Azelle Rodney Murder Charge
Discussion
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hstewie said:
hstewie said: How long would you wait if it was you?
Are you confident you'd get it right every single time?
If you aren't, what should happen to you if and when you get it wrong?
Every situation is different of course but you can't shoot someone in the back while they run away or are in cuffs on the ground. You shouldn't be taking a life unless yours is in immediate danger IMHO. Are you confident you'd get it right every single time?
If you aren't, what should happen to you if and when you get it wrong?
Would I get it right all the time? I've honestly no idea but I'm not a trained armed officer. They should get it right, hence their constant training/testing regime. If they aren't upto it then they should be removed from that duty.
I'm very pro police but I still feel they should be open to scrutiny and prosecution if things are done wrongly. You can't have a society where police are judge, jury and executioner.
Devil2575 said:
jimmybobby said:
I for one watched all the nonsense in America with interest. All this #Blacklivesmatter. From what I have seen and read in almost every case the person shot or killed it was justified.
Really?http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-32213482
461 deemed justified by FBI in 2013.
27 Police Officers killed in the line of duty the same year.
Around 20 unjustified civilian deaths for every officer killed in line of duty.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/eugene-robi...
Death by Cop numbers are rising rapidly over last decade
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2014/11/...
Also "What American Police could learn from British Bobbies"
https://www.bostonglobe.com/news/world/2015/06/11/...
Edited by Martin4x4 on Monday 6th July 21:03
Martin4x4 said:
Devil2575 said:
jimmybobby said:
I for one watched all the nonsense in America with interest. All this #Blacklivesmatter. From what I have seen and read in almost every case the person shot or killed it was justified.
Really?http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-32213482
461 deemed justified by FBI in 2013.
27 Police Officers killed in the line of duty the same year.
Around 20 unjustified civilian deaths for every officer killed in line of duty.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/eugene-robi...
Death by Cop numbers are rising rapidly over last decade
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2014/11/...
Also "What American Police could learn from British Bobbies"
https://www.bostonglobe.com/news/world/2015/06/11/...
Edited by Martin4x4 on Monday 6th July 21:03
That said I stand by my statement that in a vast majority of the cases those shot have brought it on themselves.
You cannot run around screaming black lives matter and accusing police of being trigger happy black murdering racists and then continue to behave like idiots and give the police a reason to shoot you by fighting with officers or threatening them.
I feel very little sympathy for someone who commits a crime and then not only refuses to face the consequences of their actions but when action is taken to enforce punishment they fight and resent or blame the police.
jimmybobby said:
Devil2575 said:
jimmybobby said:
I for one watched all the nonsense in America with interest. All this #Blacklivesmatter. From what I have seen and read in almost every case the person shot or killed it was justified.
Really?http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-32213482
Edited by Devil2575 on Monday 6th July 11:41
In the case above the guy assaults the officer before running off. I do not agree with the officer shooting him in the back however but we still dont know all the details.
Eclassy said:
jimmybobby said:
In the case above the guy assaults the officer before running off. I do not agree with the officer shooting him in the back however but we still dont know all the details.
Hope you are jokingAre you a policeman? There is a video out there. Walter struggled with the officer after he had been tasered, we see the officer shoot the man several times as he runs away, we see the officer planting the taser, we see them administer no first aid and you claim we still dont know all the details. Newsflash! the officer was charged with first degree murder. I can see why you think #blacklivesmatter is all nonsense
When Slager fired his gun, Scott seemed to be 15 to 20 feet (5 to 6 m) away and fleeing. In the report of the shooting, filed before the video surfaced, Slager said he had feared for his life because Scott had taken his Taser, and that he shot Scott because he "felt threatened".
Devil2575 said:
jimmybobby said:
Devil2575 said:
jimmybobby said:
I for one watched all the nonsense in America with interest. All this #Blacklivesmatter. From what I have seen and read in almost every case the person shot or killed it was justified.
Really?http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-32213482
Edited by Devil2575 on Monday 6th July 11:41
In the case above the guy assaults the officer before running off. I do not agree with the officer shooting him in the back however but we still dont know all the details.
Not every case is the fault of the person shot but in many cases they give rise to the action taken. American cops are rather trigger happy that cannot be denied but when you see the situations they are faced with on a day to day basis you cannot blame them.
I watched a video the other day of two officer who were called to a domestic dispute. They pulled over a pick up and one of the officers approached the driver.
In the video you see him ask the driver who seems relatively placid and calm to keep his hands where the officer could see them and went to open the car door at which point the person in the pickup grabbed the gun in his lap and shot at the officer and his colleague at pretty much point blank range.
He hit both officers somehow, one in the shoulder and chest and the other in the hand and somewhere else. Handily in the ensuing gunfight the shooter was hit and ended up dying.
You watch a video like that and you are left with little doubt as to why they are so trigger happy as the most normal and safe situation can become life or death so fast its unreal.
Edited by jimmybobby on Monday 6th July 23:43
Edited by jimmybobby on Monday 6th July 23:45
Martin4x4 said:
Also "What American Police could learn from British Bobbies"
In 1977, the City of London Police set up a permanently armed unit to patrol the City. I was in the first lot and we all accepted that we had a lot to learn. Edited by Martin4x4 on Monday 6th July 21:03
We went to other forces to see what they did and Essex was particularly impressive. One of the blokes there was later shot and killed on a simple stop.
Just north of the City, in Shoreditch, was a Met firearms training centre and we went there to learn from the Met officers and use their facilities.
They had a mock-up of a house for training on entries. Every time we went in we failed in our targets when we followed our directions and we were treated to a military unit demonstrating their entry methods. I was apparent that we would not reach such levels of expertise (not to mention firepower and explosives) so we concentrated on what we saw our function was.
Three officers from the FBI came over and attended Shoreditch to have a look at the Met training and to give advice. They were not firearm specialists, just basic FBI operatives [whatever], and asked if they could try the house entry on a hostage taking scenario.
This little skit was old style training where there was never a satisfactory outcome and there were so many variables.
With just a plan of the scene the three blokes went in using a method we'd not seen before: One either side of the door and the third lying on the floor, drawn gun pointing at the door.
The door went in, two went from room 1 to room 2 before room 1 had been cleared. There were some shots and then the hostage was 'secured'. Those in the rooms that hadn't been 'neutralised', ie killed, were then offered the opportunity to surrender but as this was not possible with the set up they were all shot dead.
These were just normal FBI agents. They were experienced but had more or less the same training as everyone else.
There's a lot the British police could learn from the Americans.
We should not judge all police in the USA from such incidents as are reported. Some of these have as much training as a PCSO before they are let out on the streets with a gun.
Policing in the USA is multi level and some are very professional. Many are put into situations that would terrify me. And this on a weekly basis.
We had a Washington DC police sergeant stay with us for a few days and she told us that their cars went three up, one to deal with the stop, one to cover the ground level and another, normally her as she was such a good shot and had 20:20 vision, to cover the roofs with a high-powered rifle.
My feeling is that much of the policing in the USA is done on the cheap and therefore you get what you pay for. Pay peanuts and then give them a gun and authority: what could go wrong?
Many American police forces could learn from other American police forces.
I have been impressed by the expertise, not to mention stories, of American FBI agents I've met and those of other types of forces who work in big cities, or at least those willing to spend a few dollars on training.
Interview with the chap http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3174455/Th...
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