Racially abused - advice please.

[andy118run]

I will try not to waffle too much - just got in from work and my other half casually tells me she was called a black c**t today. I'm a white bloke, she's black African, by the way.

Obviously my first thoughts are 'what the heck?', 'You're kidding me' and similar.

Anyway, this happened around 13.00 hours today in the busy food court of a shopping mall. My other half was meeting a friend for lunch, our 4 year old was on one of these 50p slot cars with a child whose parents were nearby. The other child's mother asked my partner to remove our son as she wanted to put 50p in the car for her son. Our son didn't appreciate this and played up a bit - my other half sort of glanced over at the father as if to say 'sorry I'm struggling a bit here' etc. She was immediately met with the racial abuse described above along with other comments such as 'I'm gonna punch you'.

The whole thing lasted maybe a minute or two. Eventually the other family got up and left with the father saying something like 'she's doing my head in' but from how my partner describes it she certainly feared she was going to be assaulted during this episode.

Now, I'm no expert, which is why I'm posting here for advice. However, both my parents were police officers (long since retired) so I tend to have a bit of instinct around these things. My first thought is this should have been called into the police at the time but my partner is pretty easy going and not likely to do this. My second thought is I will call 101 in the morning and report this.

Am I being reasonable? I don't think my partner will call 101 but I really don't want to let this go. I'm pretty sure she would be happy to give a statement. Are the police likely to come round and take a statement? Would they look into this, maybe look for some CCTV, or would they just log it and let it go?

Sorry for the waffle, any advice welcome.

[Octoposse]

It's a Hate Incident - perhaps Hate Crime - so, yes, report it and it will be taken seriously. What Police force area?

[Mk3Spitfire]

They should take it seriously. Racism is a hot potato and most forces have a zero tolerance approach.
Clearly offences have been committed. Certainly racially aggravated public order, and technically racially aggravated assault too. If it was in a busy area there's a good chance of CCTV/witnesses. Only problem would be identifying the offenders. I would HOPE they would come out and deal with you properly. I'd seriously consider phoning 101...to have a chat with an officer if nothing else.

[73mark]

Report it.

[andy118run]

Octoposse said:

It's a Hate Incident - perhaps Hate Crime - so, yes, report it and it will be taken seriously. What Police force area?

It happened in Norwich.
I have just checked out the Norfolk police website and they make it pretty easy to report a 'hate crime' online. Would still rather call in and do it I think.

Edited by andy118run on Friday 25th July 23:07

[AndrewEH1]

If your partner wants to progress this through the police then call them.

Post Stephen Lawrence if a call mentions racial/hate motivations it will be investigated. At least in Scotland it will.

[andy118run]

Mk3Spitfire said:

They should take it seriously. Racism is a hot potato and most forces have a zero tolerance approach.
Clearly offences have been committed. Certainly racially aggravated public order, and technically racially aggravated assault too. If it was in a busy area there's a good chance of CCTV/witnesses. Only problem would be identifying the offenders. I would HOPE they would come out and deal with you properly. I'd seriously consider phoning 101...to have a chat with an officer if nothing else.

That's what I was a thinking - I often have to report bits and pieces to the police through my work (mental health nurse). The one thing they pretty much always come out for are racially motivated stuff.

[Mk3Spitfire]

andy118run said:

That's what I was a thinking - I often have to report bits and pieces to the police through my work (mental health nurse). The one thing they pretty much always come out for are racially motivated stuff.

Keep us updated with what you decide then. I would like to think it's dealt with properly. You should get a hate crime support officer assigned to you too if your force has them. They are a good liaison, and can help and advise.

[andy118run]

Thanks for the advice - that's all I needed really, a few folks to confirm that I was thinking along the right lines. I will keep you updated accordingly.

[ging84]

Do what ever you would do if she was called a stupid , a fat or an ugly etc by someone who then threatened to punch her. Dont over focus on the racial aspect, one use of the word black does automatically turn a scuffle into a hate crime

[Mk3Spitfire]

ging84 said:

Do what ever you would do if she was called a stupid , a fat or an ugly etc by someone who then threatened to punch her. Dont over focus on the racial aspect, one use of the word black does automatically turn a scuffle into a hate crime

Using the word black before the word c**t and threatening to punch someone at that time, does EXACTLY that...it turns it into a racially aggravated crime.

[Dairymilk]

andy118run said:

Thanks for the advice - that's all I needed really, a few folks to confirm that I was thinking along the right lines. I will keep you updated accordingly.

Don't delay the report as there may well be some video of the event.

[Osinjak]

ging84 said:

Do what ever you would do if she was called a stupid , a fat or an ugly etc by someone who then threatened to punch her. Dont over focus on the racial aspect, one use of the word black does automatically turn a scuffle into a hate crime

Did you miss out the word 'not' in your feverish state? Because if you did, you are seriously off the mark and pretty dim, frankly. See what Mk3Spitfire said, go on.

[Toltec]

Mk3Spitfire said:

ging84 said:

Do what ever you would do if she was called a stupid , a fat or an ugly etc by someone who then threatened to punch her. Dont over focus on the racial aspect, one use of the word black does automatically turn a scuffle into a hate crime

Using the word black before the word c**t and threatening to punch someone at that time, does EXACTLY that...it turns it into a racially aggravated crime.

I get what ging84 means, I think, the behaviour towards the OP's partner and child was not acceptable irrespective of any racial component. Was it however sufficiently egregious to involve the police without the inclusion of the racial epithet? Would the other party have been just as objectionable to anyone?

The way I read it the two kids were on the ride, but it was not running? So was the other mother not wanting to pay for a ride for someone else's kid or a black kid specifically? One is just being mean the other is racism.

So, yes, if the OP partner felt under threat of violence report it, then let the police work out if it was racially motivated.

[Rick101]

Sounds like you're more bothered than she is.

Thought it was probably upsetting for her at the time, its really no big deal. Personally I'd just forget about it. Kids Get called that in school every day.

[Centurion07]

Rick101 said:

Sounds like you're more bothered than she is.

Thought it was probably upsetting for her at the time, its really no big deal. Personally I'd just forget about it. Kids Get called that in school every day.

Yes, by other kids. It's a little more serious when it's an adult saying those kind of things to another adult.

[jimbop1]

Rick101 said:

Sounds like you're more bothered than she is.

Thought it was probably upsetting for her at the time, its really no big deal. Personally I'd just forget about it. Kids Get called that in school every day.

Agree.

Just to clarify..are you more bothered that she was called black than you are that she feared she may get punched?

[andy118run]

Toltec said:

Mk3Spitfire said:

ging84 said:

Do what ever you would do if she was called a stupid , a fat or an ugly etc by someone who then threatened to punch her. Dont over focus on the racial aspect, one use of the word black does automatically turn a scuffle into a hate crime

Using the word black before the word c**t and threatening to punch someone at that time, does EXACTLY that...it turns it into a racially aggravated crime.

I get what ging84 means, I think, the behaviour towards the OP's partner and child was not acceptable irrespective of any racial component. Was it however sufficiently egregious to involve the police without the inclusion of the racial epithet? Would the other party have been just as objectionable to anyone?

The way I read it the two kids were on the ride, but it was not running? So was the other mother not wanting to pay for a ride for someone else's kid or a black kid specifically? One is just being mean the other is racism.

So, yes, if the OP partner felt under threat of violence report it, then let the police work out if it was racially motivated.

Yes, both kids were sitting in the ride and it was not running. I don't think the mother wanted my son out because of his colour, more a case of (as you say) being a bit mean. My other half did mention something about offering to pay the 50p to the mother/put it in the slot but obviously things escalated.

I don't think the other mother was particularly the problem at any point, but the father just sounds like he was a nasty piece of work (apparently my partner first noticed him when he entered the food place about 10 minutes before the incident as he was loudly and repeatedly effing and blinding at his young son).

My feeling was the same as Mk3Spitfire, as soon as he preceded his abuse/threats with the word "black" it becomes racially motivated.

[Mk3Spitfire]

Rick101 said:

its really no big deal. Personally I'd just forget about it

Are you really suggesting it's acceptable for people to walk around calling people "black c**ts" and threatening to assault them? That's not the society I want to live in.
Granted, the threat alone was wrong, but the racial aspect aggravates it.
A racist incident is an incident which any party considers to be racist. It doesn't have to be the person to whom the words were directed.

Edited by Mk3Spitfire on Saturday 26th July 01:34

[anonymous-user]

Crime and Disorder Act 1998 S.28 said:

(1) An offence is racially or religiously aggravated] for the purposes of sections 29 to 32 below if:

(a) at the time of committing the offence, or immediately before or after doing so, the offender demonstrates towards the victim of the offence hostility based on the victim’s membership (or presumed membership) of a racial or religious group; or

(b) the offence is motivated (wholly or partly) by hostility towards members of a racial or religious group based on their membership of that group.