. Even if you managed to claw all your service money back, you still don't have anyone to do the job.
I won't bother adding any comments to the legal stuff but on the teckky side, I'm guessing that the car is a diesel in which case the resets on Fiat/Alfa are pretty fussy and not many in the general motor trade can do them. It all links in to the DPF monitoring and there's a reasonable chance that if left on for long enough the vehicle may drop into limp mode. The Multiscan may do the resets but I wouldn't count on it on all models.
It could also be worth confirming that the mechanic used the correct oil as for diesel + DPF it would need to be a low ash version (oe if it's still under warranty) which makes £90 including parts and labour pretty cheap………….
It could also be worth confirming that the mechanic used the correct oil as for diesel + DPF it would need to be a low ash version (oe if it's still under warranty) which makes £90 including parts and labour pretty cheap………….
Hi All
so could do with some help again on this one!
I did file this through moneyclaimonline to the small claims court, and after an acknowledgement of service a lawyer has finally replied with two points which I could do with knowing roughly where they/I stand on this
firstly they say:
"your claim has no basis in law because the contract is not with ClickMechanic. The contract to undertake the work on your car was with the particular mechanic, xxxxx of xxx. This is because a contract in law is made between parties which exchange 'consideration' (i.e. the legal term for a price paid, and the service rendered). As you will see fro your invoice, you paid consideration to the mechanic, the person with whom you were in contract."
which they also say is in their terms:
"A Booking represents a contract between you and the Mechanic. By using the Website to request the services of a Mechanic, you authorise ClickMechanic to collect payments relating to the Booking on behalf of a Mechanic, including any discretionary charges stated in this Agreement. You accept that ClickMechanic bears no liability for any services performed as part of a Booking, or for any warranties or assurances given."
The second part of the defence revolves around whether they had said they would reset the oil service counter or not. Though I would be willing to see what a Judge says on this one.
So what do you guys think?
so could do with some help again on this one!
I did file this through moneyclaimonline to the small claims court, and after an acknowledgement of service a lawyer has finally replied with two points which I could do with knowing roughly where they/I stand on this
firstly they say:
"your claim has no basis in law because the contract is not with ClickMechanic. The contract to undertake the work on your car was with the particular mechanic, xxxxx of xxx. This is because a contract in law is made between parties which exchange 'consideration' (i.e. the legal term for a price paid, and the service rendered). As you will see fro your invoice, you paid consideration to the mechanic, the person with whom you were in contract."
which they also say is in their terms:
"A Booking represents a contract between you and the Mechanic. By using the Website to request the services of a Mechanic, you authorise ClickMechanic to collect payments relating to the Booking on behalf of a Mechanic, including any discretionary charges stated in this Agreement. You accept that ClickMechanic bears no liability for any services performed as part of a Booking, or for any warranties or assurances given."
The second part of the defence revolves around whether they had said they would reset the oil service counter or not. Though I would be willing to see what a Judge says on this one.
So what do you guys think?
trashbat said:
I think you're claiming against the wrong entity, as they suggest.
How much of the advice in this thread did you follow?
depends on which bits you mean.How much of the advice in this thread did you follow?
I would get this if they had just put me in contact with him, but they arranged brokered the work to be carried out.
They told the mechanic what work to carry out, I didn't ask him to do a thing, he just did what they asked him to do.
I was also in a contract as soona s I booked through their website, not when the mechanic turned up, therefore I had assumed the contract was with them
The mechanic also used a clickmechanic app on his phone to take payment.
Of course, I am no lawyer
I'm not a lawyer either, but what they say about consideration is correct. You only have a contract with the person you paid. Depending on how it works, the mechanic might have a contract with the website company to advertise his services and act as a booking agent, but that's immaterial to you.
trashbat said:
I'm not a lawyer either, but what they say about consideration is correct. You only have a contract with the person you paid. Depending on how it works, the mechanic might have a contract with the website company to advertise his services and act as a booking agent, but that's immaterial to you.
well this says a legal contract is "The next step is for someone to accept the offer. This is the moment when the contract is created."http://www.advicenow.org.uk/advicenow-guides/consu...
Read the next section ('Price'). A contract needs offer, acceptance and consideration.
Look up how similar operations work. This is from ABTA:
Look up how similar operations work. This is from ABTA:
ABTA said:
Who is my contract with?
When you book your arrangements through a travel agent, their job is to place you in contract with a supplier of services, known as the principal. Suppliers can be accommodation-only, a flight provider or a tour operator, depending on what you've arranged with your agent. Although you've paid the travel agent, this doesn't mean that you've made a contract with them. It's the principal that's contractually bound to supply the travel services you booked.
When you book your arrangements through a travel agent, their job is to place you in contract with a supplier of services, known as the principal. Suppliers can be accommodation-only, a flight provider or a tour operator, depending on what you've arranged with your agent. Although you've paid the travel agent, this doesn't mean that you've made a contract with them. It's the principal that's contractually bound to supply the travel services you booked.
Edited by trashbat on Wednesday 16th July 21:49
with ABTA it's a bit different because you are told of whom you have the contract with; i.e. which plane company.
In this case I had no links to the mechanic at all.
I have checked a few other resources, and all talk about offer and acceptance. i.e.: http://www.e-lawresources.co.uk/Offer-and-acceptan...
As for resolution, we exchanged e-mails for a while; (I wanted to keep it documented), and asked for them to help, get another mechanic out, just pay for the additional work to be done elsewhere, and partial compensation.
The amount isn't much, just over £100
In this case I had no links to the mechanic at all.
I have checked a few other resources, and all talk about offer and acceptance. i.e.: http://www.e-lawresources.co.uk/Offer-and-acceptan...
As for resolution, we exchanged e-mails for a while; (I wanted to keep it documented), and asked for them to help, get another mechanic out, just pay for the additional work to be done elsewhere, and partial compensation.
The amount isn't much, just over £100
Edited by Efbe on Wednesday 16th July 21:59
Again, I'm not a lawyer by anyone's standards, but I was taught contract law by one. Eh, whatever.
Edit: if you somehow win £100 then presumably you'll be buying the mechanic some new oil to replace the stuff he gave you. You're suing the wrong entity for the wrong amount. The process might hammer out the correct value of the latter for you, but it won't go anywhere at all until you correct the former. If you proceed anyway and are found to be pursuing the wrong party, you will also end up liable for costs.
Edit: if you somehow win £100 then presumably you'll be buying the mechanic some new oil to replace the stuff he gave you. You're suing the wrong entity for the wrong amount. The process might hammer out the correct value of the latter for you, but it won't go anywhere at all until you correct the former. If you proceed anyway and are found to be pursuing the wrong party, you will also end up liable for costs.
Edited by trashbat on Wednesday 16th July 22:09
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