From 1 October 2014, the paper tax disc will no longer need
Discussion
Henry-F said:
There is another thing which needs to be sorted out and that's what happens to the tax remaining on our stock cars come October. When we buy a car in we consider remaining tax. If it's got the thick end of £500 remaining we pay more for the car knowing we can ask a bit more at the other end either directly because of the tax or benefit from an inducement to purchase. If that tax goes back to the original person we bought the car from then we have been robbed. We are currently holding over £2,000 in complete unexpired months of road tax.
Whoever decided that was a good business model is a complete muppet.It's quite simple... Cash in NOW what you've got on your stock. When you buy in, don't factor in the price of the tax. Get a couple of cheap loan cars. I'd be amazed if you don't find it actually beneficial to your bottom line. Just like every other trader has done for ever.
speedking31 said:
xactly. Works perfectly well for MOTs without any problem. OTOH I don't see anywhere where it says that monthly periods will be maintained so my optimistic side says maybe there will be a real benefit for consumers 
From the OP's link:Linky said:
If you sell a vehicle after 1 October and you have notified DVLA, you will automatically get a refund for any full calendar months left on the vehicle tax.
andLinky said:
From 1 October, when you buy a vehicle, the vehicle tax will no longer be transferred with the vehicle. You will need to get new vehicle tax before you can use the vehicle.
gareth_r said:
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/dvla-cuts-unnec...
Motorists will no longer need motor insurance policies to be checked when getting their vehicle tax.
Thanks for that. I thought that had changed but I wasn't sure. I taxed my car on the interweb the other day and it the DVLA website still confirmed it had checked the MOT as it always used to, but there was nothing about checking insurance like there used to be.Motorists will no longer need motor insurance policies to be checked when getting their vehicle tax.
SK425 said:
speedking31 said:
xactly. Works perfectly well for MOTs without any problem. OTOH I don't see anywhere where it says that monthly periods will be maintained so my optimistic side says maybe there will be a real benefit for consumers
From the OP's link:Linky said:
If you sell a vehicle after 1 October and you have notified DVLA, you will automatically get a refund for any full calendar months left on the vehicle tax.
andLinky said:
From 1 October, when you buy a vehicle, the vehicle tax will no longer be transferred with the vehicle. You will need to get new vehicle tax before you can use the vehicle.
The first says that refunds will be for full calendar months. But you will have bought that tax on 1st of month. Cancellation of insurance often involves a month premium fee, but is not related specifically to the 1st of the month. The second says you have to have tax before you can use the vehicle, vehicle bought on 15th and tax on 15th is not precluded.
TooMany2cvs said:
Whoever decided that was a good business model is a complete muppet.
It's quite simple... Cash in NOW what you've got on your stock. When you buy in, don't factor in the price of the tax. Get a couple of cheap loan cars. I'd be amazed if you don't find it actually beneficial to your bottom line. Just like every other trader has done for ever.
Car dealers can't cash in road tax only the registered, or previous, keeper can.It's quite simple... Cash in NOW what you've got on your stock. When you buy in, don't factor in the price of the tax. Get a couple of cheap loan cars. I'd be amazed if you don't find it actually beneficial to your bottom line. Just like every other trader has done for ever.
TooMany2cvs said:
Roo said:
Car dealers can't cash in road tax only the registered, or previous, keeper can.
Even on stuff that's in stock off the yellow (? cba to find a V5C) slip?Furry muff. Even dafter to make an allowance for it on the buy-in value, then.
I never make an over allowance to the value of the unused VED when pricing a car. If its got some on it - great.
speedking31 said:
Do you think that those quotes in some way address my question?
The first says that refunds will be for full calendar months. But you will have bought that tax on 1st of month. Cancellation of insurance often involves a month premium fee, but is not related specifically to the 1st of the month. The second says you have to have tax before you can use the vehicle, vehicle bought on 15th and tax on 15th is not precluded.
Thinking annually to keep it simple...The first says that refunds will be for full calendar months. But you will have bought that tax on 1st of month. Cancellation of insurance often involves a month premium fee, but is not related specifically to the 1st of the month. The second says you have to have tax before you can use the vehicle, vehicle bought on 15th and tax on 15th is not precluded.
If you were buy my car on the 15th of January, it's not clear whether you would have to buy tax running from 15 Jan to 14 Jan the following year, 1 Jan to 31 Dec or (with a pro rata reduction) 15 Jan to 31 Dec, or something else. But whichever it is (the second is closest to how the tax currently works - i.e. in complete calendar months - and is also not precluded by what the link says), there will be an overlap as I will only be able to reclaim the bit I paid that covers 1 Feb onwards.
It's no different to the current system.
Tax starts on the first of the month and runs to the end of a month.
When you sold a car you had two choices:
1. Get a refund for complete months, the same as now.
2. Give away the unused months.
Now you will be guaranteed a refund as opposed to giving away money needlessly.
When you bought a car in the middle of the month you had one choice. Back date the tax to the first of the month, the same as the new system.
Tax starts on the first of the month and runs to the end of a month.
When you sold a car you had two choices:
1. Get a refund for complete months, the same as now.
2. Give away the unused months.
Now you will be guaranteed a refund as opposed to giving away money needlessly.
When you bought a car in the middle of the month you had one choice. Back date the tax to the first of the month, the same as the new system.
Roo said:
It's no different to the current system.
Tax starts on the first of the month and runs to the end of a month.
I suspect you're right, but speedking31 is abosultely right that the text in the OP's link is not definitive on that.Tax starts on the first of the month and runs to the end of a month.
Roo said:
When you sold a car you had two choices:
1. Get a refund for complete months, the same as now.
2. Give away the unused months.
Now you will be guaranteed a refund as opposed to giving away money needlessly.
I think all the people I've bought cars from considered that they were selling me the remaining portion of the tax disc, not giving it away.1. Get a refund for complete months, the same as now.
2. Give away the unused months.
Now you will be guaranteed a refund as opposed to giving away money needlessly.
Roo said:
When you bought a car in the middle of the month you had one choice. Back date the tax to the first of the month, the same as the new system.
The old system gave you a second option, which was to buy the remaining portion of the tax disc.It will be interesting to see what happens at the lower end of the used car market, the last shed (a V6 Omega) I bought had plenty of tax on it, I am not sure I would bothered to buy that car if I had to tax it myself (even if you can do it monthly) due to the relative cost of the RFL compared with the car value. I used it until the tax ran out and moved onto the next vehicle.
On the plus side one of my neighbours seems to be trading from home and currently has 5 or 6 cars parked on the street, I guess from October any cars he buys to sell on will effectively be untaxed so cannot legally be parked on the road.
I think this change is going to cause some headaches!
On the plus side one of my neighbours seems to be trading from home and currently has 5 or 6 cars parked on the street, I guess from October any cars he buys to sell on will effectively be untaxed so cannot legally be parked on the road.
I think this change is going to cause some headaches!
Edited by mini95 on Thursday 26th June 00:38
Roo said:
They weren't selling you the remainder of the tax. They were giving you money.
They could've cashed it in for a refund. It's your responsibility to tax the car once you've bought it, not theirs.
Are you assuming the value of a car when it's sold is independent of the amount of tax left on it?They could've cashed it in for a refund. It's your responsibility to tax the car once you've bought it, not theirs.
Roo said:
It's no different to the current system.
Tax starts on the first of the month and runs to the end of a month.
When you sold a car you had two choices:
1. Get a refund for complete months, the same as now.
2. Give away the unused months.
Now you will be guaranteed a refund as opposed to giving away money needlessly.
When you bought a car in the middle of the month you had one choice. Back date the tax to the first of the month, the same as the new system.
Not quite the same - today if you buy a car it will normally be taxed, anything from a few months to a year. In the new regime it will never be taxed and the new owner will always need to tax it backdated to the start of that month. If you're really unlucky and buy at the end of a month you'll pay for 6 or 12 or whatever months despite the first month having almost passed.Tax starts on the first of the month and runs to the end of a month.
When you sold a car you had two choices:
1. Get a refund for complete months, the same as now.
2. Give away the unused months.
Now you will be guaranteed a refund as opposed to giving away money needlessly.
When you bought a car in the middle of the month you had one choice. Back date the tax to the first of the month, the same as the new system.
TX.
kev1974 said:
For them to stick to the rigid month by month pricing, and the "12 months for the price of 13+" that will cause in a lot of cases, means they have to be one of greedy, incompetent, or grossly unprepared. Have to be.
Given we are talking about an unholy alliance of the Treasury and the DVLA, it is far more likely to be all three!Great posts by Henry-F and kev1974.
Particularly amused for some reason by the gratuitous bicycle riding genius.
The point about still maintaining the monthly concept as opposed to a start / finish on anyday concept was well made. That just adds to the complication of the whole thing.
The reason why is greed pure and simple. Otherwise why would another Govt hand in your pocket scheme which can deal with individual start dates, namely TV licensing only do refunds by the quarter.
Companies that have to bid for your business, eg insurance,
travel operators, have to figure out stuff like this and make it work. Legalised agencies like the DVLA don't have to bid for the business so they can be lazy and incompetent which means they don't move with the times. Add in the greed of the Treasury and here we are.
Thank heavens don't change many personal vehicles these days. Can see there are going to be more and more seizures, sometimes the only time people check their docs is when they have to get the paper disc. Maybe should organise myself a compound and a tow truck and then go schmooze the PCC for a contract.
Particularly amused for some reason by the gratuitous bicycle riding genius.
The point about still maintaining the monthly concept as opposed to a start / finish on anyday concept was well made. That just adds to the complication of the whole thing.
The reason why is greed pure and simple. Otherwise why would another Govt hand in your pocket scheme which can deal with individual start dates, namely TV licensing only do refunds by the quarter.
Companies that have to bid for your business, eg insurance,
travel operators, have to figure out stuff like this and make it work. Legalised agencies like the DVLA don't have to bid for the business so they can be lazy and incompetent which means they don't move with the times. Add in the greed of the Treasury and here we are.
Thank heavens don't change many personal vehicles these days. Can see there are going to be more and more seizures, sometimes the only time people check their docs is when they have to get the paper disc. Maybe should organise myself a compound and a tow truck and then go schmooze the PCC for a contract.
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