Iphone4 Dead After 3 years

[Alucidnation]

Morning all.

We have had an iPhone4 for approx three years, and we have the problem of the lock button not working (easy to get around using accessibility), but now the phone screen has gone black and will not display anything.

The phone was bought on a 2 year contract from an o2 store.

After speaking with Apple, they suggested i contacted o2 which i did, and they said that it would have to be repaired and i would need to pay for this.

Now, I'm not all that clued up on all things legal, however, i was under the impression that we had up to 6 years to expect a purchase to last for and can somehow be reimbursed for repair costs etc?

02 have basically washed their hands of it saying that a £500 found is only designed to last for the length of the contract.

Any help appreciated as i really am not sure where i stand with this, or even where to look!

Thanks!

[bompey]

Not sure where you get 6 years from but best bet is to try selling as broken on ebay and get a new contract.

[Alucidnation]

The 6 years was some consumer law but I have just found it and it appears I misunderstood it.

Sooooooo, yes, time for a new phone.

As you were!!

[JustinP1]

bompey said:

Not sure where you get 6 years from but best bet is to try selling as broken on ebay and get a new contract.

I would suggest it comes from the Sale of Goods Act 1979.

In short, an item should be 'sufficiently durable'.

The factors are what the item is, and its value. So, for example a £5.99 Casio would be seen differently to a Rolex if both died after 4 years for example.

There is a 6 year limit on which claims can be made, your claim is to the retailer in that the item was not durable, being a £500 item should last more than three years.

ETA - Before you scrap your phone. Currys last month repaired a 4 year old TV for me. For free.

[rallycross]

Apple warranty is only 12 monhts.

I think it did well to last 2 years! Both of ours were approx. 18 months old when they stopped working (never been dropped or damaged).

Vodafone not interested in repair wanted me to sign a new contract and get a new phone inclusive, went to Apple store they could tell me the main board was faulty, with no repair option but would replace for another i4s, reduced rate of £159 - but would not offer contribution to a newer model, also replacement only had warranty for 3 months even though new.

[G-Rich]

Your local iPhone repair person (usually a child af about 12) will charge about £100 for a new screen/digitiser including fitting - they will probably chuck in the lock button fix for free. Don't bother getting O2 or CPW to repair, it will end up costing double.

Unfortunately these technologies are not built to last, and even if you could persuade them that 4 years was an inadequate lifespan for such a device, they would probably inspect the phone and have you on a 'reasonable wear and tear' clause anyway,

[CYMR0]

Lots of repairers in markets, small stores, etc. A new screen is about £50, a new lock button is about £30.

Not cheap but not a fortune either and it wouldn't write the phone off necessarily.

[JustinP1]

OP - as I said before, speak to the right people, and say the magic words and the repair will cost you nowt.

In my case (although is was a long story why) I ended up with a BACS payment for what I paid for the TV 4 years ago.

[Alucidnation]

Thanks everyone for the help.

I guess if it costs 100 odd pounds to repair its worth it, as it is in perfect condition and worked fine.

I'll then go down the route of claiming back the costs via the soga.

Is there any type of claim form I use?

[G-Rich]

JustinP1 said:

OP - as I said before, speak to the right people, and say the magic words and the repair will cost you nowt.

In my case (although is was a long story why) I ended up with a BACS payment for what I paid for the TV 4 years ago.

I think for a TV that sits in the corner of a room for 4 years, you are well within a position to argue SOGA for sufficient durability. With a mobile deice it's somewhat different, very difficult to prove no impact shock, water intrusion, pocket fluff, or anything else hasn't damaged the device over 3 years.

[JustinP1]

Alucidnation said:

Thanks everyone for the help.

I guess if it costs 100 odd pounds to repair its worth it, as it is in perfect condition and worked fine.

I'll then go down the route of claiming back the costs via the soga.

Is there any type of claim form I use?

Whoa, whoa whoa Sweet Child of Mine!

You need to put that to the retailer and give them the chance to provide the solution. Otherwise your claim will fail.

In terms of Currys, they first of all offered me an 'out of warranty repair' and I let the operative explain the terms. £95 plus cost price of parts.

All I had to do as use the magic SoGA words and that changed to the TV being repaired for free. The definition of what would be repaired for free would be if the repair would have been covered by the manufacturers warranty.

If the repair is not economic, they have other legal options, including giving you a partial refund.

[Alucidnation]

JustinP1 said:

Alucidnation said:

Thanks everyone for the help.

I guess if it costs 100 odd pounds to repair its worth it, as it is in perfect condition and worked fine.

I'll then go down the route of claiming back the costs via the soga.

Is there any type of claim form I use?

Whoa, whoa whoa Sweet Child of Mine!

You need to put that to the retailer and give them the chance to provide the solution. Otherwise your claim will fail.

In terms of Currys, they first of all offered me an 'out of warranty repair' and I let the operative explain the terms. £95 plus cost price of parts.

All I had to do as use the magic SoGA words and that changed to the TV being repaired for free. The definition of what would be repaired for free would be if the repair would have been covered by the manufacturers warranty.

If the repair is not economic, they have other legal options, including giving you a partial refund.

Ah, ok thanks.

I think my best course of action then, is to go into the store and see what solutions they have.

[JustinP1]

Alucidnation said:

JustinP1 said:

Alucidnation said:

Thanks everyone for the help.

I guess if it costs 100 odd pounds to repair its worth it, as it is in perfect condition and worked fine.

I'll then go down the route of claiming back the costs via the soga.

Is there any type of claim form I use?

Whoa, whoa whoa Sweet Child of Mine!

You need to put that to the retailer and give them the chance to provide the solution. Otherwise your claim will fail.

In terms of Currys, they first of all offered me an 'out of warranty repair' and I let the operative explain the terms. £95 plus cost price of parts.

All I had to do as use the magic SoGA words and that changed to the TV being repaired for free. The definition of what would be repaired for free would be if the repair would have been covered by the manufacturers warranty.

If the repair is not economic, they have other legal options, including giving you a partial refund.

Ah, ok thanks.

I think my best course of action then, is to go into the store and see what solutions they have.

Don't be put off by the first monkey who wants to sell you a new phone, or failing that wants to make you pay for a repair.

Do some research on consumer law, so you are versed with the right things to say.

The endgame of this matter is that in 6 months time the retailer is in court and that their case is the £500 item they sold should only last 3 years - whilst paying all their own court costs. That won't happen. Just hang in there.

[rallycross]

Some cuckoo advice on here go and visit your apple store then buy a new phone!

[Sheepshanks]

Alucidnation said:

Morning all.

We have had an iPhone4 for approx three years,

We had one fail at 16months, with a known fault (the voice chip de-solders so people can't hear the caller talking).

I've had success with all sorts of stuff before (including getting a home visit to replace a near 3yr old - but 1yr warranty - Dell laptop screen) but I got absolutely nowhere with Apple or the provider (Orange in this case). The legal position is extremely unclear as the 'phone didn't have a specific cost attached to it.

It really annoys me that Apple are inconsistent - you hear of people being asked to pay, then at the point of paying Apple waive the charge. But others have the money taken off them.

[JustinP1]

rallycross said:

Some cuckoo advice on here go and visit your apple store then buy a new phone!

Looking for the 'Not sure is serious' meme....

[Sheepshanks]

JustinP1 said:

In terms of Currys, they first of all offered me an 'out of warranty repair' and I let the operative explain the terms. £95 plus cost price of parts.

All I had to do as use the magic SoGA words and that changed to the TV being repaired for free. The definition of what would be repaired for free would be if the repair would have been covered by the manufacturers warranty.

If they play hardball then you're stuffed - after 6 months you could be asked to prove the fault is caused by a manufacturing defect. How do you do that? SoGA says goods should last a certain amount of time - but does not say that they shouldn't need repairing at the owners expense in that time.

I had this with Halfords and a failed TomTom - "prove it has a manufacturing defect or was faulty at time of sale". They even lied to me in their answers and breached the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations which (unlike SoGA) is a criminal offence. In the end I emailed the CEO's office of TomTom and they sorted it ( the normal route into TomTom had failed at first too, hence I'd gone to Halfords).

Edited by Sheepshanks on Friday 5th September 14:01

[rallycross]

JustinP1 said:

rallycross said:

Some cuckoo advice on here go and visit your apple store then buy a new phone!

Looking for the 'Not sure is serious' meme....

Quite serious, iphone4 and 5 have a one year manufacturers warranty, they used to be quite generous with warranty work/replacements but not anymore. No point trying to repair a 4 yr old iphone its already at the end of its life.

[anonymous-user]

JustinP1 said:

Alucidnation said:

Thanks everyone for the help.

I guess if it costs 100 odd pounds to repair its worth it, as it is in perfect condition and worked fine.

I'll then go down the route of claiming back the costs via the soga.

Is there any type of claim form I use?

Whoa, whoa whoa Sweet Child of Mine!

You need to put that to the retailer and give them the chance to provide the solution. Otherwise your claim will fail.

In terms of Currys, they first of all offered me an 'out of warranty repair' and I let the operative explain the terms. £95 plus cost price of parts.

All I had to do as use the magic SoGA words and that changed to the TV being repaired for free. The definition of what would be repaired for free would be if the repair would have been covered by the manufacturers warranty.

If the repair is not economic, they have other legal options, including giving you a partial refund.

"Otherwise" might suggest that if the suggested step is followed, the claim will succeed. I doubt it.

It's a mistake to compare what one retailer may offer with what another will do to discharge its legal obligations.

When you buy something you get a warranty that it *is* (ie at the time of the contract - the sale) of "satisfactory quality". Durability is an aspect of quality, but that is not the same as saying that something has to last forever, or even a specific or particular period of time. The sooner after the sale something breaks, the easier it may be to infer that it was not of satisfactory quality when it was supplied. Three years is on any view a long time. The fact that many other people have iphones that have lasted this long suggests that at least in part the failure *may* be due to the way you've handled it. At least, if you were to go to a small claims court, that's what the retailer could fire at you.

BTW, this is from the Trading Standards website, under the "consumers" section:

"Q. I bought a fridge/freezer 18 months ago and the freezer section has completely failed. I went back to the shop, but they refused to do anything as it was outside the original 12 month guarantee. What are my rights?
A. If the time limit has expired on the guarantee, you cannot make a claim. However, if you can show that the goods were not of satisfactory quality at the time of sale then you may have a claim against the trader under the Sale of Goods Act 1979. See the 'Buying goods - your rights' leaflet for more information."

[JustinP1]

Sheepshanks said:

JustinP1 said:

In terms of Currys, they first of all offered me an 'out of warranty repair' and I let the operative explain the terms. £95 plus cost price of parts.

All I had to do as use the magic SoGA words and that changed to the TV being repaired for free. The definition of what would be repaired for free would be if the repair would have been covered by the manufacturers warranty.

If they play hardball then you're stuffed - after 6 months you could be asked to prove the fault is caused by a manufacturing defect. How do you do that? SoGA says goods should last a certain amount of time - but does not say that they shouldn't need repairing at the owners expense in that time.

I had this with Halfords and a failed TomTom - "prove it has a manufacturing defect or was faulty at time of sale". They even lied to me in their answers and breached the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations which (unlike SoGA) is a criminal offence. In the end I emailed the CEO's office of TomTom and they sorted it ( the normal route into TomTom had failed at first too, hence I'd gone to Halfords).

Edited by Sheepshanks on Friday 5th September 14:01

We've had very different experiences!

The endgame is as I have said is court. The claimant does not need to have cast iron proof - just on the 'balance of probabilities' that the issue was there at the time of purchase. By 'issue' I mean that the fault now relates to a design or component failing prematurely, thus the produce is not 'durable' in the eyes of the Act.

The retailer can stamp their feet as much as they want. It's a different story when the threat of court papers arrive.

As I said in my first response, it's a matter of who you deal with and what you say. In the last few years, I've had at least two final written responses from companies I've dealt with as a consumer telling me to bugger off, only for that situation to reverse within 72 hours of court papers dropping at their head office.

As I mentioned though, you shouldn't have to go that far - Currys and DSG get slated a lot but I was genuinely surprised that they were upholding the SoGA in a reasonable way without any pressure.